Don't Blame Saban

[Shouright]

I see a lot of threads blaming Saban and lack of discipline for the penalty issue.

Think about it this way: do the players know it hurts the team to commit a penalty? Do they know how to stop themselves from committing a penalty?

Of course the answers are "yes." If we're talking about a Pee-Wee league here, then I'm on board with the "the coach must correct this" approach. Pee-Wee players need to learn self-discipline not to commit penalties.

But we're talking about grown men here. These guys have played organized football SINCE Pee-Wee league. They shouldn't need a coach to discipline them anymore. If they do, they should be sent packing immediately. We're not paying guys millions of dollars who need a babysitter.

Here's a great quote by Saban from yesterday:

"It's not going to change until everybody assumes responsibility for it," Saban said. "When it means enough, it'll get fixed."

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/dolphins/content/sports/epaper/2005/10/10/fins_stoda_1010.html

The penalty issue is a chance for this team to develop some REAL LEADERSHIP among the players, which has been lacking for years now. SOMEONE ON THE TEAM (or a group of guys) needs to step up and address this issue with his teammates and make it known that it needs to be corrected.

If Saban does it himself, all it does is set him up as the authority figure that the team must bow down to or suffer the consequences (i.e., babysitting). If a player or a group of players does it, it creates leadership, which is what any great team has an abundance of.

I think Saban should hold out for the latter, and his quote hints that he will.

 

[Canadianfishfan]

For all the leaders on this team I am completely dumbfounded by these penalties and that lack of vocal leadership shown on the field by these players. I was looking to see if anyone was chewing anyone out... if anyone was getting it from the coaches, I saw nothing...At one point I think I saw JT laughing on the sideline...I dont want to see laughter.. I want to see guys getting their Sh*t together and rallying the troops and leading and willing this team to better performances.

 

[Shouright]

For all the leaders on this team I am completely dumbfounded by these penalties and that lack of vocal leadership shown on the field by these players. I was looking to see if anyone was chewing anyone out... if anyone was getting it from the coaches, I saw nothing...At one point I think I saw JT laughing on the sideline...I dont want to see laughter.. I want to see guys getting their Sh*t together and rallying the troops and leading and willing this team to better performances.

And that's exactly what this team has been missing for years. Here's our chance to develop it, IF Saban is smart enough to stay out of it.

When Bill Parcells has crappy practices, he and the coaching staff walk off the field and tell the players to run the rest of the practice. Now tell me THAT doesn't develop leaders.

 

[ATS16]

Hummmm, but when the team played like crap last year EVERYONE blamed Wanny. I guess we were wrong last year too?

 

[Shouright]

Hummmm, but when the team played like crap last year EVERYONE blamed Wanny. I guess we were wrong last year too?

You're mixing two issues here. The team played like crap last year for reasons that the coaching staff was responsible for (preparing for other teams, gameplanning, play-calling, making adjustments, etc.). The coaches aren't responsible for a guy jumping offsides.

Saban has already pled mea culpa to having the team unprepared for the Jets game. Now it's the players' turn to blame something on themselves and create some leaders by doing so.

 

[Jnaledu3]

I think the mass penalties have to do with 2 things..

First, the players are still adjusting to new systems and they are struggling- especially the defense. Even Taylor and Thomas are screwing up, and if they are screwing up, you know the other players are screwing up more.

Also, the Fins have played in 8 striaght games before the bye week and they looked quite rusty coming into this game. They didnt get it going until the second half.

Its going to take some time for the defense to fully swallow Saban new scheme, which is more complicated that what they have been playing under Wanny.

 

[ATS16]

Are the coaches not responsible for Gus's preparation? You can not take chances against that defensive back field, period, but yet time and time again, even in the red zone that is what happen. I'm not tryig to admonish Gus of blame but niether am I trying to clean the coaches slate I think that's wrong also. I remember the Shula days after a bye week we almost always won and that has to be because of preparation.

 

[Shouright]

Are the coaches not responsible for Gus's preparation? You can not take chances against that defensive back field, period, but yet time and time again, even in the red zone that is what happen. I'm not tryig to admonish Gus of blame but niether am I trying to clean the coaches slate I think that's wrong also. I remember the Shula days after a bye week we almost always won and that has to be because of preparation.

Yeah but I'm talking about penalties, not turnovers. And I'm talking about the kind of penalties that are based on self-discipline, like offsides, taunting, etc.

 

[Ohio Fanatic]

For all the leaders on this team I am completely dumbfounded by these penalties and that lack of vocal leadership shown on the field by these players. I was looking to see if anyone was chewing anyone out... if anyone was getting it from the coaches, I saw nothing...At one point I think I saw JT laughing on the sideline...I dont want to see laughter.. I want to see guys getting their Sh*t together and rallying the troops and leading and willing this team to better performances.

maybe because it's our leaders that are commiting the penalties. JT, and McMike for starters. Lead by example.

 

[Shouright]

I think the mass penalties have to do with 2 things..

First, the players are still adjusting to new systems and they are struggling- especially the defense. Even Taylor and Thomas are screwing up, and if they are screwing up, you know the other players are screwing up more.

Also, the Fins have played in 8 striaght games before the bye week and they looked quite rusty coming into this game. They didnt get it going until the second half.

Its going to take some time for the defense to fully swallow Saban new scheme, which is more complicated that what they have been playing under Wanny.

I do think digesting the scheme on defense will take some time, and this is one of the big reasons the defense looks "jumpy" (think offsides) before the snap. I watched the "NFL Game of the Week" on the NFL Network, and it was our game vs. Carolina. Even George Edwards, the LBs coach, got mixed up with some of Saban's terminology, telling Zach to think of a certain scheme when he was really intending for him to think of a different one. ZACH had to correct him.

 

[Jnaledu3]

Are the coaches not responsible for Gus's preparation? You can not take chances against that defensive back field, period, but yet time and time again, even in the red zone that is what happen. I'm not tryig to admonish Gus of blame but niether am I trying to clean the coaches slate I think that's wrong also. I remember the Shula days after a bye week we almost always won and that has to be because of preparation.

They had to throw against them. Otherwise, its Wanny ball again and teams will know that we will ONLY run the ball.

As for Gus, he underthrew some passes. The Int would have put them at the 10 yard line, and the other overthow would have been a TD. Nobody ever said Gus was great but hes all we got.

 

[Shouright]

maybe because it's our leaders that are commiting the penalties. JT, and McMike for starters. Lead by example.

Right, but I'm not real sure what kind of leaders those guys really are. Sure they're two of the best players we have, but that doesn't mean they're good leaders.

 

[Jnaledu3]

I do think digesting the scheme on defense will take some time, and this is one of the big reasons the defense looks "jumpy" (think offsides) before the snap. I watched the "NFL Game of the Week" on the NFL Network, and it was our game vs. Carolina. Even George Edwards, the LBs coach, got mixed up with some of Saban's terminology, telling Zach to think of a certain scheme when he was really intending for him to think of a different one. ZACH had to correct him.

Thats strange. Wasnt Edwards with Saban at LSU?

 

[FinfanInBuffalo]

I see a lot of threads blaming Saban and lack of discipline for the penalty issue.

Think about it this way: do the players know it hurts the team to commit a penalty? Do they know how to stop themselves from committing a penalty?

Of course the answers are "yes." If we're talking about a Pee-Wee league here, then I'm on board with the "the coach must correct this" approach. Pee-Wee players need to learn self-discipline not to commit penalties.

But we're talking about grown men here. These guys have played organized football SINCE Pee-Wee league. They shouldn't need a coach to discipline them anymore. If they do, they should be sent packing immediately. We're not paying guys millions of dollars who need a babysitter.

Here's a great quote by Saban from yesterday:
The penalty issue is a chance for this team to develop some REAL LEADERSHIP among the players, which has been lacking for years now. SOMEONE ON THE TEAM (or a group of guys) needs to step up and address this issue with his teammates and make it known that it needs to be corrected.

If Saban does it himself, all it does is set him up as the authority figure that the team must bow down to or suffer the consequences (i.e., babysitting). If a player or a group of players does it, it creates leadership, which is what any great team has an abundance of.

I think Saban should hold out for the latter, and his quote hints that he will.

IMO, you missed one important part of the quote. "When it means enough". So far, the coaches have not made it mean enough.

 

[Shouright]

Thats strange. Wasnt Edwards with Saban at LSU?

Nope -- he was with the Browns I believe. And he was their D coordinator at one point too. Saban's "phone book" of a defense must be real complex.