A Hurry Up O Discussion

[So Be]

Most love the idea of Lazor's hurry up O, which is understandable. However, I have to look at the downside as well.

The 300 pound Big Uglies on the OL, who play almost every snap, are gonna have to play in Miami's heat and humidity vs a D which is gonna play a rotation. Our D is also gonna have to come back sooner than what would be the norm.

Anyone see a potential problem with that?

Philly did it with a GREAT OL, and being able to run the ball to tae time of the clock. Can't see us with the same ability this year.

 

[Phinatic8u]

I don't see it being a big problem due to the team practicing in it all summer.

Also it's football, heat and humidity isn't that much of a home field advantage.

 

[KTOWNFINFAN]

And our defense not being able to get anyone off the field just adds to the problem. With a hurry O the D needs to get stops and last year we had a bend but dont break defense. We were good at keeping em out of the endzone but gave up long drives as a normal way of life. That has to change.

 

[So Be]

I don't see it being a big problem due to the team practicing in it all summer.

Also it's football, heat and humidity isn't that much of a home field advantage.

Not saying home field, just the OL having to play at a faster pace while being in an almost every snap.

 

[gregorygrant83]

For the record the Eagles finished dead last in time of possession in 2013, it would have been even worse if they didn't have the NFL's leading rusher.

 

[So Be]

For the record the Eagles finished dead last in time of possession in 2013, it would have been even worse if they didn't have the NFL's leading rusher.

Good point, and the temp and humidity is entirely different than Miami.

 

[gregorygrant83]

Also the Eagles offense averaged 65 plays per game and Miami's averaged 62. So actually the fast paced offense didn't result in better possession numbers for the Eagles or more total plays.

 

[j-off-her-doll]

One of the key aspects of a fast-paced no huddle is that it tires the D more than it does the O. It limits the D's ability to rotate while cutting down on its rest between reps. You never worry about the offense being on the field too much, because D's generally fatigue at a much quicker rate than O's, but for the previously mentioned reasons, the hurry up broadens that gap.

The concern for wearing out our own D, though, is a significant issue. We have some depth, but unless Jenkins and Tripp step up, we're thin (and potentially bad anyway) at LB.

For the way Miami's built, I think the offense makes a lot of sense. As long as Tannehill can hit the deep ball, the offense should hide most of his shortcomings and accentuate his strengths. It also gives Lamar Miller a legitimate shot at success. He's going to get some open lanes in this offense. If he can put his foot in the ground and accelerate through the hole, he can be productive. Without the advantage provided by the hurry up, our running game would have again been garbage in 2014. It still might be, but I think this particular hurry up (assuming Lazor is doing Kelly's system justice, which he sounds to be) really improves our odds.

On D, our primary strength is depth on the D-line. We don't have that 340 NT anymore, and, though I like the LB switch a roo (how many times does a team return its starting LB's with every one of them playing a new position?), I don't see us greatly improving our run D - which needs improving. If the offense can take the lead early, it minimizes that weakness. The depth on the line and in the secondary help minimize the risk of fatigue. If this core group of players (which - imo - is not at all clear) is to ever succeed, this offense is probably our best shot. Before learning that Lazor is actually implementing large portions of Kelly's system, I thought we'd finish last in the division. We still have to make it work, but this gives us a much higher ceiling as a team.

 

[state06]

Also the Eagles offense averaged 65 plays per game and Miami's averaged 62. So actually the fast paced offense didn't result in better possession numbers for the Eagles or more total plays.

interesting...Yet Philly had 6676 total yards vs Miami's 5007 for the season. breaks down to a little over 100 more yards per game. Points to them having more big plays. Hopefully we see more big plays from this offense this season.

 

[fishfanmiami]

I was listening to Lazor describe the "fast tempo" he wants to play at and it's not really a hurry up scheme that tires out the linemen. They will take full huddles most of the time and his fast tempo means AFTER the snap. Basically counting on Tannehill to read the defense fast and get the ball out of his hands to the right target quickly to let play makers do their thing. No holding the ball waiting for someone to get open instead counting on the number one target to always beat his man off the snap. This would seem to contradict all the shifting Mike Wallace said he was doing but that's what Lazor said.
One side benefit of this is our sacks allowed total should be drastically reduced.

 

[j-off-her-doll]

interesting...Yet Philly had 6676 total yards vs Miami's 5007 for the season. breaks down to a little over 100 more yards per game. Points to them having more big plays. Hopefully we see more big plays from this offense this season.

The Eagles were 6th in the NFL in points per play.

 

[roy_miami]

I would just copy what the Patriots do. Have the ability to run an up tempo whenever you want to change things up but you don't need to do it all the time like the Eagles. If you're going to do it though the GM has to be fully on board and draft players specifically that have stamina, especially on offense, you want a group of 11 guys you can count on to be able to sustain 20-30 play drives in a hurry up if need be. I wouldn't worry too much about tiring our own defense unless we're playing a team that also likes to run up tempo.

The heat and humidity is such an advantage that if we are able to run an effective up tempo offense I think we'll average at least 7 wins a season at home. The real advantage though would come in the playoffs when the cold weather teams come to town because the colder it gets in their city the harder it is on them in Miami. Even though its hotter in September in Miami I believe the real advantage comes in January when temperature differences between Miami and New England can be 80 or 90 degrees. Its not strictly the heat that is the killer, its going from a cold climate to a hot climate. For the same reason I think Miami will be hard pressed to ever go to the SB having to win 3 road games in the cold.

We need a team that is capable of winning 12 or 13 games every once in a while and that starts with winning 7-8 at home.

 

[jc4005]

The tempo they talked about mostly involved the time it took when they broke the huddle to the time it took to snap the ball. Everything else would be relaxed. So play ends, everyone brushes the dirt off huddles up and catches their breath, then when the huddle breaks its all about speed. That way the defense is kept completely off balance trying to match up pre-snap.

 

[Digital]

I love the hurry up offense. I'm definitely in the camp excited about having Lazor running the show.

Almost every serious commitment to running a hurry up offense in the NFL has been successful. Not all to the same degree, but consider this...

It started in Cincinnati during the Icky Shuffle and Boomer Esiason days. Their pedestrian offense ran the hurry up and became supercharged. This ticked off Bills Coach Marv Levy he wrote the NFL office multiple times saying it should be illegal. But the NFL allowed it, so the next year he implemented it and the Jim Kelly/Thurman Thomas K-Gun offense was born. It took them to multiple Super Bowls.

Today, like the WCO, there are different flavors of It but most top offenses run some variant of it.

Peyton Manning hurries up to the line but then takes his time calling the play and audiblizing. Brady hurries both the lineup and the snap but only uses it on certain series.

Th benefits are tremendous. Since every NFL team has a lot of talent, small advantages can make a huge difference.

For instance, the main advantage is crippling defensive situational substitutions. The Patriots released and the Bills picked up Mike LB Brandon Spikes. He is an absolute stud vs the run ... but piss poor vs the pass. He is an ideal 2 down LB. But, on obvious passing downs he needs to be taken out. So, teams would use the hurry up to keep him on the field and keep passing. Or, as the Patriots did very successfully last year, get a team into nickel or dime coverage and use the hurry up to run the ball down the defenses throat.

To succeed against the hurry up, teams need 3 down players at every position, which few defenses have. Often Mike LB's cannot cover or blitz well. Often OLB's and DE's are pass rushers but cannot hold up against the run consistently. Often nickel backs cannot defend the run well.

Having an offense with versatile TE's and RB's allows an offense to take advantage of defenses that use situational substitutions. This is the easiest way to create and repeatedly exploit mismatches. In today's NFL, that's what offense is all about.

I wish we had gone a different route with our OL rebuild that gave us players who were solid in both pass pro and run blocking, to take advantage of any defense. But, at least we look to have the personnel to pass on any one if they sub in run defenders like Spikes.

We are becoming a tem that creates and punishes mismatches. There will be a lot of growing pains ... but this offense will score much more points and be very good by seasons end.

Another major point of the hurry up is Lazor's use of varied formations, personnel groupings and motion to disguise his plays and confuse the defense. The tempo forces defenders to read these changes quicker and communicate assignments quicker. Thus invariably leads to defensive breakdowns and blown assignments ... and great opportunities for our offense to get chunk yardage and scores.

Yes, it can put pressure on our defense ... but we are built to pass rush and pass cover, so getting the lead is the best thing we could possibly do for our defense ... even if it means they have to play more snaps each game.

Sent from my phone, so please forgive any typos.

 

[Buddy]

I love the hurry up offense. I'm definitely in the camp excited about having Lazor running the show.

Almost every serious commitment to running a hurry up offense in the NFL has been successful. Not all to the same degree, but consider this...

It started in Cincinnati during the Icky Shuffle and Boomer Esiason days. Their pedestrian offense ran the hurry up and became supercharged. This ticked off Bills Coach Marv Levy he wrote the NFL office multiple times saying it should be illegal. But the NFL allowed it, so the next year he implemented it and the Jim Kelly/Thurman Thomas K-Gun offense was born. It took them to multiple Super Bowls.

Today, like the WCO, there are different flavors of It but most top offenses run some variant of it.

Peyton Manning hurries up to the line but then takes his time calling the play and audiblizing. Brady hurries both the lineup and the snap but only uses it on certain series.

Th benefits are tremendous. Since every NFL team has a lot of talent, small advantages can make a huge difference.

For instance, the main advantage is crippling defensive situational substitutions. The Patriots released and the Bills picked up Mike LB Brandon Spikes. He is an absolute stud vs the run ... but piss poor vs the pass. He is an ideal 2 down LB. But, on obvious passing downs he needs to be taken out. So, teams would use the hurry up to keep him on the field and keep passing. Or, as the Patriots did very successfully last year, get a team into nickel or dime coverage and use the hurry up to run the ball down the defenses throat.

To succeed against the hurry up, teams need 3 down players at every position, which few defenses have. Often Mike LB's cannot cover or blitz well. Often OLB's and DE's are pass rushers but cannot hold up against the run consistently. Often nickel backs cannot defend the run well.

Having an offense with versatile TE's and RB's allows an offense to take advantage of defenses that use situational substitutions. This is the easiest way to create and repeatedly exploit mismatches. In today's NFL, that's what offense is all about.

I wish we had gone a different route with our OL rebuild that gave us players who were solid in both pass pro and run blocking, to take advantage of any defense. But, at least we look to have the personnel to pass on any one if they sub in run defenders like Spikes.

We are becoming a tem that creates and punishes mismatches. There will be a lot of growing pains ... but this offense will score much more points and be very good by seasons end.

Another major point of the hurry up is Lazor's use of varied formations, personnel groupings and motion to disguise his plays and confuse the defense. The tempo forces defenders to read these changes quicker and communicate assignments quicker. Thus invariably leads to defensive breakdowns and blown assignments ... and great opportunities for our offense to get chunk yardage and scores.

Yes, it can put pressure on our defense ... but we are built to pass rush and pass cover, so getting the lead is the best thing we could possibly do for our defense ... even if it means they have to play more snaps each game.

Sent from my phone, so please forgive any typos.

I agree with you and think that if we can get a touchdown or two lead, we can match up well against a team that is primarily passing. Last year, we struggled mightily when teams could smash-mouth run because we didn't have a lead or just a slight lead. I think we will still struggle getting of the field against a strong run team but hopefully, we can minimize that by putting points on the board and forcing them to pass which certainly works to our defensive strength.

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