A question for the Sabanites

[flintsilver7]

What exactly has Saban done to earn your trust? Why should we give him time to "fix" this team? What makes you think he hasn't caused the mess himself?

I'm curious to see why so many of you simply assume that Saban is not the problem.

 

[DePhinistr8]

What exactly has Saban done to earn your trust? Why should we give him time to "fix" this team? What makes you think he hasn't caused the mess himself?

I'm curious to see why so many of you simply assume that Saban is not the problem.

Well for me it's been his track record as both a college coach and a relatively successful assistant. That and breathing some life into a team that was 4-12 when he took over and turning them into a respectable 9-7.

I know so far this season there isn't a ton to be happy about, but I'm sure we can all agree that no one is more upset about it than Nick.

 

[Simone007]

If you expected Saban to win the superbowl this you are obviously frustrated. Like someone else said, he can be our Cowher. A coach like Saban needs time and at least three drafts to rebuild a poor football team. I can see him stay here for at least ten years.

Saban is smart, has got the energy and patience to handle a football team. Give him time... the last thing I want to see is a new coach, and Saban having success elsewhere

 

[flintsilver7]

I have no doubts that he's upset about it. I also have no doubts about his abilities as a college coach or an assistant. That does not necessarily translate into professional head coach success as evidenced by far too many college coaches. There's nothing different about Saban that people should be saying "it's only a matter of time."

I also take issue with the notion that the franchise was really a 4-12 franchise and that he "turned it around."

 

[mike71]

it's a little early to say saban is the problem. give him next year. however, i will say his ignoring the o-line for 2 years now is unbelievable. to think just hiring hauck is a cure all is just plain dumb. my biggest problem with saban so far is the defense. he's supposed to be a defensive back guru?? how many times are the db's in good position yet they never turn their head back to the ball? either they get beat or it's a penalty. two years now and this secondary still gives up huge plays almost every week.

 

[vt_dolfan]

What exactly has Saban done to earn your trust? Why should we give him time to "fix" this team? What makes you think he hasn't caused the mess himself?

I'm curious to see why so many of you simply assume that Saban is not the problem.

My question is why do we who support the coach of our football team...get a label of any kind. WTF are you..the "Anti-Saban". He's the coach of our football team. He's coached 1 Yr plus..and for the most part of that..has done a good job. You know what pisses me off most about fans like you. You will ***** and moan like we suck worse than a J/V high school team..but if we start winning..your the first ones back on the band wagon.

Sabanites......god ...how bout you just call us Dolphans..and leave it at that.

 

[shula_guy]

Im not advocating getting rid of saban yet, but I think the dolphins problems belong to Saban. It bothers me about him that in his press conferences i dont hear him taking personal responibilty for his teams ineffectiveness on the field.

 

[Simone007]

...but I'm sure we can all agree that no one is more upset about it than Nick.

Right!

 

[DePhinistr8]

I have no doubts that he's upset about it. I also have no doubts about his abilities as a college coach or an assistant. That does not necessarily translate into professional head coach success as evidenced by far too many college coaches. There's nothing different about Saban that people should be saying "it's only a matter of time."

I also take issue with the notion that the franchise was really a 4-12 franchise and that he "turned it around."

well, it was a 4-12 franchise...you are what you are..right now, we're not very good either..hopefully that will change too

It's not as if there was a ton to work with when he got here, aside from a decent, but aging defense.

 

[DePhinistr8]

Im not advocating getting rid of saban yet, but I think the dolphins problems belong to Saban. It bothers me about him that in his press conferences i dont hear him taking personal responibilty for his teams ineffectiveness on the field.

actually he did, he said it all starts with him, from attitude to execution

 

[flintsilver7]

My question is why do we who support the coach of our football team...get a label of any kind. WTF are you..the "Anti-Saban". He's the coach of our football team. He's coached 1 Yr plus..and for the most part of that..has done a good job. You know what pisses me off most about fans like you. You will ***** and moan like we suck worse than a J/V high school team..but if we start winning..your the first ones back on the band wagon.

Sabanites......god ...how bout you just call us Dolphans..and leave it at that.

I support the Dolphins. I have my entire life. I don't have to like the coach of the team. Lots of Bills fans didn't like Mularkey. Lots of Jets fans didn't like Herm Edwards. That doesn't mean they weren't fans. Redskins fans will admit they hated what Steve Spurrier did to their team; Gibbs took one year to turn around a franchise that had a solid base (much less of a solid base than the Dolphins had despite their 4-12 2004 record) and take them back to the playoffs.

You get a label not because you support the coach. "Sabanites" are those people who blindly support every decision Saban makes. They are the people who do not analyze each decision individually, but rather assume the decision was correct and attempt to rationalize it (see: Frerotte, Mularkey, and so on). I'd rather the Dolphins win than myself be right, but unfortunately those two ends are at odds right now. I don't think Saban is the guy. I think more often than not his moves have been boneheaded and haven't paid off. I think he's gambled and lost too many times for a "rookie" coach.

If you want to call me names, that's fine.

 

[Alxphins]

I am not sure he is not the problem, however, I am not sure he is the problem either. I suppose it depends on which school of thought you marry yourself to. There is one that says he is due a reasonable amount of time to turn this thing around (keeping in mind the absolute debacle that was left behind by Wanny and Spielman). Along those lines the reasons he should be given some time could be based on the fact: 1) He has a very respected (ask Bill Belicheck) and successful (in college) track record as a coach; 2) He had some success in his first year which was unexpected and surprising to all; 3) It is only 4 games into this year; and 5) Because of the salary cap it is difficult to make wholesale changes in one year.

The other school of thought is that he should have had it turned around by now and we should be superbowl contenders. I am not sure how this is plausible. Maybe he made a mistake with Cullpepper (in all honesty I would have rather had Brees but I am not sure he would have stayed healthy behind this line) or maybe not. I do not think four games is enough os a sampling to make a determination. A season is 16 games not 4 and if the dolphins are 4-12 after it then the judgments can be more just, but what if they end up 10-6 or 9-7? I think if people were honest with themselves they would agree that if someone said it will take until the third season after Wanny/Spielman for the Dolphins to be a legitimate contender we would have agreed. We cannot forget how much damage Wanny/Spielman did to this franchise. Sure most of the players are gone but it takes time for new players to gel and learn a new system.

 

[flintsilver7]

well, it was a 4-12 franchise...you are what you are..right now, we're not very good either..hopefully that will change too

It's not as if there was a ton to work with when he got here, aside from a decent, but aging defense.

No, it was a 4-12 SEASON, not a 4-12 franchise. I have made the case repeatedly that the 4-12 season was a statisical aberration due to the complete line turnover, the revolving door at quarterback, the departure or Ricky Williams and the ensuing revolving door at running back, and the various injuries that decimated the team.

Saban inherited an offense that included Randy McMichael, Chris Chambers, and Marty Booker, to name a few. The entire offensive line that was so successful last year was all here. I've given Saban much credit for hiring Houck and the work he did with the line, and then this year he goes and shuffles the line and takes two steps backward. The defensive players that were here need no introduction.

Look at the names that existed on teams like the 49ers or the Browns before you say the Dolphins were a 4-12 franchise.

 

[flintsilver7]

I am not sure he is not the problem, however, I am not sure he is the problem either. I suppose it depends on which school of thought you marry yourself to. There is one that says he is due a reasonable amount of time to turn this thing around (keeping in mind the absolute debacle that was left behind by Wanny and Spielman). Along those lines the reasons he should be given some time could be based on the fact: 1) He has a very respected (ask Bill Belicheck) and successful (in college) track record as a coach; 2) He had some success in his first year which was unexpected and surprising to all; 3) It is only 4 games into this year; and 5) Because of the salary cap it is difficult to make wholesale changes in one year.

The other school of thought is that he should have had it turned around by now and we should be superbowl contenders. I am not sure how this is plausible. Maybe he made a mistake with Cullpepper (in all honesty I would have rather had Brees but I am not sure he would have stayed healthy behind this line) or maybe not. I do not think four games is enough os a sampling to make a determination. A season is 16 games not 4 and if the dolphins are 4-12 after it then the judgments can be more just, but what if they end up 10-6 or 9-7? I think if people were honest with themselves they would agree that if someone said it will take until the third season after Wanny/Spielman for the Dolphins to be a legitimate contender we would have agreed. We cannot forget how much damage Wanny/Spielman did to this franchise. Sure most of the players are gone but it takes time for new players to gel and learn a new system.

You raise valid points. While I happen to think Saban is the problem - or at least part of it - I'm perfectly fine with the possibility that he isn't. It's possible this might yet be a winning season. I think it's unlikely and it isn't looking good based on going 1-3 against 4-11 teams, but it's possible.

One other thing that bothers me is the prevalent belief that Wannstedt and Spielman destroyed the team, set them back five years, and so on. Spielman was significantly worse than Wannstedt, but even he wasn't that bad.

 

[DePhinistr8]

No, it was a 4-12 SEASON, not a 4-12 franchise. I have made the case repeatedly that the 4-12 season was a statisical aberration due to the complete line turnover, the revolving door at quarterback, the departure or Ricky Williams and the ensuing revolving door at running back, and the various injuries that decimated the team.

Saban inherited an offense that included Randy McMichael, Chris Chambers, and Marty Booker, to name a few. The entire offensive line that was so successful last year was all here. I've given Saban much credit for hiring Houck and the work he did with the line, and then this year he goes and shuffles the line and takes two steps backward. The defensive players that were here need no introduction.

Look at the names that existed on teams like the 49ers or the Browns before you say the Dolphins were a 4-12 franchise.

He also inherited AJ Feeley, Jay Fiedler, a pouty Sam Madison, the Ricky situation.....it most certainly wasn't clean. I'm of the thinking that perhaps any other coach walking into a situation where the QB's are garbage, the RB situation is unclear, and an aging defense that has to learn a new way to play would've done much, much worse.

Now that doesn't mean I'm willing to give the man a free pass. I don't particularly care for the Mularky move, and I guess we'll see how the Culpepper situation turns out. Right now neither one looks promising, but hopefully it'll get turned around.