Discussion in 'NFL Draft Forum' started by j-off-her-doll, May 9, 2014.
"When you draft for need in 2014, you'll be drafting for need in 2015" couldn't agree more. What's even more baffling is that this team has been doing the same ****ing thing for 15+ years (with an odd exception now and then) and the people running the show can't seem to figure this out. It's not rocket science, but I'm starting to realize football GM's aren't rocket scientists either (thankfully).
Miami was going to pick for need in 2015 regardless of who they picked last night. I find that statement irrelevant. However, they won't need to pick a right tackle in 2015.
There's a few reasons why I don't find it necessary to bash the pick:
1. There's needs, and then there's absolute, desperate, must have in order to field a unit needs. This situation was the latter. It's not as if Miami needed an upgrade at right tackle. They didn't even have a capable body there.
2. They just allowed a team record 58 sacks. Largely due to the lack of a capable body at RT that I just mentioned.
3. It's not a situation where Miami was picking in the top 10 and passed up better players at impact positions to select an offensive lineman. It was the 19th pick and all the elite talent at impact positions were gone.
4. The fit. James is absolutely out of central casting for what Miami wants to do up front.
5. Ja'Wuan James can play.
The way I look at it, we can talk about value, trading down, whether this player would've been available 3 picks later, etc. But the fact is, none of you really care about that anyway. If James busts, you're not going to care that Miami traded down and acquired an extra 3rd rounder to get him. Just like you won't care that Miami took him at #19 if he's in the pro-bowl one or two times and has a fine 10 year career.
Martin, Mosley, and Shazier were all gone... he went with his board and stuck with it
I love how all these bloggers say he's a good player, at our biggest position if need, and than bash the pick.
The only player in the draft drafted after us so far, that I would of considered, was cooks. And when I really think about who is left in this draft to play RT, yeah, taking James makes a whole lot of sense.
I don't know. I think I care that the extra pick we could have gotten could have been used to trade up higher in the 2nd round to get a Lee, Robinson, or Su'a-Filo. Maybe that extra 3rd could have been used on a Jeremy Hill or Moncrief. And I think I'm going to care 3 years from now as well when we're still drafting for need.
The issue I have is that there were no other O linemen taken in the first after James. That suggests to me there was opportunity to move back and still get him. When you need as many resources as you can muster it's foolish not to take them. I like James. I'd like him a whole lot better at 25 with another 3rd rd pick.
Still a boat load of WRs on the board and Jace Amaro is still out there and I thought for sure the Patriots would have taken him. I don't know how many players the Patriots are going to draft from Florida but none of them have been any good except for the murderer.
I agree with this
I suppose my point is that if James turns out to be a good player, you're not going to care that Miami took him at #19 instead of #25. I just don't think I'll read that anywhere 3 years from now. If he busts, you may just have a talking point in regards to trading down and acquiring an extra 3rd... but that's not going to be what you care about. You're going to be steaming again because the pick busted. Not because of the trade down that didn't happen.
If that extra 2nd or 3rd rounder busted then it was all for not anyway. Miami should have a shot at around 3 of those guys you just mentioned anyway with their next pick.
Oh I agree, I just really like cooks. rare to see that kind of speed, with good hands and route running ability. I actually had lee as my top choice at 19, didn't realize his hands were so questionable, which philbin since his green bay days has been known to not let any WR on the field with bad hands, even jordy sat for years because of that, so I'm ok passing on lee.
I actually think well target one of the guards, and possible a TE on day 2. Possibly even trade up for one. This oline nonsense needs to stop already, and I'd have to think Lazor wants a real TE for his offense.
You're both right. Hickey's draft strategy deserves scrutiny, but ultimately what matters is whether or not James turns out to be a top flight RT.
what's going on slimm. been a while ... again. draft time is here again and the dolphins predictably reach for need. i'm okay with it because shazier and lewan were gone but i'm surprised to hear you say this especially considering this quote from a few threads up:
'I'd just expect the Dolphins to botch the pick regardless. I'd expect them to pick some run-of-the-mill right tackle or guard that they can pencil in as a "starter" due to the incompetence and/or absence of their past decisions at tackle/guard and try to sell it off as a great pick like they always do.'
once again, assuming the dolphins did the same old mediocre thing they always do and take the 5th best OT prospect at 19 overall, you were right. so are you not mad because this was predictably dumb or do you like james that much as a prospect? i like him fine ... in the 2nd or 3rd round. narrow frame, inconsistent footwork, questionable run blocking and effort, functional strength that needs to improve. looks like he may be better suited for the left side.
i guess my question is do you like this better than say moses in the 2nd, or fleming in the 3rd, or turner in the 4th, or hurst in the 5th, or lucas in the 6th, or even henderson in the 7th? granted we still might do one of these things, but i'd rather all those scenarios rather than what we did. personally, i would have taken the trade we all know the saints offered and grabbed sua filo and walked away with a free pick. i'm curious to see what you would have done and why you aren't more crotchety over this latest brick.
The quote you are referring to was in the context of Miami passing up a player like Shazier or Kyle Fuller to select an offensive tackle just for the sake of penciling him in as a starter. Miami obviously didn't have that opportunity because they were already gone. I'd disagree also that James possesses all those flaws.
that's exactly why i'm not as mad as i would've been had shazier been there. but even so - you called it and we did it. again.
i guess i will walk away assuming you think we did the best thing for this organization at 19 ...
Although I agree, I would love another pick and to trade down. However, you assume that someone wanted to trade with us and that no one else wanted James.
What that suggests to me is that no other GMs picking after us valued the other linemen as high, nor did they need linemen.