The Evolution of an Offensive Line | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

The Evolution of an Offensive Line

FinFan57

Practice Squad
Joined
Feb 29, 2004
Messages
642
Reaction score
1
Location
Florida
Gentlemen:

Living in South Florida, I have been able to piece together what appears to be a logical explanation of how our offensive line evolved over the last several months. I have listened to many media reporters and talked with a lot of fans that were at the Draft Party at Pro Player to get their input.

Obviously, I have no inside information, but knowing Spielman as we do and putting together the thoughts of many people who observe the Dolphins, I think the following explanation makes the most sense.

Coming out of last season, Spielman observed that Wade Smith and Seth McKinney were the only reliable linemen we have. Spielman is very high on Smith and believes he will be a great player. Many thought he was down on McKinney, because Seth had some trouble with line calls, but that is not exactly accurate. Wanny and Fiedler were comfortable enough with Ruddy and the guard play was so awful last year that they seriously considered McKinney to start at the guard position.

Wannstedt was totally caught with his pants down last year. He really believed Dixon would tough it out for 1 more year, and he didn't think Nails, Ruddy, and Perry would suck so badly. It became apparent early on (which is why Norv was so frustrated and dumbed down the playbook) that the line was going to be a mess all year. The hope was to run Ricky run, keep the turnovers down, and win with defense. We all know what happened. It made no sense to throw McKinney into that fire last year. It made more sense to target him as Ruddy's replacement so; in effect, Ruddy was McKinney's mentor.

With McKinney and Smith as his only starters, Rick went after Tait and Woody, but had no problem signing Jeno when he became available. Believe me, Rick does not regret missing on those guys. They were way overpaid. Nor does he regret losing mediocre Todd Wade, who was also way overpaid.

This brings us to the draft. Rick originally wanted Gallery and was willing to trade to get him, but it became apparent that Gallery was out of our reach (didn't Norv draft Gallery?). He then targeted Andrews, but due to questions and Andrews rising, he set his sights on Carey. He always saw this as a 3-tackle draft and had to come away with one of them. That's why he did what he had to get Carey.

McIntosh was never the first choice as the starting right tackle. He was signed for cover during the draft (nobody bought it though) and to be a swing tackle for us. He provides excellent depth at both right and left tackle. Smith and Carey are clearly the front runners and McIntosh was viewed as depth all along.

Rick is still basically looking for a starting right guard and a 3rd wide receiver. If the guys we have now don't step up, then we will be looking at the June 1 cuts.

So the line has evolved from the mess it was last year to the following:

Wade Smith - LT
Jeno James - LG
Seth McKinney - C
Whitley, Jerman, Pape, ????? - RG
Vernon Carey - RT

Backups

Damion McIntosh - RT and LT (contingent upon his health)
John St. Clair - C (will cover for McIntosh until he is healthy)
Whitley, Jerman, or Pape - G

Practice Squad

Rex Hadnot - C
Billy Yates - G, C


As I said, there will be some camp battles on the offensive line and with the receivers to determine who fills the 3rd receiver and RG spot, but I think when the season starts the line will look very close to the lineup you see above.
 
FinFan57 said:
Gentlemen:

Living in South Florida, I have been able to piece together what appears to be a logical explanation of how our offensive line evolved over the last several months. I have listened to many media reporters and talked with a lot of fans that were at the Draft Party at Pro Player to get their input.

Obviously, I have no inside information, but knowing Spielman as we do and putting together the thoughts of many people who observe the Dolphins, I think the following explanation makes the most sense.

Coming out of last season, Spielman observed that Wade Smith and Seth McKinney were the only reliable linemen we have. Spielman is very high on Smith and believes he will be a great player. Many thought he was down on McKinney, because Seth had some trouble with line calls, but that is not exactly accurate. Wanny and Fiedler were comfortable enough with Ruddy and the guard play was so awful last year that they seriously considered McKinney to start at the guard position.

Wannstedt was totally caught with his pants down last year. He really believed Dixon would tough it out for 1 more year, and he didn't think Nails, Ruddy, and Perry would suck so badly. It became apparent early on (which is why Norv was so frustrated and dumbed down the playbook) that the line was going to be a mess all year. The hope was to run Ricky run, keep the turnovers down, and win with defense. We all know what happened. It made no sense to throw McKinney into that fire last year. It made more sense to target him as Ruddy's replacement so; in effect, Ruddy was McKinney's mentor.

With McKinney and Smith as his only starters, Rick went after Tait and Woody, but had no problem signing Jeno when he became available. Believe me, Rick does not regret missing on those guys. They were way overpaid. Nor does he regret losing mediocre Todd Wade, who was also way overpaid.

This brings us to the draft. Rick originally wanted Gallery and was willing to trade to get him, but it became apparent that Gallery was out of our reach (didn't Norv draft Gallery?). He then targeted Andrews, but due to questions and Andrews rising, he set his sights on Carey. He always saw this as a 3-tackle draft and had to come away with one of them. That's why he did what he had to get Carey.

McIntosh was never the first choice as the starting right tackle. He was signed for cover during the draft (nobody bought it though) and to be a swing tackle for us. He provides excellent depth at both right and left tackle. Smith and Carey are clearly the front runners and McIntosh was viewed as depth all along.

Rick is still basically looking for a starting right guard and a 3rd wide receiver. If the guys we have now don't step up, then we will be looking at the June 1 cuts.

So the line has evolved from the mess it was last year to the following:

Wade Smith - LT
Jeno James - LG
Seth McKinney - C
Whitley, Jerman, Pape, ????? - RG
Vernon Carey - RT

Backups

Damion McIntosh - RT and LT (contingent upon his health)
John St. Clair - C (will cover for McIntosh until he is healthy)
Whitley, Jerman, or Pape - G

Practice Squad

Rex Hadnot - C
Billy Yates - G, C


As I said, there will be some camp battles on the offensive line and with the receivers to determine who fills the 3rd receiver and RG spot, but I think when the season starts the line will look very close to the lineup you see above.



That was a very insightful post that I agree with everything said. :cool:
 
I feel that Rick is still high on Taylor Whitley, and he is the guy that Rick wants to see step up and become the starting right guard. I don't think Rick would come out with the statement that Taylor will be a starter for this team if he was just passing time.

I do feel Tony Pape will surprise and push for the starting job.
 
Rick is just calling Whitley's name to send him a message. Believe me, the RG position is wide open and no one is the front runner yet. Rick's hoping to light a fire under Whitley's backside, because Whitley was a major disappointment last year.

In my opinion, Wanny should be doing this instead of Rick, but I'm glad someone has the nads to challenge people.
 
I was told this offseason that Rick felt the starters along the interior line last year should have been Billy Yates, Seth McKinney, and Greg Jerman.

From what I've heard so far, Taylor Whitley looks to be a lot more sure of himself on the field this year. Of course, you can't tell anything about an offensive lineman without the pads on. We will see what happens when the pads go on. His biggest problem last year was that he was coming out too high in his stance.
 
Wike, a G for the Raiders is playing in NFLE his team has over 1,200 yards of total O and the Raiders will be too deep at G to bring him up. Once he is waived in NFLE he's available and he was almost start quality for Carolina. He may be the steal you need as a support player with the kind of movement skills to compliment Carey's tremednous topside.

My mock had the Phins trade up for Andrews and the pats trade up for Carey at 20 overall. The Eagles went up for Andrews instead where they already deep 9probowl O line) and it forced the equation to change. Wanny moved up, got his boy Carey as the only other legite round 1 T at 20 overall :) and still got some day 2 value in steal Tony Bua.Carey was a tremendous need met, quality over quantity in that spot first day.

If the line works out- Feeley could blossom, otherwise the QB you have can push each other and click in West coast- AJ and Griese have used that system, and Fiedler's style is set for it. He was not accurate enough deep for Norv vertical passing. The shorter west coast style can compliment him very well. Shorter distance= less emphasis on accuracy more on quick read and release.

Lots of quick passes- high completion rates and many second on three, third and short downs for Ricky and the play pass or the slide screen.
 
this is our season!

Basically the way I see it, and so many other loyal fans as well, our offensive line will determine the destiny of this team. Feeley will be an upgrade if....Ricky will run like a man possessed if....David Boston and Chris Chambers will be like having Paul Warfield (Chambers is smooth like that) and John Stallworth if.... IF - The Offensive line can play like a bunch of Rotweillers fed a steady diet of gunpowder...Like a bunch Great White Sharks on feeding frenzy in blood red waters...Like a bunch of Whart Hog Fighter Jets in the mountains of Afganistan!

I still think we need two things to happen - We need another dependable, solid right guard to be our starter...St. Claire is a good man, building Habitat homes and helping the poor, and a solid backup with playoff and superbowl experience, but he is a backup...We are short at least one player now so we need another animal to get in there and bring us to the next level- Secondly we need McIntosh to get healthy by November...Surgery in March - that gives him 7 months - if he does EVERYTHING correct we can have him in November...But we must bank on at least 2 injuries to our Offensive lineman such that we are ready with replacements that do not downgrade our capacity to RUN it down peoples throats...So hopefully Carey, St Claire, and McIntosh are all available and have worked through to be ready to contribute by November or December...

Then the formula for success is pretty apparent - Running game and passing game become more complimentary - Feeley is given options which breeds confidence and helps him mature over time...The tools are in place - if the O -line shows up like we hope - to be a multidimensional offensive team...

Wanstadt's formula is the Correct one for today's NFL - Run first - Get a lead - hog the ball - shorten the field - play good defense...

The O line will determine if the nay sayers who dislike Wanny will prevail or if he proves us all WRONG and takes us to the next level...

Raving like a pack of wild dogs!
 
Good analysis Finfan and good thread everyone.

A couple of questions though, first is Yates even eligible for the PS or was he active for too many games last year? Second, one of the posters of training camp info said Pape was working out as the third string LT? Is this correct? If so, does this mean he is out of the RG battle? Or was it just for minicamp?

While the first minicamp is too early to tell, seeing Whitely's name mentioned in a number of places with positive comments is encouraging. He likely has the most talent potential of the competitors there and should be most used to being next to McKinney as they lined up next to each other in college.
 
I like your thoughts on the line. Unfortunately, whether or not Spielman likes a player like Wade Smith or not won't hide the fact that he will never be a stud at his position. Wade Smith (and quite a few others on the present line) are merely patches to a really bad problem.

How many hall of famers did we have on the line back in the 70's? 80's?

You just don't replace hall of famers guys. The last two linemen the Dolphins drafted that really worked well were Webb and Simms. The rest of these guys are all 2nd rate guys. Maybe Carey will prove me wrong, but I'm afraid that the future does not look that bright in regards to our O line.
 
FinFan57 said:
McIntosh was never the first choice as the starting right tackle. He was signed for cover during the draft (nobody bought it though) and to be a swing tackle for us.

Agree with everything except this part. McIntosh was originally offered a contract that was much more front loaded. He was definitely targeted as a starting RT. If he was completely healthy, I'm not sure we would have drafted Carey.

Either way, there will be a number of battles in training camp. The Fins have the most versatile set of linemen I have ever seen. Many different starting combinations are possible. The coaches will start the best combo. No spots are guaranteed.
 
FinfanInBuffalo said:
McIntosh was originally offered a contract that was much more front loaded. He was definitely targeted as a starting RT. If he was completely healthy, I'm not sure we would have drafted Carey.

Agreed. I STILL think this guy has got to make starting unit somehow, assuming he's healthy at some point in the season. The guy played LT, albeit, apparently not great as a pass pro guy, but the rep out of SD was he was a real slobber-knocking run-blocker. A move to RT or RG, with lower emphasis on pass pro, and this guy should shine.

Having this guy and Carey is a nice luxury, but it's inefficient personel management. I don't think we go with Carey either had McIntosh been healthy.
 
I agree with everything you said!! Except the fact that you addressed everyone as gentlemen :angry: I AM A FEMALE DOLFAN!!! AND I KNOW MY STUFF!! ;)
 
My apologies Miss Meth.

Ladies and Gentlemen - McIntosh was always viewed as a wonderful fill-in. If we couldn't get Andrews or Carey, yes he probably was going to play RT. If no one steps up at RG, then yes he could be a great RG. Due to injury and the need to win now, Mac is viewed as a backup and may very well be a versatile backup for us if we can fill the holes that currently exist.

I was merely stating Spielman's intentions. Guys are still going to have to win jobs in camp. I believe Carey will win the RT spot, but I honestly don't know who will emerge as the RG. Whitley is being challenged and would seem to be the logical frontrunner, but RG is wide open.

Until Mac comes back, Pape will be looked at as a backup Tackle. MadDog believes Pape will be a great guard, but due to his lack of athleticism Pape is not considered a great prospect at Tackle. Pape is an excellent run blocker - I hope he steps up and makes the RG spot.
 
Don't get me wrong. I like a lot of what you have to say. HOWEVER, the entire front office has echoed the sentiment that the best five will play. I take this to mean that if McIntosh and Carey both earn playing time then one of them moves to RG. I don't think you can peg DMac as a swing tackle if he fails to beat out Carey.

What I find most surprising is that St Clair is currently being viewed as the RT. He played horribly there for the Rams. And, his best position is C. He plays a pretty good guard, too. Tackle allows him to get exposed by speed rushers. So, I think St Clair being the starting RT is just incentive for Carey at this point.

Good post!
 
Back
Top Bottom