Can phins fire tony and hire gruden now?

[Sirspud]

Gruden didn't develop a team into a super bowl champion...they were already made. They had been to 2 or 3 NFC championship games before he ever got there. Cowher has never been in charge of personnel decisions, who's to say he will be successful? That's as risky as finding that diamond in the rough. Gruden already proved he can't do a good job with personnel decisions.

Gruden also did a completely terrible job of doing any kind of talent development whatsoever. His draft record makes Ireland look great. He brought in a collection of veteran free agents each year, which every other year were able to make his team's competitive. But the core of that team was always what was there before he got there, and hardly added a single good player that was around for more than 1-2 years to that corps.

Gruden was good at adding pieces to something which was already there, that's how he got there in 2002. But asking him to build is like asking Rex Ryan not to eat.

 

[hightempo]

Gruden didn't develop a team into a super bowl champion...they were already made. They had been to 2 or 3 NFC championship games before he ever got there. Cowher has never been in charge of personnel decisions, who's to say he will be successful? That's as risky as finding that diamond in the rough. Gruden already proved he can't do a good job with personnel decisions.

Fans like you are the exact reason we didn't hire Ted Thompson, Jerry Reese and Mike Tomlin...all of which interviewed here at some point. Fans like you are the reason we've hired Bill Parcells, Jimmy Johnson, Nick Saban and even Wannstedt to some extent because he was a known commodity. Instant gratification is what you're looking for and it has led us to more misery.

oh im sorry. i must have been asleep during that Tampa Bay Buccaneer dynasty. when did i miss that??? how many super bowls did they have before gruden??? oh yeah ZERO

and now im the reason why wandstedt was here? or cameron? dude u gotta go see the doc. and im pretty sure the reason we didnt hire mike tomlin was because our executives were idiots (and perhaps somewhat racist and ageist - judging by the hes too hip-hop comment) and if i recall we hired a offensive coordinator with a losing record as a head coach. so even your point HAS NO POINT. because clearly huizenga didnt go for a name did he?

the fact is the culture sucks in miami. the easiest way for that to be replaced is by a man with an attitude that knows how to win and has proven it.

last time i checked green bay and pittsburgh didnt exactly have a culture problem when these head coaches u use as an example took over. they were already model franchises THAT EXPECTED TO WIN. see the difference???? its MUCH DIFFERENT. those guys had TIME TO GROW into the coaches theyve become. our next head coach does not have that luxury. get it??

 

[WeVie]

sure that makes sense. why hire a coach thats already proven he knows how to win time and time again? why hire a coach thats already pushed the right buttons for his team to develop over the course of a season into a super bowl championship team?? lets find a diamond in the rough instead right? i mean that makes sense right? maybe we could find the next cam cameron, or dave wandstedt, or tony sparano right?

**** while were at it wtf should we even waste our #1 draft pick on a QB? makes no sense to do that right? when we can find one in the 6th round! lets wait till the 6th round so we can find the next brady while were at it cause thats how u build championships afterall - 6th round QBs.

**** winners. lets hire some high school coach that shows potential, and stash away our future franchise QB in college free agency. we'll be on our way.

Sounds just like what this team has been doing. A first round pick and a second round pick and they throw them away on a college backup RB and a lineman.

 

[hightempo]

Gruden also did a completely terrible job of doing any kind of talent development whatsoever. His draft record makes Ireland look great. He brought in a collection of veteran free agents each year, which every other year were able to make his team's competitive. But the core of that team was always what was there before he got there, and hardly added a single good player that was around for more than 1-2 years to that corps.

Gruden was good at adding pieces to something which was already there, that's how he got there in 2002. But asking him to build is like asking Rex Ryan not to eat.

yeah he did such a terrible job of developing that a the team he took over WON IT ALL IN HIS FIRST YEAR. and they team he built from a losing team into a perennial winner actually played his new team in the final game.

last i checked quarterback is the most important position on the field. and oddly enough he took one journeyman quarterback that his team didnt want and he developed into an NFL MVP. he took another journeyman quarterback his team didnt want to a superbowl winning quarterback in his first year. and his 3rd quarterback went to the probowl under his watch.

yep the guys garbage. maybe u 2 in your infinite wisdom should be our next GM

 

[Dolph N.Fan]

Miami can always interview J-Lo to get the minority thing out go the way.

 

[hightempo]

Sounds just like what this team has been doing. A first round pick and a second round pick and they throw them away on a college backup RB and a lineman.

lol. i know. thats my point. and there are people around here that STILL think thats the way to do it. "lets go find a diamond in the rough". its comical.

 

[Canadianfishfan]

Just say NO TO GRUDEN!

 

[Sirspud]

yeah he did such a terrible job of developing that a the team he took over WON IT ALL IN HIS FIRST YEAR. and they team he built from a losing team into a perennial winner actually played his new team in the final game.

last i checked quarterback is the most important position on the field. and oddly enough he took one journeyman quarterback that his team didnt want and he developed into an NFL MVP. he took another journeyman quarterback his team didnt want to a superbowl winning quarterback in his first year. and his 3rd quarterback went to the probowl under his watch.

yep the guys garbage. maybe u 2 in your infinite wisdom should be our next GM

You clearly have no idea what "developed" means. Nobody is saying that Gruden was a bad coach, but developing means you take young players and make them talented young players. Not take good players and win with them, which I assure you we are well aware of. I'm also aware that he didn't hit on almost all of his draft picks, including first rounders.

BTW, Dexter Jackson was the Super Bowl MVP, a player who was already there, and their QB was Brad Johnson, who was their QB before Gruden got there, and who Gruden tried to replace by bringing in Rob Johnson, but the other Johnson sucked so bad that Gruden stuck with Brad.

You may not agree with my assessment of Gruden as a coach, but the Bucs did. They fired him in 2008 for the exact things I am telling you about now, but what do I know? I only listen to Tampa Bay sports radio and Bucs coverage every day, and surely there is a possibility that somebody who doesn't even know the definition of develop could understand the situation better than I could.

 

[hightempo]

You clearly have no idea what "developed" means. Nobody is saying that Gruden was a bad coach, but developing means you take young players and make them talented young players. Not take good players and win with them, which I assure you we are well aware of. I'm also aware that he didn't hit on almost all of his draft picks, including first rounders.

BTW, Dexter Jackson was the Super Bowl MVP, a player who was already there, and their QB was Brad Johnson, who was their QB before Gruden got there, and who Gruden tried to replace by bringing in Rob Johnson, but the other Johnson sucked so bad that Gruden stuck with Brad.

You may not agree with my assessment of Gruden as a coach, but the Bucs did. They fired him in 2008 for the exact things I am telling you about now, but what do I know? I only listen to Tampa Bay sports radio and Bucs coverage every day, and surely there is a possibility that somebody who doesn't even know the definition of develop could understand the situation better than I could.

i lived in tampa the whole time bud. when u are missing 2 1sts and 2 2nd rounders, with aging veteran players, and other veterans with contracts expiring, in addition to existing problems with the salary cap. you are missing a bit of talent wouldnt you say? and yes he brought in rob johnson because rob johnson had great mobility, and starting experience - somebody needed to challenge for the starters job. he stuck with brad johnson didnt he? and brad johnson played pretty well in the playoffs with gruden calling plays didnt he?

oddly enough under these circumstances devoid of talent the bucs continued to win didnt they?

and i guess maybe quarterback doesnt matter to you - perhaps youre of the dave wandstedt, tony sparano school of thought. but seems to me rich gannon DEVELOPED from a journeyman into an allpro. i guess if that doesnt define "develop" for you heres a link - http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/develop

since grudens specialty is quarterbacks i find that rather revealing. u can make all the excuses u want. it doesnt change the fact that provided the front office and coach can achieve the same vision for the franchise. he is one of the 2 most qualified for the job and its NOT EVEN CLOSE.

 

[JerryD]

so why not get the minority candidate thing out of the way now. I say give herm edwards an interview. HELLO! YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME!!!

its a start.

but for real. this is why changing coaches really doesnt do anything. players who wont get their money demands met will tank and those who have their paychecks have tanked since day one. Marshall.

LOL ... better, why don't we look around & try to hire a minority?

It seems somewhat obvious alot of minority coaches are "overlooked" ... that means some of the better qualified coaches are minorities ... seems like a good bet with higher odds to me!! Al Davis is on top of this for a couple decades!!

Jackson at Oakland sure has them playing. Tomlin did great until talent eroded. GM Ozzie Newsome has Baltimore kicking butt & taking names ... my kinda guy!!!

 

[jason_taylor]

Gruden didn't develop a team into a super bowl champion...they were already made. They had been to 2 or 3 NFC championship games before he ever got there. Cowher has never been in charge of personnel decisions, who's to say he will be successful? That's as risky as finding that diamond in the rough. Gruden already proved he can't do a good job with personnel decisions.

Fans like you are the exact reason we didn't hire Ted Thompson, Jerry Reese and Mike Tomlin...all of which interviewed here at some point. Fans like you are the reason we've hired Bill Parcells, Jimmy Johnson, Nick Saban and even Wannstedt to some extent because he was a known commodity. Instant gratification is what you're looking for and it has led us to more misery.

imo if your lookin for a diamond in the rough got to the pond shop if your lookin for a head coach than Cowher is our guy,imo so you would rather look for a guy that shows he is hungry, sparano was hungry.and all of that your talking about,dosent mean anything,imo i would rather go with somebody thats been there and done that and has provin HE CAN GET THE JOB DONE,THERES NOWAY IN HELL ID WANT TO TAKE A CHANCE on a guy that looks like he is hungry exc. take a chance on him and the #1 pick in the draft, and be in the same spot as we are now ? coachless,so imo we cant just walk out and look at somebody and say hay he looks hungry ,lets get him for our head coach,noway in hell would i even think that way.imo , COWHER HAS PROVIN he can build a championship Team.and im possitive he could handel been in charge of personnel decisions,i am not wanting to try and guess on our next coach and hope he has what it takes/.theres just to much on the line /table to gamble it down the drain. so imo i want Cowher or Fisher,and then Gruden in that order.nothing more nothing less.....

 

[Sirspud]

i lived in tampa the whole time bud. when u are missing 2 1sts and 2 2nd rounders, with aging veteran players, and other veterans with contracts expiring, in addition to existing problems with the salary cap. you are missing a bit of talent wouldnt you say? and yes he brought in rob johnson because rob johnson had great mobility, and starting experience - somebody needed to challenge for the starters job. he stuck with brad johnson didnt he? and brad johnson played pretty well in the playoffs with gruden calling plays didnt he?

oddly enough under these circumstances devoid of talent the bucs continued to win didnt they?

and i guess maybe quarterback doesnt matter to you - perhaps youre of the dave wandstedt, tony sparano school of thought. but seems to me rich gannon DEVELOPED from a journeyman into an allpro. i guess if that doesnt define "develop" for you heres a link - http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/develop

since grudens specialty is quarterbacks i find that rather revealing. u can make all the excuses u want. it doesnt change the fact that provided the front office and coach can achieve the same vision for the franchise. he is one of the 2 most qualified for the job and its NOT EVEN CLOSE.

Gruden's specialty was QB's...which makes it all the more great that the most impressive QB in that franchise's history was drafted after he left.

 

[hightempo]

Gruden's specialty was QB's...which makes it all the more great that the most impressive QB in that franchise's history was drafted after he left.

really? maybe u need a history lesson my friend. ever heard of steve young? doug williams? vinny testaverde?

so gruden had a quarterback that has been to a probowl and won a superbowl, and another that was an allpro, and his other b in tampa went to the probowl and u are telling me the best qb in the franchises HISTORY is josh freeman??? WOW. guess this explains everything

 

[J. David Wannyheimer]

Gruden didn't develop a team into a super bowl champion...they were already made. They had been to 2 or 3 NFC championship games before he ever got there. Cowher has never been in charge of personnel decisions, who's to say he will be successful? That's as risky as finding that diamond in the rough. Gruden already proved he can't do a good job with personnel decisions. Fans like you are the exact reason we didn't hire Ted Thompson, Jerry Reese and Mike Tomlin...all of which interviewed here at some point. Fans like you are the reason we've hired Bill Parcells, Jimmy Johnson, Nick Saban and even Wannstedt to some extent because he was a known commodity. Instant gratification is what you're looking for and it has led us to more misery.

Gruden developed the Oakland Raiders, a team that stunk for years before he got there and stunk for years after he got traded to Tampa and then took Tony Dungy's perennial underachievers and beat the Raiders in the Super Bowl. The guy knows a thing or two.

 

[Sirspud]

really? maybe u need a history lesson my friend. ever heard of steve young? doug williams? vinny testaverde?

so gruden had a quarterback that has been to a probowl and won a superbowl, and another that was an allpro, and his other b in tampa went to the probowl and u are telling me the best qb in the franchises HISTORY is josh freeman??? WOW. guess this explains everything

When it's all said and done, yes. Freeman's season last year was better than any other QB in Bucs history. I'm not looking at the numbers, but I'm pretty sure they support me.

And I wasn't talking about the QB's who went on to have good careers once they weren't a Buc. Young was unadulterated terrible and the other two had their best moments elsewhere. Based on your logic, I guess the Bucs should have a championship banner for that Super Bowl Steve Young won for the other team.