Dolphins Leadership Failed Martin

[butta247]

Incognito was VOTED to the player leadership council by his fellow teammates.

---------- Post added at 10:10 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:09 PM ----------

What's crappy was Jon Martins play. Dude was quite possibly the worst tackle in the league. Glad to see him go.

 

[SkapePhin]

Coworkers calling my phone and leaving voicemails like that...? come on.. whether joking or not... its so unprofessional...rude..and downright hateful...

The locker room isnt "siding" with Incognito... i think many are going to say that everything in the locker room is normal. Your not going to hear any players call out Martin or Incognito.. cant make it anymore of a circus then it already is.

You are absolutely right, it is unprofessional, immature, disgusting... All those things. But as Crowder and other former players have stated, this isn't the regular workplace. I mean, how often do you shower with your coworkers at your office? Do some of them run around the office slapping each others bare nuts? That's the rub... This is a different world.

And the locker room absolutely does appear to be siding with Incognito. I have not heard one soundbyte from a player calling for Martin to come back home now that the big bully is gone. In addition, former players who currently have no skin in the game like Chas Olkick (sp?) and Javorskie Lane have also come out in support of Incognito.

 

[butta247]

I've bullied Martin for 8 games now from my living room I guess

 

[butta247]

Proof of players siding with incognito

"I know both of those guys personally. I like both of them," said wide receiver Mike Wallace, who added he doesn't believe the team's pranks and hazing went too far. "I love Richie. I think he's a great guy. I don't think he was out of hand. I have a lot of respect for Richie. I wish he was here."

 

[Heinegrabber]

I need to see where Martin actually TOLD someone within the organization of this stuff prior to yesterday. I have not seen or heard of it. To that point, those that think they are being harassed or bullied have a protocol to follow: tell the person doing the bullying to stop and if it continues, tell the authority figure within the institution.

I am not convinced that Martin did that.

How dare you put pressure on the witness in this fragile state. :boohoo:

 

[Canadianfishfan]

Those who are asking for the physical evidence and "who knew what and when" are missing the point about the type of leadership that was lacking.

We had an environment in which some members would kick other members, keep kicking them, continue kicking them, never pick them up, and anyone else who noticed looked the other way. Thats not right. Not only is that a crappy work environment, its one that is destined to fail. Is it any wonder that our offensive line has been pure crap for years? The members spent to much time looking over their shoulders instead of looking towards one another. They spent to much time trying to exploit one another instead of helping them out. And this went on for years.

Anyone who has spent any sort of time on this forum knows i think these sort of things start at the top. If you want to blame Philbin or Ross or Ireland, then i wont stop you. But i didnt make this post trying to point the finger at anyone specific. This was a systematic failure. We screwed up.

And just because all of this occurred in a locker room doesnt make it right. Just because athletes talk rough doesnt make this right. Like i said in the OP, theres a difference between toughness and sadism. I'll add onto that: theres a difference between tough love and dysfunction. We crossed the line a long time ago.

No-one is missing your point. Everyone is entitled to their opinions.

hard for me to accept your thesis when Philbin has said martin told him nothing. Players.. knew nothing.

Martin failed Martin. First you have to do SOMETHING. Like open his mouth.

He didn't do that. He had ample opportunity from April till now to speak up and take action.

My response isn't to defend Incognito. It is to state Martin handled this very poorly. Actually it has been reported that these voicemails were released to the team and media after speaking with his parents.

Be a man. Don't have mommy and daddy take care of things for you.

 

[laxcoach]

devil's advocate thought:

there is a possibility that Dolphins security and legal team has a handle on this, and believes Martin is posturing for an EEOC suit. Then, the voicemails put them in a bad immediate position. The prudent, corporate style procedure would be to notify the accused that he is suspended with pay during the investigation. They wouldn't be able to tell him outright that they believed him. Then, at some point they either let him go with cause, buy out his contract, or reinstate him.

The problem in this situation is that no one can wink-nod notify anyone -- not cogs, not martin, not teammates -- where they think this is going. All of these have access and the ear of the media.

Of course, when someone's dad gets drunk and goes off on the internet it paints the team in a corner. So the ship has sailed on now Cogs regardless.

 

[laxcoach]

Be a man. Don't have mommy and daddy take care of things for you.

As the son of an attorney, I am willing to bet that they have been drilling him with legalistic concepts since birth. When you get in a spot that hints of needing representation, you ask your attorney parent for advice. Attorneys think differently than normal people -- at least my dad does. Everything is based on a defensive mindset of protection from liability OR with an offensive mindset of getting what you believe you deserve.

I can remember being told in my teens if anything ever happens, never speak to a police officer no matter how innocent you are. I can remember being drilled never to sign anything without having dad look at it. The litany of never ending lessons can make you world weary and paranoid.

So, when your conduit to your team, an agent, is basically your legal representative... you have them talking to your parents before you let the agent do anything.

 

[finfan54]

My feelings so far are this:

Martin did what he felt he needed to do. What he does from this point on will tell me more about him. But he apparently kept these feelings secret from coach, management, and other players (maybe). So how can anyone be held responsible for which they knew nothing about the "subculture". More to come.

Incognito is a good guy. Like his teamates say. They are with him. There are plenty of african american males in that room. They say he is a good man. I dont think he is not.
But Richie also has a past. A well documented past that involves what I would call sadistic in nature. He has been much better on the field for the years he was here. No real problems with on the field stuff.

Which leads me to my theory. Richie has to get his ya' ya's some way some how. The latest thing is his "fraternity" as I would call it. Hazing, making rookies do stuff for him and his "brotherhood", and belittleing people along the way. Degrading name calling and racist slurs might be done under a guise of a fraternity, but can easily make someone feel less than welcome to that brotherhood.

I would never accept being called "big weirdo". That is degrading and is done in front of my peers. It would bother me if it continued after being a rookie a ton more. It is simply unproffessional in a proffesional sport. It is a high paying business. Incognito simply had his little fraternity gig here and it took a turn for the worst. Jonathan Martin is not a rookie but Incog continued to treat him as such. Why? Because he felt he could. Incog has a need for sadasm and when he cant get it on the field in dirty play, he has to have it off the field and within his own "brotherhood".

I cannot support Richie for his actions. He may very well be a good guy, but he is a good guy who has a Mr. Hide in him. Mike Wallace cant know what Martin is feeling because he was not treated the same as he. Its that simple. One mans view is his view of how there respected. Martin was not respected at all from what I can tell probly ever. He was just Richie's little bitch. And he couldnt piss and moan about it to coach although he may have tried to give clues. He cant go and bitch to his mates who are probly in line with the "fraternity". He cant do anything accept hold it in and one day blow up and just leave. He is in a situation where he is not having fun. He is not enjoying being a football player because he goes to work everyday having to think about Mr. Hyde coming out of Jeckyls shell.

Jonathan Martin is not a rookie. He is a second year professional Left Tackle turned RT because some veteran cant hold his own. I completely understand why people would defend both sides but you cannot look at it as taking sides. You have to look at it as a serious matter in a work environment. This is not the Marines. This is not Jail.

 

[ohall]

Martin failed himself.

 

[Spesh]

No-one is missing your point. Everyone is entitled to their opinions.

hard for me to accept your thesis when Philbin has said martin told him nothing. Players.. knew nothing.

Martin failed Martin. First you have to do SOMETHING. Like open his mouth.

He didn't do that. He had ample opportunity from April till now to speak up and take action.

My response isn't to defend Incognito. It is to state Martin handled this very poorly. Actually it has been reported that these voicemails were released to the team and media after speaking with his parents.

Be a man. Don't have mommy and daddy take care of things for you.

Yeah, he should have grabbed a gun to handle it. Right on. Manhood!

He didnt do anything because there was a standard established that meant everyone should piss on everyone else and if you didnt like it then you would receive threats and attempts at exploitation. He didnt say anything because his failure to conform meant he was the target.

This is basic stuff: America doesnt accept this sort of behavior. We have laws protecting the rights of employees and we are attempting to weed that crap out of schools. Theres a reason why Incognito was suspended: even the franchise knows theyve screwed up and this sort of behavior is considered unacceptable for our culture.

 

[laxcoach]

This is basic stuff: America doesnt accept this sort of behavior. We have laws protecting the rights of employees and we are attempting to weed that crap out of schools.

This bears repeating over and over. What we are hearing is very old-school fraternity like. It's just not accepted anymore.

 

[butta247]

Martins play was terrible, crying to his Mommy instead of the coach is a wus move, having Mommy take this to authorities shows how weak this kid actually is....talk to the coach about it, your agent, position coach, etc.

This was a personal issue Martin had with Cog and never went to any team official about it. Martin has taken a personal issue he had with a teammate a pulled the organization into the mud.

This kid should never play another down in the NFL.

 

[butta247]

Cogs was disciplined and will never play for Miami again. This will go away for the team unless Martin has proof he notified a team official.

Martin will bear the brunt of this for his short NFL career.

 

[UFGators]

Martins play was terrible, crying to his Mommy instead of the coach is a wus move, having Mommy take this to authorities shows how weak this kid actually is....talk to the coach about it, your agent, position coach, etc.

This was a personal issue Martin had with Cog and never went to any team official about it. Martin has taken a personal issue he had with a teammate a pulled the organization into the mud.

This kid should never play another down in the NFL.

Because, everyone should tolerate abuse in workplace otherwise lose the right to make a living. smh.