52 defense?

[m i n o]

hey guys i was watching the miami/redskin superbowl a few days ago and really enjoyed the swarming to the ball. why did shula stop using that 52 defense and do you guys think our current personell could run it? i notice no team that i know of runs it anymore. it brought miami to three back to back bowls. also it would give other teams o coordinators something they haven't seen in a while.

now im not sure i would want to use it as our base but to throw it in every once in a while for confusion purposes kinda like how the patriots tried that scheme against us when feeley was playing it really confused him but i felt bellicheat over used it and it cost him the game as we finally picked up on what they were doing and abused it.

 

[13mademeafan13]

We don't have the personnel to run that D. Plus I believe that if you spread out the WR's then the 52 get burnt quickly. We would need some very quick and good tacklers from the Corner and Safety spots.

 

[Finfang]

Of course the defense you speak of is the famous "53" defense not the 52.

Here is a blip about it:

1973 Miami Dolphins The Dolphins 53/"No Name" Defense ("53" was linebacker Bob Matheson's number) held 11 opponents to 14 points or less, setting a record by allowing just 150 points in a 14-game season. Defensive end Bill Stanfill set a Dolphins' sack record that still stands, with 18.5. In the playoffs and Super Bowl, they allowed only 33 points against Cincinnati, Oakland and Minnesota. Stanfill, Manny Fernandez, Hall of Fame middle linebacker Nick Buoniconti, and safeties Dick Anderson (AP Defensive Player of the Year) and Jake Scott were all named to the 1973 All-Pro team.
Before facing the Dolphins in Super Bowl VIII, Vikings QB Fran Tarkenton oozed confidence, saying he'd solved the 53. "I think you've got to prepare for the 53 defense, you've got to make it so the Dolphins don't know what to expect. I'm sure we'll prepare a little bit different." It didn't work. The Vikings lost 24-7, scoring their only TD in the fourth quarter.

Some more:

Dolphins coordinator, Bill Arnsparger, created the 53 defense with Bob Matheson (who wore No. 53) sometimes lined up at defensive end and other times at linebacker. He could change a 4-3 defense into a 3-4 simply by standing. It was an innovation that baffled opponents who never knew if Matheson would blitz or drop into coverage.

 

[PhinGeneral]

It's actually the 53 Defense, and was named after linebacker Bob Matheson, who wore #53. It's basically an early version of the 3-4/4-3 hybrid run today, where Matheson would either rush the passer or drop into coverage as a 4th linebacker, and Fernandez would play on the nose.

 

[m i n o]

thanks guys i was a lil curious and my bad on the wrong name. yea i suppose your right about that 13 as tackling wasn't our strong point last year it was horrid with a few exceptions. so who of players in todays game would be able to play in the 53?

 

[NotoriousFinny]

Some More information for you!

The 72 Miami Dolphins were the first team to win a Super Bowl with the 3-4 defense, going undefeated and using number 53, Bob Mathison as a down lineman or rushing linebacker.

Notable teams that use the 3-4 defense are the Cleveland Browns, San Diego Chargers, Dallas Cowboys, New York Jets, New England Patriots, and Pittsburgh Steelers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_football_strategy#3-4

 

[ZOD]

thanks guys i was a lil curious and my bad on the wrong name. yea i suppose your right about that 13 as tackling wasn't our strong point last year it was horrid with a few exceptions. so who of players in todays game would be able to play in the 53?

43, 34, 53........

None of these defensive fronts matter when your defensive personel does not match up with the offensive personell on the field.

Follow the math for the 43 front:

43 - four defensive linemen, three linebackers, FOUR defensive backs

Nickel - four defensive linemen, two linebackers, FIVE defensive backs

DIME - four defensive linemen, one linebacker, SIX defensive backs


All of the defensive fronts I listed above change due to the offensive personel substitution. If you taped the Redskins/Dolphins game, go watch it again. Answer yourself these questions -

HOW MANY PERSONEL SUBSTITUTIONS WERE MADE ON OFFENSE?

HOW MANY OFFENSIVE FORMATIONS WERE USED?

WHAT WAS THE RUN/PASS RATIO?

Once you narrow those questions down you will see why the secondary has become more vital to the game.

The 53 had four linemen on the field.
The 53 had three linebackers on the field.
The 53 had two cornerbacks on the field.
The 53 had one safety on the field.

You may have notice that One player is missing to make up the 11th man on the defense. That player was Bob Matheson (53). The offense did not know if his assignment was rush or zone drop. Bob Matheson had experience playing defensive line. Bob Matheson had experience playing linebacker.

Now take the personel grouping that I just gave you and match it up on today's offense.

                                 R

Z                               Q                     slot
                    Y   x   x   x   x   x                         X

Does it work? No.........

 

[OneHondo]

The 53 worked because of the players we had on defense. That defense swarmed to the ball no matter where on the field the ball was. Players across the field on the play didn't relax and just watch, they went to the ball. And yes I did watch them because I have been a fan since Miami was an expansion team. Bill Arnsbarger was a true defensive coach not just a wannabe like some of todays DCs. Its just my opinion but Arnsbarger is the best DC the Dolphins have ever had. He would be a good candidate for the ROH.

 

[m i n o]

so what your saying zod is the defense changed because the offensive formations changed? and would jt be our bob mathison now that he has kinda been roming around? well atleast during the saban years. jt could play the line also drop back as a olb? there was alot more emphesis on the run then pass back then i imagine. nowadays you need more than one safety due to the spreadout formations of the pass oreinted teams?

 

[raphinmx]

Actually the Killer Bees played in a similar way to the 53 defense, they used A.J. Duhe a lot in the same way they used Bob Matheson.

 

[ZOD]

so what your saying zod is the defense changed because the offensive formations changed? and would jt be our bob mathison now that he has kinda been roming around? well atleast during the saban years. jt could play the line also drop back as a olb? there was alot more emphesis on the run then pass back then i imagine. nowadays you need more than one safety due to the spreadout formations of the pass oreinted teams?

No!

What I am saying is that the defense is an antique. The modern passing game along with the modern athlete killed it. Even in it's day, the 53 was part of an overall defensive package. Watch how many times Matheson was not on the field in that game. It was quite often.

I guess I should add this note before sending you to some information. I have to say it because some must think Bill Arnsparger went away after the 70's. Bill Arnsparger coached Junior Seau! Bill Arnsparger was the defensive coordinator for Bobby Ross' San Diego Chargers. Upon his arrival the staff had lengthy discussion about the PERSONEL on the Chargers team before arriving at the 34 for their base front.

Back on point... Go to the following threads for commentary on defensive fronts. I'm sending you there because I do not have alot of free time this morning.....

http://www.dolphinsnation.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1062264375#post1062264375

http://www.dolphinsnation.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1062254058#post1062254058