WR and QB issues?

[dabeastdabone]

Seems every other post is about these two positions and IMO anyone worrying about either position should chill out. I personally am very happy with both, reasons:

WR:
The dolphins don't appear to lack WR's but have to many on the roster than could start! Seriously, if Cam and Bess would have started and played as a starter for 16 games both would have gone over 1000 yards and as far as I can tell Bess could have had (well over) 100 catches.

Is Hartline good enough to slide in there and take over? I don't know, my opinion is we know Bess does a outstanding job at it so why change that up. If Cam is still effected by his injury which appears possible, let he other guys fill in till he can compete at 100%, it's a long brutal NFL season any I'd bet we are going to have need for a healthy WR later in the season.

If I were itching to add Hartline in I do not understand why he isn't being talked about more for replacing or stealing reps from Ginn. From what they say he is fast enough to play the position and where as Bess and Cam have overachieved, Ginn has underachieved. As I see it Ginn is a starter based more on his salary and draft position than anything at this point. Maybe a stronger armed QB would change my opinion but for now thats it.

QB's:
Not a fan of Penny in the big scheme of things but all and all I don't see him as a negative. I just think the Dolphins need a big arm guy. Henne has looked good and has had nothing but praise from the coaches thus far. After 1 bad preseason game (in bad conditions I might add) a lot of people here are ready to run the guy off. I am beginning to blame a bit of this on Parcells for lighting the match when he drafted White, otherwise these boards (and all Dolphin fans) would be 100% behind Henne. I am excited about getting Henne in the mix and giving him 1st team time before formulating a opinion otherwise.

About White:
I didn't see a huge need to draft him but figured it was an OK move. White thus far is 4 - 10 with a QB rating of almost a whopping 9. Yeah he is a rookie but I don't think he has done anything to deserve being considered to surpassing Henne. Like I said above I think Parcells did himself no favors in the long run with the pick in creating a bit of a controversy, just wait till one starts and has a bad game or two.

In addition anyone pimping white might consider a couple things. First runnning QB's don't win Superbowls. Second is if White is QB you might as well waive that 1st round pick in Long because longs achilles heel is speed and when you have a running QB you need a very mobile line to "try" to keep up with a QB that is never where he is supposed to be.

 

[j-off-her-doll]

The dolphins don't appear to lack WR's but have to many on the roster than could start! Seriously, if Cam and Bess would have started and played as a starter for 16 games both would have gone over 1000 yards and as far as I can tell Bess could have had (well over) 100 catches.

Is Hartline good enough to slide in there and take over? I don't know, my opinion is we know Bess does a outstanding job at it so why change that up. If Cam is still effected by his injury which appears possible, let he other guys fill in till he can compete at 100%, it's a long brutal NFL season any I'd bet we are going to have need for a healthy WR later in the season.

If I were itching to add Hartline in I do not understand why he isn't being talked about more for replacing or stealing reps from Ginn. From what they say he is fast enough to play the position and where as Bess and Cam have overachieved, Ginn has underachieved. As I see it Ginn is a starter based more on his salary and draft position than anything at this point. Maybe a stronger armed QB would change my opinion but for now thats it.

Ginn draws more attention than any WR we have on the roster. Bess wouldn't get as open if he were opposite, say, Cam. Hartline seems like he has all the makings of a real #1. This season, he'll likely be our number two - and a very dangerous one. I wouldn't be surprised to see him as our primary WR in a year or two - with Ginn being an exceptional #2.

QB's:
Not a fan of Penny in the big scheme of things but all and all I don't see him as a negative. I just think the Dolphins need a big arm guy. Henne has looked good and has had nothing but praise from the coaches thus far. After 1 bad preseason game (in bad conditions I might add) a lot of people here are ready to run the guy off. I am beginning to blame a bit of this on Parcells for lighting the match when he drafted White, otherwise these boards (and all Dolphin fans) would be 100% behind Henne. I am excited about getting Henne in the mix and giving him 1st team time before formulating a opinion otherwise.

About White:
I didn't see a huge need to draft him but figured it was an OK move. White thus far is 4 - 10 with a QB rating of almost a whopping 9. Yeah he is a rookie but I don't think he has done anything to deserve being considered to surpassing Henne. Like I said above I think Parcells did himself no favors in the long run with the pick in creating a bit of a controversy, just wait till one starts and has a bad game or two.

In addition anyone pimping white might consider a couple things. First runnning QB's don't win Superbowls. Second is if White is QB you might as well waive that 1st round pick in Long because longs achilles heel is speed and when you have a running QB you need a very mobile line to "try" to keep up with a QB that is never where he is supposed to be.

Going into this preseason, I held strong to the opinion that Henne is our QB of the future and that White will be there to mix things up and eventually be a solid #2. I think he's looked better so far in the preseason. His poor numbers can largely be attributed to drops, and his pocket presence seems better. He looks more natural. I'm not putting too much weight into it - one way or the other - but I've been impressed by White.

 

[fishypete]

Seems every other post is about these two positions and IMO anyone worrying about either position should chill out. I personally am very happy with both, reasons:

WR:
The dolphins don't appear to lack WR's but have to many on the roster than could start! Seriously, if Cam and Bess would have started and played as a starter for 16 games both would have gone over 1000 yards and as far as I can tell Bess could have had (well over) 100 catches.

Is Hartline good enough to slide in there and take over? I don't know, my opinion is we know Bess does a outstanding job at it so why change that up. If Cam is still effected by his injury which appears possible, let he other guys fill in till he can compete at 100%, it's a long brutal NFL season any I'd bet we are going to have need for a healthy WR later in the season.

If I were itching to add Hartline in I do not understand why he isn't being talked about more for replacing or stealing reps from Ginn. From what they say he is fast enough to play the position and where as Bess and Cam have overachieved, Ginn has underachieved. As I see it Ginn is a starter based more on his salary and draft position than anything at this point. Maybe a stronger armed QB would change my opinion but for now thats it.

QB's:
Not a fan of Penny in the big scheme of things but all and all I don't see him as a negative. I just think the Dolphins need a big arm guy. Henne has looked good and has had nothing but praise from the coaches thus far. After 1 bad preseason game (in bad conditions I might add) a lot of people here are ready to run the guy off. I am beginning to blame a bit of this on Parcells for lighting the match when he drafted White, otherwise these boards (and all Dolphin fans) would be 100% behind Henne. I am excited about getting Henne in the mix and giving him 1st team time before formulating a opinion otherwise.

About White:
I didn't see a huge need to draft him but figured it was an OK move. White thus far is 4 - 10 with a QB rating of almost a whopping 9. Yeah he is a rookie but I don't think he has done anything to deserve being considered to surpassing Henne. Like I said above I think Parcells did himself no favors in the long run with the pick in creating a bit of a controversy, just wait till one starts and has a bad game or two.

In addition anyone pimping white might consider a couple things. First runnning QB's don't win Superbowls. Second is if White is QB you might as well waive that 1st round pick in Long because longs achilles heel is speed and when you have a running QB you need a very mobile line to "try" to keep up with a QB that is never where he is supposed to be.

First the Dolphins have good receivers...but not great receivers. To this point I have to agree that Ginn's status is solely due to the draft...and IMHO...he shouldn't have been drafted that high to begin with...he wasn't a top receiver out of college...again in fact...his claim to fame was mostly due to his returning ability. Drafting Ginn is like picking out a egg and hoping that the Golden goose that will lay the Golden eggs, comes out...well so far we have gotten both Goose'd and egg...on our faces.

As far as the QB...Pennington is, what he is...he's a very accurate QB that can get the job done...but with help. He needs the O-line and the receivers to do their jobs as well. Henne and White are Raw...one can't make an accurate evaluation on either of them unless you throw into the fire...either they will progress or they will burn.

 

[LANGER72]

Our QB's and Wr's will be fine. I am really concerned about how our secondary and LB's match up against teams that run the spread or 4-5 reciever sets.
That will be out achilles heel. Atlanta, Indy, and the Patriots use these formations.
Hopefully we can pressure when they minimum protection and get our licks in on the QB.
They will have to pay for the completions.

 

[Sirspud]

Our QB's and Wr's will be fine. I am really concerned about how our secondary and LB's match up against teams that run the spread or 4-5 reciever sets.
That will be out achilles heel. Atlanta, Indy, and the Patriots use these formations.
Hopefully we can pressure when they minimum protection and get our licks in on the QB.
They will have to pay for the completions.

Our pass defense was our achilles heel last year and it may be a while before Smith and Davis are experienced enough to really change that, although they should make some progress this year. I'm just happy that we were able to bring back Bell and Crowder who have their strong points so that we didn't have to spend draft picks or sign FA downgrades just to fill those positions, allowing us to infuse some much needed young talent to the secondary.

 

[Sirspud]

Seems every other post is about these two positions and IMO anyone worrying about either position should chill out. I personally am very happy with both, reasons:

WR:
The dolphins don't appear to lack WR's but have to many on the roster than could start! Seriously, if Cam and Bess would have started and played as a starter for 16 games both would have gone over 1000 yards and as far as I can tell Bess could have had (well over) 100 catches.

Is Hartline good enough to slide in there and take over? I don't know, my opinion is we know Bess does a outstanding job at it so why change that up. If Cam is still effected by his injury which appears possible, let he other guys fill in till he can compete at 100%, it's a long brutal NFL season any I'd bet we are going to have need for a healthy WR later in the season.

If I were itching to add Hartline in I do not understand why he isn't being talked about more for replacing or stealing reps from Ginn. From what they say he is fast enough to play the position and where as Bess and Cam have overachieved, Ginn has underachieved. As I see it Ginn is a starter based more on his salary and draft position than anything at this point. Maybe a stronger armed QB would change my opinion but for now thats it.

One thing you have to realize about catches is that it does not mean a receiver is a great one. Yes, its incredibly important for a receiver to catch the ball and yes, a receiver who can rack up catches like Cam or Bess will always have a role in an offense.

The problem is that neither Cam nor Bess can do all the things that a starting receiver should do. Cam is slow, Bess is small and while he is quick, he doesn't have elite speed either. There's only so many routes that they can really run effectively and the real problem is, other defenses know that. For as limited of a QB as the Dolphins have, he still has the ability to go deep if the opportunity presents itself. Unfortunately, neither Cam nor Bess really have a legitimate ability to go deep, or run certain routes. That's why even though they both could rack up tons of catches doing quick routes, underneath routes, and doing all sorts of things to keep the chains moving, you want them doing this in the capacity of a third receiver.
Having legitimate receivers who can run all the routes keeps the defense honest, which helps a lot when you're in a playoff game against the Ravens. An offense also can't always dink and dunk it's way down the field, and I will stretch again that it's more the limitations of our small and slower WR (and speedy Ginn's inconsistency) and as much our QB that could keep us from stretching the field when need be.

Two years ago, Mike Furrey had 98 catches for 1086 yards for the Lions, opposite Roy Williams. The Lions drafted Calvin Johnson the April after that, even though they had the talented Roy Williams and the productive (and cheap) Mike Furrey at receiver and countless needs elsewhere. This was partially because Johnson was too good to pass up, but what could he do better than the aforementioned Furrey? A lot of things that don't show up on the stat sheetl; he added an alternate dimension to the Lions offense by being able to do things that Furrey, while productive, couldn't do. Johnson had 1300 receiving yards this year while Furrey has started 12 games over the last two years and got signed by the Browns to be a backup receiver.

Using the Lions may not be the best example because they literally haven't won anything with the added dimension of Johnson, but it at least lets you know what NFL teams are thinking when a seemingly productive receiver gets pushed aside.