Free Agents... worth spending big? interesting article | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Free Agents... worth spending big? interesting article

I am Bane said:
interesting article here.... plus interesting to see the history of Miami in FA, and how awful some of the moves were. Some good guys brought in though too!!!

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/...ble-success-in-nfl-20150130-story.html#page=1
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FA for me (arm chair GM) is to bring in 1 maybe 2 high prize PROVEN guys. Normally these type of players don't hit the open market your...Suh, Dez Bryant, Julius Thomas, etc...

The bread and butter of a team is the draft and player development. The best teams can draft and develop, helping keep the salary cap in check and prevents them from just throwing money at mid-tier guys because they have open roster slots (Wheeler, Ellerbe, Hartline).

You draft a 3rd/4th/5th rounder and expect him to become a decent contributor to the franchise in a few years, some may even become full time starters and real NFL caliber players (Jenkins, Clay, Jones).

You draft a 1st/2nd rounder and expect him to pretty much become a automatic and impact player for the franchise. (Landry, Pouncey)

Dream team builds usually fail, and are only built for short term success (Eagles).

The Packers have mastered the art of building teams in the draft. On the other hand the Pats have mastered the art of taking publix bag boys and turning them into Pro-Bowl players, this of course aided by a HOF QB/HC combo. ********* (note the asteriscs). Sp?
 
I'd much rather see the Dolphins use $60 million this offseason to sign five free agents at positions of need - for example receiver Leonard Hankerson, tailback Frank Gore, safety Antrel Rolle, inside linebacker Sean Weatherspoon, and defensive tackle Terrance Knighton - than give Suh a $93 million deal that guarantees him $53 million.
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Of those 5 only Rolle, Weatherspoon and Knighton would interest me. Hank...as much as I love my guys from the U...shouldn't be an option when there are better options in the draft. Gore is another excellent player from the U but this draft is so filled with RBs it just doesn't make sense to spend that much money on a back with as much mileage as Gore has....that tread is wearing thin.
 
If it was easy we'd all be GMs. I think strong, stable orgs with little yearly turnover in terms of admin. Is necessary to win. The flip is lack of winning makes a stable organization nearly impossible.
 
MRojas4 said:
FA for me (arm chair GM) is to bring in 1 maybe 2 high prize PROVEN guys. Normally these type of players don't hit the open market your...Suh, Dez Bryant, Julius Thomas, etc...

The bread and butter of a team is the draft and player development. The best teams can draft and develop, helping keep the salary cap in check and prevents them from just throwing money at mid-tier guys because they have open roster slots (Wheeler, Ellerbe, Hartline).

You draft a 3rd/4th/5th rounder and expect him to become a decent contributor to the franchise in a few years, some may even become full time starters and real NFL caliber players (Jenkins, Clay, Jones).

You draft a 1st/2nd rounder and expect him to pretty much become a automatic and impact player for the franchise. (Landry, Pouncey)

Dream team builds usually fail, and are only built for short term success (Eagles).

The Packers have mastered the art of building teams in the draft. On the other hand the Pats have mastered the art of taking publix bag boys and turning them into Pro-Bowl players, this of course aided by a HOF QB/HC combo. ********* (note the asteriscs). Sp?
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Hartline is a guy that was drafted and developed and has become a solid starter. You show your anti Hartline bias by lumping him in with Ellerbe and Wheeler, and in so doing you contradict yourself.
 
jlfin said:
Hartline is a guy that was drafted and developed and has become a solid starter. You show your anti Hartline bias by lumping him in with Ellerbe and Wheeler, and in so doing you contradict yourself.
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Correct, Hartline was a development guy.

Decent WR that we over-paid as a FA because we had nothing else.
 
I'd be all in on Cobb and Franklin and the draft 1-2 offense the rest defense.

We have been so bad for so long at drafting that we always have to dive into FA with recklessness.

Hickey did a solid job last year lets see what we can do this year!
 
MRojas4 said:
FA for me (arm chair GM) is to bring in 1 maybe 2 high prize PROVEN guys. Normally these type of players don't hit the open market your...Suh, Dez Bryant, Julius Thomas, etc...

The bread and butter of a team is the draft and player development. The best teams can draft and develop, helping keep the salary cap in check and prevents them from just throwing money at mid-tier guys because they have open roster slots (Wheeler, Ellerbe, Hartline).

You draft a 3rd/4th/5th rounder and expect him to become a decent contributor to the franchise in a few years, some may even become full time starters and real NFL caliber players (Jenkins, Clay, Jones).
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This point clicked with me. It's infuriating to see an organization throw money at people because they are decent players just because they feel they have to fill a roster spot. The great teams find their talent through the draft and are capable of picking up the scraps other teams have thrown out and making them fit their system. Sometimes that average player they are throwing money at may be a statistical upgrade to the current core, but is that "upgrade" necessarily going to yield positive production within the system? That's the key. Just because a player may be a better athlete or produced enough to get noticed, doesn't mean that they will necessarily produce in a new system. I feel like the Dolphins have been pretty bad at bringing in FA's that fit the bill. Best examples are Wheeler and Ellerbe.

The short answer is exactly what you said, great teams built from the ground up will always yield sustained success compared to gap-filling through high priced FA's. It keeps costs low so players can be developed and churned to produce more players that can be developed and churned. As long as the core is good, the new players can develop within the system. It's the circle of a good franchise. Broncos are a great example of a team that relies on FA's. Sure, they're really good now, but they will be god awful once Peyton retires and the UFA's don't want to be on an organization that will take years to compete.

Good post Rojas.
 
IMO unless you can sign a FA that is an organizational changer then we are better served signing multiple players and even more important drafting well and developing those picks
 
mialuv13 said:
This point clicked with me. It's infuriating to see an organization throw money at people because they are decent players just because they feel they have to fill a roster spot. The great teams find their talent through the draft and are capable of picking up the scraps other teams have thrown out and making them fit their system. Sometimes that average player they are throwing money at may be a statistical upgrade to the current core, but is that "upgrade" necessarily going to yield positive production within the system? That's the key. Just because a player may be a better athlete or produced enough to get noticed, doesn't mean that they will necessarily produce in a new system. I feel like the Dolphins have been pretty bad at bringing in FA's that fit the bill. Best examples are Wheeler and Ellerbe.

The short answer is exactly what you said, great teams built from the ground up will always yield sustained success compared to gap-filling through high priced FA's. It keeps costs low so players can be developed and churned to produce more players that can be developed and churned. As long as the core is good, the new players can develop within the system. It's the circle of a good franchise. Broncos are a great example of a team that relies on FA's. Sure, they're really good now, but they will be god awful once Peyton retires and the UFA's don't want to be on an organization that will take years to compete.

Good post Rojas.
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That said, our best players were and are Wake, Grimes, Starks, Albert, and Wallace who were all FA's.

Where would we have been without them? Very likely drafting much higher but, that hasn't worked out very well either.
 
MiamiMuss said:
I'd be all in on Cobb and Franklin and the draft 1-2 offense the rest defense.

We have been so bad for so long at drafting that we always have to dive into FA with recklessness.

Hickey did a solid job last year lets see what we can do this year!
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Cobb is a VG receiver but, the last 4 years has been used almost always as a slot WR where we have Landry. Not a good fit.
 
I agree with many comments throughout this... FA is important if you bring in 1-2 talented guys that will fit in your offensive and defensive schemes. Its hard to always find a guy in FA also that is in his prime or heading into his prime... very rare. Usually many FAs are released for reasons that the team knew or saw the decline or issues.

We over the years have spent so much money on guys that seem to be brought in mostly cause of name and to fill holes that we had. We may of misused these players and/or just didnt evaluate them well enough to fit our schemes.

Bringing in a Grimes, a Wake, Starks, and Albert are examples of moves that will help our team more than just pumping money at others to fill holes.

Gotta build the team through the draft. DEVELOP!!!
 
****...I don't like being on the same page as Omar...Hankerson, Rolle, Knighton and to a lesser degree Gore are all targets of mine.... Overall, it's not good practice to pay for elite talent in FA, I mean look at Mike Wallace, much better ways of using your resources.

My philosophy is I love the mid-tier, I fill as many holes with guys who have produced and have as much room to grow as possible. By doing that you open up the draft for BPA. This year I'd sign 2-3 guys to deals that are greater than 2 years. Franklin, Dan Williams and Chris Culliver. All are young, all are mid-tier FA's and all have room to grow. They also have performed at a very solid level over their young careers. Franklin has excelled at everything asked, Williams has excelled as a space eater and Culliver would be the biggest role of the dice of the three, but has been a very solid cover corner. Then I fill the rest of the slots with decent stop gaps on 1 or 2 year deals who can excel or get passed over by draft picks. The fewer holes I have entering the draft, the easier it is for me to add talent regardless of position.
 
FearTheBeard said:
****...I don't like being on the same page as Omar...Hankerson, Rolle, Knighton and to a lesser degree Gore are all targets of mine.... Overall, it's not good practice to pay for elite talent in FA, I mean look at Mike Wallace, much better ways of using your resources.
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The question is where else could the team have spent their money? I would normally agree but, this team has been far from normal, aside from their records for man a year.
 
Southbeach 2 said:
The question is where else could the team have spent their money? I would normally agree but, this team has been far from normal, aside from their records for man a year.
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Just don't spend it, roll it over if need be. It wasn't a very good class to begin with in FA, find a stop gap and draft someone. I would've signed Jennings but he got overpaid, Wallace was never worth the paycheck. Opens up money that can be used elsewhere. Could've signed Wes instead of Hart that year. Also have some foresight, find that FA WR a year early when you starting the garbage you are coming into the season.

When it comes down to it, do I want Suh for x-amount, or Franklin and Knighton for example. I'll take two more than likely solid players over one great one.

When you don't have a foundation, you can't put that many eggs in one basket. Mario Williams to the bills, Mike Wallace here, the examples are endless.
 
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