M. Trestman : Why Not???...

[BLITZKRIEG]

Inlight of the retiring of RW, and the loss of WR D. Boston, should Dave consider letting QB / AHC M. Trestman run the Phinz offense in 2004???...

I think it might be a wise idea....Here's why.

M. Trestman was the OC the season the Raiders made their impressive SB run just a couple of seasons ago. He was the man who turned a reletively non-existant offense, into a pass happy, and very dangerous unit. He did it with old talent as well with Gannon / Brown / Rice....

They had no running game to speak of that season, and QB R. Gannon was forced to lead this offense through the air. Needless to say it worked, and it worked well. Well enough to represent the AFC Conference in the SB...

I see very similar traits between that Raiders team and the 2004 Phinz. We've got a RB by committee, and a decent core of WR's to utilize. The OL isn't stellar, but should be good enough to help us maintain drives. The key is how do we utilize the talent we have, and how do we keep defenses honest???...

I think we bring in a couple of solid veteran WR's, without trading away O-Gun, and let Trestman work his Oakland magic on offense. The Phinz must throw the ball to offset the run in 2004, and he's proven he can spread an offense and make it work with a very limited running attack. That's what we have now that Ricky is gone....

I know many fans will say that it's more important to have a balanced offense, but right now, we'll need to throw the ball in order to set up the run IMO. M. Trestman could make our offense more dangerous if he's given the chance to call the plays IMO. He knows how to utinlize the talent we have IMO. Moreso than Foerster at least....

Just an opinion. Any thought's on this???....

PHINZ RULE!!! :fire:

 

[KB21]

Absolutely not!

I don't mind Trestman working with the quarterbacks, but he needs to keep his hands off the offense.

That Raiders' team had a tailback in Charlie Garner who was averaging 5.3 yards per pop on the ground, and Trestman completely ignored him within the offense. The games that Oakland lost that season were because they completely ignored the ground game in an effort to overutilize a ball control passing attack.

Chris Forester has no experience as an offensive coordinator, but he does come from offenses that do not neglect the running back within the offense.

Trestman has experience, but his offenses at every stop along the way have been completely one dimensional towards the passing game. Trestman neglects balance on offense, and he underutilizes the tailbacks.

 

[rhadaddy]

I wouldn't because,

Absolutely not!

I don't mind Trestman working with the quarterbacks, but he needs to keep his hands off the offense.

That Raiders' team had a tailback in Charlie Garner who was averaging 5.3 yards per pop on the ground, and Trestman completely ignored him within the offense. The games that Oakland lost that season were because they completely ignored the ground game in an effort to overutilize a ball control passing attack.

Chris Forester has no experience as an offensive coordinator, but he does come from offenses that do not neglect the running back within the offense.

Trestman has experience, but his offenses at every stop along the way have been completely one dimensional towards the passing game. Trestman neglects balance on offense, and he underutilizes the tailbacks.

The phins are so late into the offseason, it would be virtually impossible to toss out everything they've practiced and learned thus far, to pick up a new system.

I do however disagree with you Krisback, for the simple fact that yes Marc Trestman underutilizes his running backs, but Wanny's stubborn a$$ would overide a good deal of his plays, until Trestman called a more balanced game. I dont think I've ever seen a more stubborn man than DW, so even if MT was our OC, DW would still have his say in the offense. Which Means run first balanced attack--WCO style...whatever that means :D .

 

[dne spins]

dave actually addressed that, saying we need sullivan to coach the wrs and we need trestman to coach the qbs, and doing both qbs/wr and being offensive coordinator is too much for one guy to do. thats what norv did last season (qb coach and off coord) and dave felt like that was too much for 1 guy to do. also, with foerster as OC, i bet dave feels like he has more controll over our offensive philosophy. if trestman or sullivan were OC, which they have both been before, they would probably want to do more things on offense and take more chances, which dave is uncomfortable with. we all know daves philosophy: run run run and run some more and rely on good defense.

 

[BLITZKRIEG]

Looking at what we have to work with on offense, I think it would be wise to open it up as much as possible. We've got very little, and next to nothing to lose at this point IMO...

Are we going to run to set up the pass???... :shakeno:

OR

Are we going to pass in order to set up the run???....

We need to do one or the other if we expect to feild an offense. Both happening together will not come easily without Ricky and Boston. We've got to open this thing up once and for all. Dave's future depends on it IMO....

PHINZ RULE!!! :fire:

 

[fin-atic]

I thought Trestman should have gotten the job to begin with. But its too late in the year to change now.

 

[KB21]

Looking at what we have to work with on offense, I think it would be wise to open it up as much as possible. We've got very little, and next to nothing to lose at this point IMO...

Are we going to run to set up the pass???... :shakeno:

OR

Are we going to pass in order to set up the run???....

We need to do one or the other if we expect to feild an offense. Both happening together will not come easily without Ricky and Boston. We've got to open this thing up once and for all. Dave's future depends on it IMO....

PHINZ RULE!!! :fire:

Once again, it is a false assumption that opening up the offense means throwing more. It doesn't.

This team will run to set up the pass, as any sane offensive coordinator would do. This team will utilize the play action off the run, and with AJ Feeley as the starter, this team will be able to encompass the entire field within the passing attack. Instead of being limited to slant routes and dump offs to the backs as they were with Fiedler, Miami will be able to attack down the field. They will be able to throw the deep outs. They will be able to attack the sidelines and hit the passes down the middle, because Feeley doesn't impart the type of limitations on the offense that Fiedler did.

What you will see is Travis Minor run for 1,300 yards and gain another 500 yards receiving. You will finally see Chris Chambers break 1,000 yards receiving. You will see Randy McMichael and Donald Lee become weapons in the passing game. You will see a young guy like Kendall Newson emerge as a good compliment to Chris Chambers. You will see an offense that doesn't have an over-reliance on the passing game nor the running game. It will be balanced.

 

[BLITZKRIEG]

Once again, it is a false assumption that opening up the offense means throwing more. It doesn't.

This team will run to set up the pass, as any sane offensive coordinator would do. This team will utilize the play action off the run, and with AJ Feeley as the starter, this team will be able to encompass the entire field within the passing attack. Instead of being limited to slant routes and dump offs to the backs as they were with Fiedler, Miami will be able to attack down the field. They will be able to throw the deep outs. They will be able to attack the sidelines and hit the passes down the middle, because Feeley doesn't impart the type of limitations on the offense that Fiedler did.

What you will see is Travis Minor run for 1,300 yards and gain another 500 yards receiving. You will finally see Chris Chambers break 1,000 yards receiving. You will see Randy McMichael and Donald Lee become weapons in the passing game. You will see a young guy like Kendall Newson emerge as a good compliment to Chris Chambers. You will see an offense that doesn't have an over-reliance on the passing game nor the running game. It will be balanced.

I like that response. That's what I like to read....

I would still like to see Dave open the offense up more. This run first metallity is getting us nowhere. Even when Ricky was busting loose for 1800 it didn't make our passing attack any better as a result. I think in order to have a solid passing attack, you must first be dedicated to throwing the ball. Dave seems scared to let the offense air it out, and he has no excuse not to this year IMO....

PHINZ RULE!!! :fire:

 

[Drfletcherdc]

Marc Trestman was the OC for the Cardinals for two years. He didn't work his magic there. Trestman used Gruden's offense to get the Raiders to the SB. I sincerely hope that he is not ever the OC of the Dolphins.

 

[Oboy]

Once again, it is a false assumption that opening up the offense means throwing more. It doesn't.

This team will run to set up the pass, as any sane offensive coordinator would do. This team will utilize the play action off the run, and with AJ Feeley as the starter, this team will be able to encompass the entire field within the passing attack. Instead of being limited to slant routes and dump offs to the backs as they were with Fiedler, Miami will be able to attack down the field. They will be able to throw the deep outs. They will be able to attack the sidelines and hit the passes down the middle, because Feeley doesn't impart the type of limitations on the offense that Fiedler did.

What you will see is Travis Minor run for 1,300 yards and gain another 500 yards receiving. You will finally see Chris Chambers break 1,000 yards receiving. You will see Randy McMichael and Donald Lee become weapons in the passing game. You will see a young guy like Kendall Newson emerge as a good compliment to Chris Chambers. You will see an offense that doesn't have an over-reliance on the passing game nor the running game. It will be balanced.

Man, do I love your optimism. I TRUELY hope this happens. I believe we will be a decent offense, but not so sure about the numbers you predicted.

 

[xiidaen]

I don't think you can change offensive systems this late in the off=season. THe team has indicated before that they have relied on Trestman and Sullivan to contribute to the offensive philosophy, let's see how that pans out...

 

[dolfan91]

hey KB nice to see you .. glad to see you your back .. loved your insite .. i agree that miami will be more balanced in the offense attack ... i like newson as well and have had high hopes for him ... i also hope that tolver steps up and can become a solid 3rd wr ... but i see solid contributions from all the rb's as a group... i envision a group like the one in philly last season .. power, speed and all can catch the rock .. hope your right KB!!!

 

[KB21]

I like that response. That's what I like to read....

I would still like to see Dave open the offense up more. This run first metallity is getting us nowhere. Even when Ricky was busting loose for 1800 it didn't make our passing attack any better as a result. I think in order to have a solid passing attack, you must first be dedicated to throwing the ball. Dave seems scared to let the offense air it out, and he has no excuse not to this year IMO....

PHINZ RULE!!! :fire:

Why wasn't the passing game better? Look no farther than the limitations the quarterback placed upon the offense. With Ricky running the way he did that season, Miami could have made a ton of big plays in the passing game if they had a quarterback that didn't limit the passing game. The downfield pass off the play action is a back breaker and one that puts quick points on the board. It's what Norv Turner utilized heavily in Dallas with Aikman to Harper. Harper averaged over 21 yards per reception and had 5 TDs in Norv's last season in Dallas. The thing was, he had just 36 receptions. He averaged a TD for every 7 receptions he got, so he was a tremendous quick scoring weapon for Dallas when teams geared up to stop Emmitt.

Miami couldn't do that though. A pass that goes longer than 20 yards from Fiedler is a jump ball, so the DB has just as much of a chance to get the ball as the receiver does. The downfield pass off the play action simply was not effective for Miami because of this.

 

[KB21]

hey KB nice to see you .. glad to see you your back .. loved your insite .. i agree that miami will be more balanced in the offense attack ... i like newson as well and have had high hopes for him ... i also hope that tolver steps up and can become a solid 3rd wr ... but i see solid contributions from all the rb's as a group... i envision a group like the one in philly last season .. power, speed and all can catch the rock .. hope your right KB!!!

As far as the running backs are concerned, someone is going to have to do a lot of convincing to prove to me that Travis Minor cannot be similar to Clinton Portis as a starting running back. Hell, questions are surrounding Portis at this time. I guess people still don't believe he is big enough to be a feature back, because they are questioning whether the system made him in Denver or not. IMO, you have two running backs here who are almost identical skill-wise. They both are explosive runners who can break the long run. They both are around 5-10 to 5-11, 200-205 lbs. They both are tremendous receiving threats out of the backfield. Both have good cut back running ability and can create space in a short area due to their ability to cut. Both are tremendous pass blockers on the blitz pick up.

 

[Fin-Loco]

Guys,

I don't mean this as an insult....DO you think these guys work in other countries? That there are no offensive coaching meetings? That they don't work on the same sideline or training field?

Foerster, Collier, and Trestman are all going to have substantial input into the offensive plans. In my opinions, the reason that Wannsted gave the job to Foerster was because he had a good support team of experienced coordinators working underneath him.

All the coaches, from special teams to RB's to TE's, to coordinator have their careers and fates linked to the teams performance. Not, td's or rushing yards or sacks surrendered. But to how many games we win. All good ideas will be considered when deciding the game plan. When it's done. Foerster just the guy who picks which plays.