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dont fumble

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Hi everyone, hope you enjoyed the game vs. the Panthers. I would like to express some bad feelings I have about our defense (yes, defense). We all know the third preseason game is the most important one, so I take this game more serious than any other preseason game. I know the stats are great and I also know that we will have a very good defense, but there are some things that bother me and I think we could do better (and it’s all about process, isn’t it?:wink:):


Secondary:

They played great despite missing Daniels. On the other hand the Panthers missed Smith, an even bigger loss. Delhomme also made them look better because he was of target yesterday. But that were maybe 40 yards and a couple of first downs, so that is no area of concern. The secondary also played outstanding vs. the run, stopping Foster and Williams on potential long runs on the outside. Which brings me to the


Linebackers:

Where the hell are these guys??? Thomas (2 Tackles, 0 Assists), Crowder (0,1) Spragan (0,0), Newman (1,0), Pope (1,1), Labinjo (2,0). That’s it. Linebackers total tackles: (6,2). OK, there is nothing they can do vs. runs over the middle since most of the time our line stops them for no gain. But I just don’t feel comfortable when our defensive backs have to make 2 to 4 open field tackles a game. Here is a breakdown of the runs by the Panthers, the yardage and the Player who made the stop (DL,LB,DB):

Left End: 5/Goodman; -3/Roth; 4/Allen, -4/Newman


Left Tackle: 1/Zgonina; 15/Hill


Left Guard: 0/Traylor; 4/Zgonina; 3/Shaw; 14/Hunt


Middle: 4/Traylor; 0/JT,BigD; 2/Wilkinson; 9/Thomas; 0/Evans


Right Guard: 0/Allen,Hill; 7/Carter; 1/Crowder,Pope; -1/Roth, -1/Labinjo; -1/Labinjo,Shaw


Right Tackle: 4/Roth


Right End: 9/Thomas, 0/Allen; 3/Mitchell




The DL had 12,5 stops for 20 yards
The LB had 5,5 stops for 13 yards
The DB had 7 stops for 41 yards (very good for DB!)

In fact, the DB had more stops than the LB!


(There should also be noted, that Thomas had two tackles which were not counted because of penaltys.)




So, what exactly are the Linebackers doing? They may have above average coverage responsibilities in a Saban defense but that’s no reason to be ineffective vs. the run.
I know one thing our Linebackers do and I don’t like it at all: They blitz a lot. Nothing against blitzing, but our blitzing is bad. We almost never get through the line, absolutely no pressure, together with the


Defensive Line:

They don’t get a lot of pressure, too. Many sacks this preseason were coverage sacks. Very often, opposing Quarterbacks have 3 to 5 seconds before their pocket collapses, whether we blitz or not. I know, we were second in sacks last season and we will get our sacks this year, but not enough relative (:wink:) to the people we send to the Quarterback. And this is not only about sacks, it’s also about hurries and forced incomplete passes.
Against the run there is no question about our defensive line.


Maybe some of you can explain the scheme to me. I really would like to know what you guys think about the Linebacker play and the blitzing. To make it clear: I’m not criticizing any players, I just have some problems with the system despite its statistical success.
 
don't fumble said:
Hi everyone, hope you enjoyed the game vs. the Panthers. I would like to express some bad feelings I have about our defense (yes, defense). We all know the third preseason game is the most important one, so I take this game more serious than any other preseason game. I know the stats are great and I also know that we will have a very good defense, but there are some things that bother me and I think we could do better (and it’s all about process, isn’t it?:wink:):


Secondary:

They played great despite missing Daniels. On the other hand the Panthers missed Smith, an even bigger loss. Delhomme also made them look better because he was of target yesterday. But that were maybe 40 yards and a couple of first downs, so that is no area of concern. The secondary also played outstanding vs. the run, stopping Foster and Williams on potential long runs on the outside. Which brings me to the


Linebackers:

Where the hell are these guys??? Thomas (2 Tackles, 0 Assists), Crowder (0,1) Spragan (0,0), Newman (1,0), Pope (1,1), Labinjo (2,0). That’s it. Linebackers total tackles: (6,2). OK, there is nothing they can do vs. runs over the middle since most of the time our line stops them for no gain. But I just don’t feel comfortable when our defensive backs have to make 2 to 4 open field tackles a game. Here is a breakdown of the runs by the Panthers, the yardage and the Player who made the stop (DL,LB,DB):

Left End: 5/Goodman; -3/Roth; 4/Allen, -4/Newman


Left Tackle: 1/Zgonina; 15/Hill


Left Guard: 0/Traylor; 4/Zgonina; 3/Shaw; 14/Hunt


Middle: 4/Traylor; 0/JT,BigD; 2/Wilkinson; 9/Thomas; 0/Evans


Right Guard: 0/Allen,Hill; 7/Carter; 1/Crowder,Pope; -1/Roth, -1/Labinjo; -1/Labinjo,Shaw


Right Tackle: 4/Roth


Right End: 9/Thomas, 0/Allen; 3/Mitchell




The DL had 12,5 stops for 20 yards
The LB had 5,5 stops for 13 yards
The DB had 7 stops for 41 yards (very good for DB!)

In fact, the DB had more stops than the LB!


(There should also be noted, that Thomas had two tackles which were not counted because of penaltys.)




So, what exactly are the Linebackers doing? They may have above average coverage responsibilities in a Saban defense but that’s no reason to be ineffective vs. the run.
I know one thing our Linebackers do and I don’t like it at all: They blitz a lot. Nothing against blitzing, but our blitzing is bad. We almost never get through the line, absolutely no pressure, together with the


Defensive Line:

They don’t get a lot of pressure, too. Many sacks this preseason were coverage sacks. Very often, opposing Quarterbacks have 3 to 5 seconds before their pocket collapses, whether we blitz or not. I know, we were second in sacks last season and we will get our sacks this year, but not enough relative (:wink:) to the people we send to the Quarterback. And this is not only about sacks, it’s also about hurries and forced incomplete passes.
Against the run there is no question about our defensive line.


Maybe some of you can explain the scheme to me. I really would like to know what you guys think about the Linebacker play and the blitzing. To make it clear: I’m not criticizing any players, I just have some problems with the system despite its statistical success.



this actually isnt a bad post. im worried about the CBs for obvious reasons. But our safeties have been playing well and with Daniels back and Jason Allen more reps, we are only going to get better...

our LBs stopping the run, thats the least of my worries. Zach made a couple nice plays, but really wasnt great yesterday. Crowder was in on every play it seemed. Our DLine was so great agaisnt the run inside, the LBs never really got a shot on most plays, as their either got taken down at the line or had to bounce it outside to our CBs/Ss.

Now Pass rush is a little concern with me. Hopefully Kevin carter can pick it up a little bit, cause we need him to rush the passer better. If JT is the only one putting a good rush on the passer, we are going to be in trouble. Our LBs simply have not blitzed well, last season or this preseason. This is one reason i havent understood Keith Newman not playing some with the 1st or 2nd string team, he has blitzed really well out of the LB position.

we will see how everything works out, but its somewhat concerning, but obviously with our play makers on offense, defense is what is holding us back from being on top of the league.
 
I always heard that your not suppose to show everything in preseason. That being said I'm sure their is plenty of blitzes and D-line stunts that weren't shown and we still doubled their yards and if not for mistakse on St's we would have beat the soon to be NFC champs. The sacondarie was awesome and no one can stop Steve but we did a fine job on Keshawn and had delhomme crying and bitching on the feild especially besauce he couldn't hit his Wr's.
 
have you EVER watched Zach Thomas play a preseason game? If you haven't then this post makes sense. He has about half the fire in a preaseason game than in a regular season game.
 
I agree with you about our LBs. They showed very poor blitzing abilities possibly because of a lack of size and speed, and they seemed like they weren't able to cut through the o-line. Don't get me wrong, I think our front 7 is FANTASTIC, especially against the run.

But if we r gonna run the 3-4 effectively then we need another rusher. Besides JT this team doesn't have a legitimate rusher that is a threat on every down. I love Spragan and Newman, but they don't exactly strike fear in the hearts of opposing QBs.
 
SweetLou said:
I agree with you about our LBs. They showed very poor blitzing abilities possibly because of a lack of size and speed, and they seemed like they weren't able to cut through the o-line. Don't get me wrong, I think our front 7 is FANTASTIC, especially against the run.

But if we r gonna run the 3-4 effectively then we need another rusher. Besides JT this team doesn't have a legitimate rusher that is a threat on every down. I love Spragan and Newman, but they don't exactly strike fear in the hearts of opposing QBs.

Did you watch last year's preseason? They couldn't put any pressure on any quarterbacks last preseason. The chicken littles were going crazy about how stupid Saban's defense is and how they cannot put pressure on the quarterback.

Go to the REAL season and Miami breaks the sack record.

Miami looks head and shoulders better on defense this preseason compared to last year.

I am sure when the real season starts they will have a good shot of breaking their record.
 
Dol-Fan Dupree said:
Did you watch last year's preseason? They couldn't put any pressure on any quarterbacks last preseason. The chicken littles were going crazy about how stupid Saban's defense is and how they cannot put pressure on the quarterback.

Go to the REAL season and Miami breaks the sack record.

Miami looks head and shoulders better on defense this preseason compared to last year.

I am sure when the real season starts they will have a good shot of breaking their record.


our LBs didnt blitz well last year either.
 
Dol-Fan Dupree said:
Did you watch last year's preseason? They couldn't put any pressure on any quarterbacks last preseason. The chicken littles were going crazy about how stupid Saban's defense is and how they cannot put pressure on the quarterback.

Go to the REAL season and Miami breaks the sack record.

Miami looks head and shoulders better on defense this preseason compared to last year.

I am sure when the real season starts they will have a good shot of breaking their record.

Yes, they broke the record last season. The stats are good, no question. We have 9 sacks so far this preseason, that's is not bad. But despite breaking the record last season, not everyone was happy with the blitzes last season because we often didn't get the pressure relative to the people we send. The absolute number of sacks was good; it still was not very effective. And I see the same problem this season.
 
Dol-Fan Dupree said:
Did you watch last year's preseason? They couldn't put any pressure on any quarterbacks last preseason. The chicken littles were going crazy about how stupid Saban's defense is and how they cannot put pressure on the quarterback.

Go to the REAL season and Miami breaks the sack record.

Miami looks head and shoulders better on defense this preseason compared to last year.

I am sure when the real season starts they will have a good shot of breaking their record.

Dude, we r talking about the LBs ability to blitz, not the pass rushing ability of the entire defense. If u looked at last years stats, we scored 49 sacks and about 35 of those were generated from defensive LINEMEN. Taking in account the fact that JT is a DE/OLB, none of our starting LBs were legitimate pass rushing threats. JT had 12 sacks, Zach had 2, Spragan had one, and Crowder had none.

In order for the 3-4 system to work we need another LB that can rush around the edge effectively, can play coverage with the TEs, and stop the run. That player isnt currently on the roster and probably wont be this year. On another note, I don't believe we broke the franchise sack record but merely tied it. I maybe wrong, but I think there was a play at the end of the year that could have been a sack but was called back. We were suppose to petition to have it changed, but I don't think it happened.
 
don't fumble said:
Yes, they broke the record last season. The stats are good, no question. We have 9 sacks so far this preseason, that's is not bad. But despite breaking the record last season, not everyone was happy with the blitzes last season because we often didn't get the pressure relative to the people we send. The absolute number of sacks was good; it still was not very effective. And I see the same problem this season.

Not during the 6 game winning streak. Miami got good pressure as the season went on.

You don't get 49 sacks without pressure.

I am telling you if last year is any indication, Miami is going to have a solid pass rush this year.
 
Dol-Fan Dupree said:
Not during the 6 game winning streak. Miami got good pressure as the season went on.

You don't get 49 sacks without pressure.

I am telling you if last year is any indication, Miami is going to have a solid pass rush this year.


I never said we didn't get pressure. We did, I know that. But with good pressure relative to the people send (effective blitzing) you don't finish as bad on 3rd down defense as we did. This was not only R. Howard fault.
 
don't fumble said:
I never said we didn't get pressure. We did, I know that. But with good pressure relative to the people send (effective blitzing) you don't finish as bad on 3rd down defense as we did. This was not only R. Howard fault.

And yet so far they are looking better this year at 3rd down defense. In only preseason. Maybe I am missing something.

In a more basic defense without the wrinkles they are looking sharp and getting good pressure.
 
We are currently learning pages 300-500 of the defensive playbook. By next year we should be dipping into pages 600-900. Otherwise, dont worry about the defense, the DB's are playing fine and the poster acted all worried and then just said how good they all played last night. I dont get it.
 
don't fumble said:
Yes, they broke the record last season. The stats are good, no question. We have 9 sacks so far this preseason, that's is not bad. But despite breaking the record last season, not everyone was happy with the blitzes last season because we often didn't get the pressure relative to the people we send. The absolute number of sacks was good; it still was not very effective. And I see the same problem this season.
I think maybe you're not taking into account that the other team is trying to beat our blitz or block it....I know that sounds like over-simplification of what you're talking about but, it really does come down to that. Not every blitz is going to get through, especially not every blitz in the third game of preseason.

Trust me, when you put the QB on the ground with the ball in his hands 49 times in one season, you need to keep doing exactly what you're doing, and I don't think there is any question that this team is going to be able to do the same thing this year if everybody stays healthy.
 
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