Winning & Losing : The Truth

If you aren’t trying to win you are in effect setting yourself up to lose?


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fansinceGWilson

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Five years after Brady was drafted every owner in the league should have been asking their scouting department and their GMs (if these people were still around) why they missed 5 separate times on this pick. Because whatever metrics the entire NFL was using to judge QBs at that time proved to be wrong.

That's one of the problems in the NFL -- there's no accountability to the scouts when they horribly miss on talent.
While that's true, there are mid/late round picks who far outperform higher round guys every year at multiple positions. Brady is just the most used example. That's part of any endeavor when humans are using judgement. But, fans need to remember even NE passed on Brady 5 times so it isn't as though they had superior scouts.
 

Rev Kev

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We had a former Patriots guy as GM hire a Patriots Head Coach who is bringing in lots of coaches with Patriots connections. So it is reasonable to assume we'll be using a mindset similar to that of the Patriots. And if there's one thing that Belichick has consistently done it is exploit the rules, loopholes, and lack of rigor in their enforcement to take advantage of the way the game is set up. He's the guy famous for stacking compensatory draft picks, borderline farcical last minute substitutions, ball pressure, cutting out the other team's mic connection with the sideline on crucial plays, etc., etc., etc. Yeah, if Belichick were rebuilding from scratch today he definitely would consider tanking to stack draft picks.

We guaranteed Coach Flores' salary for so long because we're stacking draft picks … and the technique is called tanking. The focus is to get a great QB, who, as Slimm has so eloquently pointed out, wasn't nearly as big of a deal back in Vince Lombardi's days when they predominantly ran the ball. The game changed. We're taking advantage of the rules. Let's hope it works.
Great post per usual Digital
 

Rev Kev

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Wow, lot of emotion here.

So you find a 1967 Corvette L88 Coupe in a barn, you buy it for $25,000., but you want to win now, read that to mean you want to take it to Barrett Jackson and "hope" for the best return on your 25k, so you put new tires on it, replace the hoses, get the engine running, and even though the engine has two dead holes, you merrily take the vehicle to the auction, where you are dismayed to find that your reserve isn't even close to being hit. So you take the car home, remove the factory engine and put in a GM crate engine, and clean up the interior a bit, and put an 8ball shift knob on it and hang fuzzy dice in the rear view mirror. You then have it shipped to Mecum in Vegas, annnnnnnd your reserve is not hit again.

OR, you take your barn find to a specialty Corvette restorer who then takes the whole vehicle apart, and restores it to a Documented, National Corvette Restorers Society’s specifications. Of course the restoration takes time and money, about 100k because the car was in worse condition than you thought. But after it is finished you take it, and the documentation to Amelia Island to show off, and to create some buzz in the "community". Now again all of this takes time and more money. So finally you consign with Barrett Jackson for the car to be presented on Sunday, annnnnd it goes for 4.2 Million. (I get this number from the last one in 2013 that sold for 3.4M).

The moral of the story, the Phins have been the first example for too many years, this roster is horrible, and the concept just trying to patch it up, and "if we just make it to the playoffs anything can happen" is stupid and short sighted.

I hope this is a Strategic rebuild, from the ground up, and if it is, then the team can reap the benefits of a long run of historical proportions.Winning needs to be strategic and not just tactical, in other words, trying to "win" by bringing in high priced free agents just does not work, and neither does hanging on to older under-productive players, it has to be for the "long game" and not just for this Sunday.

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This is well said. And yes there is emotion in this thread because how long do we have to wait to accept that winning is about winning at every detail of football and that is what has held this team back - we have not been greasy like the Pats.

Now we are going greasy and I believe we will win - the days of Shula and class are over -
 

fansinceGWilson

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I create the poll because there is a lack of intellectual honesty when it comes to posters

People hate the word tank and the tanking has only started with FA and cuts

Wait till we lose 10 straight

People say we aren’t in it to win but we won’t gamble our future to win it all either? We are in no position to gamble lol

The posture of this FO is preparing the fan base for losing - in the past 20 years we have tinkered a lot - even thought we were competitive in the division lol

We the AFCE have greased the Pats into the POs we are too blame for their success as much as anyone

Something had to change - Ross is an old fart

Trying to tank for no.1 overall is certainly different than tanking and allowing the pieces to fall where they may but if an organization isn’t out to win

They are going to let the chips fall they will coast through this season and maybe another

So if you are not attempting to put a product on the field

Then the self-fulling prophecy is certainly not far behind

Gase wanted to win and he is out

Your bookend just walked - he wasn’t great but he leaves a hole on the

Coach gets 5 year bubble - wha has he earned to get more than 3 - he has leverage because they are planning to rebuild from square one

Starting signed Qb gets no public praise that he is the starter

Word is he is being shopped lol

We will fail fast

Read the tea leaves
My first question is the definition of "win." Does that mean 'win now's or 'just win as much as possible with what we have?' If it means 'win now,' the FO wouldn't 'build' a team. They'd spend cap, wouldn't stockpile picks, and would get the best talent at every position NOW. Since no team does that, no team is trying to win
 

Birdmond

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I’m still looking at it as Miami lost Tannehill, James and Wake. Will we really notice their absence?

The coaching staff should be improved.

Don’t be surprised at all if this team wins between 5-8 games. I think I predicted 4 after the schedule came out but that was pre draft and before we sign post draft free agents.
 

Rev Kev

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Yes yes an
I’m still looking at it as Miami lost Tannehill, James and Wake. Will we really notice their absence?

The coaching staff should be improved.

Don’t be surprised at all if this team wins between 5-8 games. I think I predicted 4 after the schedule came out but that was pre draft and before we sign post draft free agents.
Yes we will miss them but Cam the most

And this is a 1 maybe 0 win team on paper

This is a critical tank job
 

McMichael

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I’m still looking at it as Miami lost Tannehill, James and Wake. Will we really notice their absence?

The coaching staff should be improved.

Don’t be surprised at all if this team wins between 5-8 games. I think I predicted 4 after the schedule came out but that was pre draft and before we sign post draft free agents.
I know some may think this crazy but after going down our schedule I honestly see 6 -8 wins with my guess being 7
 

Birdmond

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Yes yes an

Yes we will miss them but Cam the most

And this is a 1 maybe 0 win team on paper

This is a critical tank job
If they were that irreplaceable why did the offense and defense both suck?
 

Krush

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First all Cleveland isn't turned around yet,
teams with a good foundation always win because they have a system that the player they select must serve a purpose in the scheme of how the the team functions. Development is very lacking in Miami, every team has a Bellcow RB, WR, and a TE, Miami does not, and most importantly they do not have an Identity offensively or defensively, every year they are doing something different with players, when this stops then Miami will be consistent week in and week out.
 

fansinceGWilson

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While that's true, there are mid/late round picks who far outperform higher round guys every year at multiple positions. Brady is just the most used example. That's part of any endeavor when humans are using judgement. But, fans need to remember even NE passed on Brady 5 times so it isn't as though they had superior scouts.
Correct. But some like to claim only Miami has 'inept' scouts
 

Rev Kev

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If they were that irreplaceable why did the offense and defense both suck?
I did not say they were irreplaceable you did Are you incapable of reading??

Some people on the site will never get their collective heads around a team sport with 3 parts Offense Defence and ST comprised of individuals - all three have to click to win

However the fact is they removed or allowed three to walk and didn’t replace them with Jack - my opinion is that Cam was the best of the three

We were silent in FA because we are TANKING
 
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