Wrong philosophy dooms this regime, and Fins for next 2-3 years.

[phinfreak]

Say what you want about Parcells. His (and Sparanos) philosophy is Bust.

This is not the brand of football played while Parcells molded his philosophy with the Giants, Jets, Dallas. This is the new NFL.

It's about speed, and more speed, not size. It's about the passing game, not 4 yards and a cloud of dust.

It's all about the QB...he needs to be a franchise passing machine, not a 'game manager' like Henne.

This is the era of the 'fast break offense'.

Saints, Patriots, Colts, Cincy, all flash these emerging attributes. The teams stuck in the 90's model of NFL will be boring, struggle to break into the upper echelon of teams.

Second tier teams that know this and are trying to get there, Vikings, Packers, Philly, Dallas, Broncos, Steelers struggling because they are transitioning into this model very painfully.

Look at the Bears, Jaguars, Bills, Dolphins, Browns, 49ers, Seahawks, etc. all still trying to shape their philosophy around the running game.

The fatal flaw in this regime is to think that you can last 16 games over powering your opponent. You might win 10 this way, but you'll go through player attrition due to injury far to great to sustain a winning product on the field.

Look at Fin injury list. Not a coincidence. This regime will run Ronnie Brown, Ricky Williams, and anyone else into early retirement.

This team lacks speed on D, across every single position, especially at LINEBACKER. Fins LB's are old mold, not the new athlete types.

Safety position is probably the most hybrid position on D. Fins lack athleticism at this position as well, both are middle of field positions, thus the D's propensity for giving up the big play when facing 'athletic' WR's.

What this team lacks is glaring, and obvious to every NFL head coach, and that is why the team consistently struggles against talent.

I hold Parcells, Sparano accountable for the collapse yesterday.

Now way any team can play motivated in this physical only style of play for 16 games, let alone 10.

Thus, we witness this lack luster performance from the players yesterday.

They had no juice left in the tank.

Wrong philosophy.

 

[Kdawg954]

They lack speed at LB? These guys inherited a 1-15 team that drafted poorly for years upon years.

It has only been TWO SEASONS. Some teams draft well but don't have the right coach in place . . . this is not the case with this team. This team was pretty much VOID of talent when the Trifecta came in . . . and u gotta start from scratch.

Before they came . . . our OLine was pathetic . . . our secondary (if u remember 2007) was a complete joke . . . we had no kind of answer at QB and our Dline was old as hell.

Now we have strengths at DE, we have 2 very young promising CB's, a young promising QB who has helped this team regroup from an 0-3 start . . . one of the best young OLine's in the league and we have a solid special teams unit all around.

And that is only after 2 season. The direction this offseason seems clear . . . . Linebackers and a big time #1 playmaker for Henne.

Parcells philosophy has worked, now we just need to finish this puzzle.

 

[phinfreak]

What you describe in your post underscores my Thread. I agree with the improvements you mention, some however are marginal, (read we are 7-8).

The problem I am pointing to isnt a level of improvement at the positions you mention, the fatal flaw is the philosophy of what we are building.

Please read my post again. The win by out physically your opponent is obsolete in todays NFL. At least if winning the superbowl is your goal.

Not to say you cant win with this regimes philosophy, but it will not be sustainable year after year. Too much parity in the league to think you can out muscle your opponent by jamming the ball running it down their throat and control the clock.

I point to Pats, Colts, Saints, style of play as the new NFL. And many teams are moving towards it. Vikings know it, thats why they pleaded for Favre.

The QB position is the Holy Grail in the NFL today. The QB has to be a player that can win the game i.e. Rothlisberger, Mannings, Brady's, Favre's, etc.

Look at what Marino did for this franchise! That type of player is what it will take for this team to get to and win a superbowl.

Sorry.

 

[NashPhin]

While I think you overstate the problem, there is some truth in this analysis. I have often wondered if Parcells' Giants teams from the 80's (particularly the ball control pounding offense) could keep pace with some of the fast break offenses of today.

However, I tend to look at the rebuilding effort from the standpoint that the overhaul first focused on the offensive and defensive lines and then will move outward. I don't see too many complaints right now about those units.

I think phase two will focus more on the more athletic, skilled units like wideout, TE, and defensive backfield. This phase started with the drafting of Smith and Davis and will continue this offseason.

My main concern at this point is the regime's dogged insistence to avoid "attitude" players at all costs. While I certainly don't want us to end up with divisive, me-first players, at some point, you have to have a guy like Brandon Marshall or Steve Smith to strike the fear into defenses.

Quiet superstars like Andre Johnson and Marvin Harrison are out there, but if you limit your search to players like this you are severely limiting the pool of talent you have to choose from.

I would love to see Pat White add some weight and learn to play some receiver ala Antwaan Randle-El. I think keeping White solely at QB this season has been a major mistake and has reduced his value to the team.

Just my two cents...

 

[RockyMtnPhinfan]

And the Giants 2008 with earth, wind and fire? That was balanced with an above average passing game- not great just above average. I think balance is what we need not some Cutler-esque gunslinger. I think Henne has the tools to become above average as his career get started. I think we are headed in the right direction. You really want to call for the coaching staff to be fired? Didn't we go through that for the past few years since Shula left?

 

[PATSSUCK]

Funny that you mentiob Rothlisberger as he was a game manager for his 1st year as was Brady. Those teams were stacked with talent already and they just grew into their roles. How do you know that Henne doesn't grow into a good QB with experience and added weaponary?

If you are waiting for the next Marino, you will be waiting a loooong time. Sorry

 

[jd13]

i agree with you that its now a passing league..but they did inherit a 1-15 team..i think they know they have to get henne more weapons..a big time wr and a te who can catch and have the speed to be a mismatch against linebackers..

 

[PerfectFinz72]

Once Henne gets more experience, I can actually see a change in philosophy in the near future.

 

[phinfreak]

And the Giants 2008 with earth, wind and fire? That was balanced with an above average passing game- not great just above average. I think balance is what we need not some Cutler-esque gunslinger. I think Henne has the tools to become above average as his career get started. I think we are headed in the right direction. You really want to call for the coaching staff to be fired? Didn't we go through that for the past few years since Shula left?

I dont think you can find anywhere in my post that I want this coaching staff fired, although we do need some changes there.

What I am discussing is that the philosophy is obsolete.

Case in point, Shula changed his game when he had the opportunity to draft Marino. Shula was cast in the 70's, 80's style of play of running the ball.

ONce he got Marino, look at what happened.

Today, we need to adapt to the new style of play, or we'll be catching up to yesterdays style while the upper echelon teams throw for 300+ yards a game and score in less than 2 minutes per drive.

Notice what the differentiators are from the elite teams and the second and third tier teams are. It is the QB, WR's, and team speed on D. Neither of which we have.

 

[finnns2000]

The wrong philosophy includes signing guys like Wilford, Green, or Wilson and drafting guys like White and Turner.

 

[Dredd1050]

Saints, Patriots, Colts, Cincy, all flash these emerging attributes. The teams stuck in the 90's model of NFL will be boring, struggle to break into the upper echelon of teams.

How many championships have these teams combined won in the last 10 years? 20? 30?

Bottom line is the teams that run the ball and stop the run win in this league. It's been that way from the beginning and will continue to be moving forward. The Philosophy is there, the players aren't. Miami doesn't have the players yet. Bottom line.

 

[phinfreak]

Funny that you mentiob Rothlisberger as he was a game manager for his 1st year as was Brady. Those teams were stacked with talent already and they just grew into their roles. How do you know that Henne doesn't grow into a good QB with experience and added weaponary?

If you are waiting for the next Marino, you will be waiting a loooong time. Sorry

Labeling Rothlisberger a 'game manager' is very debateable. He flashed early. In fact, what team was his opponent for his first start? Dolphins. He won that game too.

Henne is not a rookie like Rothlisberger was for his first start. Henne is in his second year under this regime, and performed good...and bad. No flash of franchise though.

The issue is philosophy and style of play. It's just not todays game. Regardless if Henne or Marino.

 

[phinfreak]

How many championships have these teams combined won in the last 10 years? 20? 30?

Bottom line is the teams that run the ball and stop the run win in this league. It's been that way from the beginning and will continue to be moving forward. The Philosophy is there, the players aren't. Miami doesn't have the players yet. Bottom line.

Are you sure you dont know the answer to your question above?!?

Havent the Colts, Pats, Steelers (with Rothlisberger) won the last umpteen Super Bowls?

Hasnt Favre slung his way to super bowls and championships?
Manning with the Giants THREW his way to winning against the PATS.
Arent the Cardinals better since the old man took over the snaps?

C'mon maan!

 

[CsonkaClone]

I disagree. The Phins were very close to beating the high flying Colts this year by employing the Parcells philosophy and that was with 2 rookie CB's and slow *** LB's.

The Bengals have been winning with a smash-mouth game plan all season. They have a huge o-line and a north-south running game.
Of course they do have an elite wide-out in Ocho and a good veteran QB in Palmer. But they also have a very good young defense.

I say Defense...Defense..and more Defense in the draft and we'll be heading in the right direction.

 

[phinfreak]

I disagree. The Phins were very close to beating the high flying Colts this year by employing the Parcells philosophy and that was with 2 rookie CB's and slow *** LB's.

The Bengals have been winning with a smash-mouth game plan all season. They have a huge o-line and a north-south running game.
Of course they do have an elite wide-out in Ocho and a good veteran QB in Palmer. But they also have a very good young defense.

I say Defense...Defense..and more Defense in the draft and we'll be heading in the right direction.

Close doesnt count! You play to win the game!

Colts beat us with the 'new style' I am talking about. They've been dominating the league with this 'new style' for almost a decade. And when they havent, it has been the Patriots with Brady. And when not the Patriots its been the Steelers, and when not the Steelers, its been place the name of another fanchise QB with a passing attack here.

Cincy is not winning by running the ball. They are winning via the passing game. The improvement in Cincy has been their D, but they score via the pass.

Please note, they have a franchise QB and franchise WR. None of which we have.