Wilkins (and Davis) Vs. The Replacements | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Wilkins (and Davis) Vs. The Replacements

phinsforlife

phinsforlife

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Two Issues:

-How is the replace Wilkins with the committee approach going vs what Wilkins gave us (not to mention his leadership, toughness and energy)?

-Were the Dolphins right to let him go? Same for Rob Hunt? It is not like they didn't have the money, they just elected to spend it on players like Tua, Ramsey, Tyreek, and Waddle for example. I know it is easy to say "I am not paying a DT or guard that kind of money." But you could also say I am not paying a limited and injury prone QB that kind of money, or an old CB or WR that kind of money. Nothing happens in a vacuum, you need to look at the mosaic, which are the results, and ask is the team better or worse. We don't know the answer for certain, yet, time will tell.

PFF gives Jones (Benito) a dismal 36.6 grade as a run defender so far this season, 12th worst among 117 NFL defensive linemen and worst among 22 Dolphins defensive players. Meanwhile, PFF ranks Brandon Pili 20th among 22 Dolphins defensive players as a run defender, with a poor grade of 51.8. By comparison, Davis — who left for the Colts on a two-year, $14 million deal — is ranked 33rd among 117 defensive linemen as a run defender this season, with a grade of 61.3.
But Wilkins — who left for the Raiders this past offseason — remains elite as a run stopper, ranking seventh overall.

Christian Wilkins is playing at an elite level. He's 3rd in run stop win rate at 46%. He's also 3rd in pass rush win rate.

Read more at: https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/nfl/miami-dolphins/article293146004.html#storylink=cpy
 
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phinsforlife said:
Two Issues:

-How is the replace Wilkins with the committee approach going vs what Wilkins gave us (not to mention his leadership, toughness and energy)?

-Were the Dolphins right to let him go? Same for Rob Hunt? It is not like they didn't have the money, they just elected to spend it on players like Tua, Ramsey, Tyreek, and Waddle for example. I know it is easy to say "I am not paying a DT or guard that kind of money." But you could also say I am not paying a limited and injury prone QB that kind of money, or an old CB or WR that kind of money. Nothing happens in a vacuum, you need to look at the mosaic, which is the results and is the team better or worse. We don't know the answer for certain, yet, time will tell

PFF gives Jones (Benito) a dismal 36.6 grade as a run defender so far this season, 12th worst among 117 NFL defensive linemen and worst among 22 Dolphins defensive players. Meanwhile, PFF ranks Brandon Pili 20th among 22 Dolphins defensive players as a run defender, with a poor grade of 51.8. By comparison, Davis — who left for the Colts on a two-year, $14 million deal — is ranked 33rd among 117 defensive linemen as a run defender this season, with a grade of 61.3.
But Wilkins — who left for the Raiders this past offseason — remains elite as a run stopper, ranking seventh overall.

Christian Wilkins is playing at an elite level. He's 3rd in run stop win rate at 46%. He's also 3rd in pass rush win rate.

Read more at: https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/nfl/miami-dolphins/article293146004.html#storylink=cpy
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Wilkins was a beast for us and HEALTHY. He is going to be hard to replace on the cheap which is what we are trying to do.
 
It’s actually not too early to discuss - strategically, letting CW go was 100% the right move and Robert Hunt probably as well.

You don’t spent that kind of money on Wilkins. He was a stat machine for sure, and a nice player, but he wasn’t a top3 gamechanger… he fell in with a big group of “good player but I’m not game planning around them”.

Robert Hunt got way too much money too, but the problem is Miami did not invest in OL - ever. And there are dudes on here parroting nonstop how the FO has a strategy around what they value blah blah. I’m not a genius but I can tell you invest in OL and QB and I can all but guarantee success.

Outside of Tua’s injury our OL is pure garbage. We are running worse than last season. We are not better in nearly any statistical measure.

This is so tired at this point. Tom Brady won a Super Bowl with Dieon Branch and KC has done excellent without Hill.

It’s been discussed so much already but the GM (and maybe the coach) foundationally ****ed up this roster build.

You have ONLY skill players getting paid and OL, which is the second most important unit after QB, is not only underdeveloped, but a big weak spot in CG’s talent acquisition abilities.

Maybe part of the issue isn’t actually they are purposely avoiding the OL, but simply that CG just cannot identify how to build it.

Chris seems like a great guy, team player, good communicator, humble enough to bring in outside help like Marvin Allen and Reggie McKenzie…

He’s just not good enough to be considered an elite GM.
 
I have no idea what it would have taken to re-sign Wilkins early. Some players have in their mind they want to see what they can get in free agency. I would much rather have him here, but I don't think we low balled him, nor can you force someone to accept a fair offer. The problem is that you know a poorly run organization is usually going to go full retard and way overpay (which justifies a player wanting to wait for free agency. This system sucks).
 
Atila said:
It’s actually not too early to discuss - strategically, letting CW go was 100% the right move and Robert Hunt probably as well.

You don’t spent that kind of money on Wilkins. He was a stat machine for sure, and a nice player, but he wasn’t a top3 gamechanger… he fell in with a big group of “good player but I’m not game planning around them”.

Robert Hunt got way too much money too, but the problem is Miami did not invest in OL - ever. And there are dudes on here parroting nonstop how the FO has a strategy around what they value blah blah. I’m not a genius but I can tell you invest in OL and QB and I can all but guarantee success.

Outside of Tua’s injury our OL is pure garbage. We are running worse than last season. We are not better in nearly any statistical measure.

This is so tired at this point. Tom Brady won a Super Bowl with Dieon Branch and KC has done excellent without Hill.

It’s been discussed so much already but the GM (and maybe the coach) foundationally ****ed up this roster build.

You have ONLY skill players getting paid and OL, which is the second most important unit after QB, is not only underdeveloped, but a big weak spot in CG’s talent acquisition abilities.

Maybe part of the issue isn’t actually they are purposely avoiding the OL, but simply that CG just cannot identify how to build it.

Chris seems like a great guy, team player, good communicator, humble enough to bring in outside help like Marvin Allen and Reggie McKenzie…

He’s just not good enough to be considered an elite GM.
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I agree Wilkins and Hunt didn’t make sense to sign for that kind of money. I miss Van Ginkel TBH
 
IMO, if you're not growing the talent you are drafting & keeping them once they've matured into being great or getting compensation for them before they have the opportunity to walk, then your organization is ran poorly.

But if the above is not logical, that it has to be opined as if I've just discovered some sort of fossil fuel to supplant petroleum, my world is turned upside down.

Of course something is wrong if you're out of position to pay the guy YOU SCOUTED, SPENT WHO KNOWS HOW MANY MAN-HOURS ON, LITERALLY DRAFTED & IS MATTER-OF-FACTLY REALLY FKING GOOD.

The only other solution to being that out of sync is to then be in a position to move that player for future draft revenue that will assist in supplanting the loss of talent.

It's not rocket science. We saw what may very well be the greatest dynasty ever ran in that way for how many years? They are our mortal enemies, division rivals. We had no choice but to pay attention.

It seemed like year in, year out the Pats were trading away very talented players they themselves acquired & bread & were trading them 2 years ahead of time for draft capital.

Yo, you know how disheartening it is to be sitting directly across the team that's winning SBs & still drafting twice in the 1st round?
 
Miami had no choice to let Wilkins, Davis, Hunt and Jones walk. The money they recieved was above what Miami was willing to pay. As for Van Ginkle, I was stunned, when the article came out last week; saying there was still hope he'd sign with Miami. They just didn't feel he was worth it. Which is disturbing. The guy would've allowed them to move on from Chubb and perhaps even more importantly not selecting, Chop Robinson.

Without Wilkins and Davis, Miami's run defense has taken a big hit, so far. It appears the replacements aren't up to the challenge. It's a good bet Miami will be looking to bring in reinforcements along the DLine next offseason vua the Draft and F/A. Build the trenches, is key to success on both sides of the ball.
 
Wilkins' ascendency was apparent, and should've been identified much earlier, and approached with a very respectful offer for extension. When he was into his last season here, the bus was already down the road.

Wilkins/Seiler was fun to watch. Miss it.

But I agree, its too early into this Dolphins campaign to put a bold line on the comparison...3 games is just too small a sample, but ya its not looking good.
 
dolfan91 said:
Miami had no choice to let Wilkins, Davis, Hunt and Jones walk. The money they recieved was above what Miami was willing to pay. As for Van Ginkle, I was stunned, when the article came out last week; saying there was still hope he'd sign with Miami. They just didn't feel he was worth it. Which is disturbing. The guy would've allowed them to move on from Chubb and perhaps even more importantly not selecting, Chop Robinson.

Without Wilkins and Davis, Miami's run defense has taken a big hit, so far. It appears the replacements aren't up to the challenge. It's a good bet Miami will be looking to bring in reinforcements along the DLine next offseason vua the Draft and F/A. Build the trenches, is key to success on both sides of the ball.
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It has only been three games but we are #12 in rushing yards allowed.

I know Wilkins was a good player that I hated to lose, but we haven't been terrible against the run.

Sometimes perceptions and narratives are not the reality.

Not sure what more you could ask in a new scheme. We weren't that great on defense early last season.
 
Mach2 said:
It has only been three games but we are #12 in rushing yards allowed.

I know Wilkins was a good player that I hated to lose, but we haven't been terrible against the run.

Sometimes perceptions and narratives are not the reality.

Not sure what more you could ask in a new scheme. We weren't that great on defense early last season.
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When you really think about it that is pretty good for as long as they have been on the field during games.
 
dolfan91 said:
Miami had no choice to let Wilkins, Davis, Hunt and Jones walk. The money they recieved was above what Miami was willing to pay. As for Van Ginkle, I was stunned, when the article came out last week; saying there was still hope he'd sign with Miami. They just didn't feel he was worth it. Which is disturbing. The guy would've allowed them to move on from Chubb and perhaps even more importantly not selecting, Chop Robinson.

Without Wilkins and Davis, Miami's run defense has taken a big hit, so far. It appears the replacements aren't up to the challenge. It's a good bet Miami will be looking to bring in reinforcements along the DLine next offseason vua the Draft and F/A. Build the trenches, is key to success on both sides of the ball.
Click to expand...

That's another sign thar your franchise is in trouble.

Any coach in his right mind would have 11 Van Ginkle's on his defense rather than a handful of stars.

Van Ginkle plays football in the form of Zach Thomas; unrelenting motor, no quit to speak of, no concern for his body.

Van Ginkle is what you show a star with an attitude problem & say to that star if you would just play with this much heart you'd be a 1st ballot hall of famer.
 
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