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GB zone blocking scheme and DT

z0eboy said:
Daniel Thomas is a bust for what we did to get him, I honestly hated the pick.

We are running a spread offense which requires more man blocking, why the hell would you zone block if your spreading the offense? Just hit the guy infront of you DUH!!!
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Philbin, from everything I have read, primarily employs a zone scheme in his offense.
 
DKphin said:
Philbin, from everything I have read, primarily employs a zone scheme in his offense.
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Could you provide a link? Please allow it to be something from his new regime not something from GB inwhich Mike McCarthy was running the show on offense.
 
z0eboy said:
Are you serious? Look how bad florida was last year they need ALL the help they can get.

Zone blocking is better used when your trying to trick defensive lineman by pulling lineman in different directions. Its almost like your trying to stunt block compared to defensive linemen trying to stunt and switch positions while rushing. There is NO benefit in zone blocking when passing UNLESS your trying to set up a screen pass or draw play because there is a "run/screen pass" option built into the play.

Side note - the only other time zone pass protections is "decent" is if your offensive lineman are a bunch of BEAST and maybe 1 of them need double team help. For example your starting LT goes down to injury and you put your back up scrubb, so why not zone block assign to help his scrubb arss out.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zone_blocking
Zone blocking is a technique in American football that is a simple and effective scheme for creating lanes for running plays.
In a zone blocking scheme, fleet-footedness and athletic ability trump size as desirable qualities in offensive linemen. Coordination and technique matter more than muscle in implementing a successful scheme because defensive linemen are often double-teamed at the point of attack. Creating movement on the defensive line is more important than opening a specific hole in the defense.
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Florida wasn't a zone blocking team last year. They were when they ran Dan Mullen's spread. There is a reason they call their staple play the "zone read".
 
KB21 said:
Florida wasn't a zone blocking team last year. They were when they ran Dan Mullen's spread. There is a reason they call their staple play the "zone read".
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That was my point... you guys keep saying zone blocking scheme and my post clearly states the only type of plays where a zone scheme would work.

In other words college football is simple and due to the gap in talent teams like florida can get away with crappy zone reads (screens, draws and options) but when they play top 25 ranked teams they look like crap.

If you wanna crown their arss then crown their arss!!!! :thanks:
 
z0eboy said:
Are you serious? Look how bad florida was last year they need ALL the help they can get.

Zone blocking is better used when your trying to trick defensive lineman by pulling lineman in different directions. Its almost like your trying to stunt block compared to defensive linemen trying to stunt and switch positions while rushing. There is NO benefit in zone blocking when passing UNLESS your trying to set up a screen pass or draw play because there is a "run/screen pass" option built into the play.
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Zone blocking has very little, if anything, to do with trying to trick defensive linemen. As former Notre Dame football head coach Bob Davie explains it http://static.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/davie/1440703.html
Zone blocking in the running game is when two or three offensive linemen work in tandem as opposed to each offensive lineman having a specific, predetermined man to block. Zone blocking involves the center, guard, tackle and tight end working in combination to block an area with an emphasis on double-teaming the defensive linemen who are aligned on the line of scrimmage.

The concept is for two adjacent linemen to come off in unison and attack a defensive line to the play side or to the side the ball carrier is going. The advantage, as opposed to man blocking, is that you create a double-team with two players blocking one defensive lineman. This allows the offensive linemen to be aggressive because he knows he has help if his defensive lineman was to pinch inside. It also provides movement at the point of attack, which can open creases for the running back.

Zone blocking initially starts out as a double team at the point of attack on the down defensive linemen, but the beauty of it is that one of the offensive linemen will leave to attack the linebacker while one stays to take over the defensive lineman. The key is for the two offensive linemen working in unison to double-team the defensive lineman to decide who and when one of them will leave to block the linebacker. In the diagram below, we show the offensive line starting the initial double team on the defensive lineman.
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z0eboy said:
Side note - the only other time zone pass protections is "decent" is if your offensive lineman are a bunch of BEAST and maybe 1 of them need double team help. For example your starting LT goes down to injury and you put your back up scrubb, so why not zone block assign to help his scrubb arss out.
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Zone-locking or man-locking principles may also be applied to pass blocking. Offensive linemen, when facing twisting defensive linemen, can also either lock on man-to-man or pass it off in a zone concept. When passing it off, or zone blocking, the key is to stop the penetration of the defensive end.
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Here's another good read on the zone blocking scheme.
http://www.rockytoptalk.com/2009/3/31/815874/zone-blocking-tutorial-inside-zone
If anybody ever asks you what zone blocking is, the shortest possible answer you can give is that the linemen block zones rather than block defenders. (If the asker is particularly annoying, you can always say that in a matter-of-fact, how-could-you-not-already-know-that tone. Very effective.) Digging a little deeper, what this really means is that the linemen are looking for specific areas of the field to block; if a defender happens to be there, they block the defender in such a way as to control the spot. If a defender isn't there, they continue toward that spot, offering double-team assistance only if it's convenient. Once they control a zone, if they're not fully engaged, the linemen can then look to the "second level" for somebody in the defensive backfield to block (on run plays).

The reason teams came up with zone blocking is rather simple: big, hulking offensive linemen who are agile enough to keep up with defensive shifts are hard to come by. In the NFL, the problem is quite simply that there are not enough quality big linemen for every team to assemble a dominant offensive line. Instead of competing against 31 other teams for a scarce resource, some teams sought to find ways to use smaller, quicker linemen effectively. Because of the acknowledged weight disadvantage these linemen would face, the goal was to scheme away from the straight-up shoving contests and find ways to maximize leverage on the opponent.
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The Denver Broncos won two super bowls using zone blocking concepts and the Houston Texans have one of today's best running games because of this scheme.
 
z0eboy said:
That was my point... you guys keep saying zone blocking scheme and my post clearly states the only type of plays where a zone scheme would work.

In other words college football is simple and due to the gap in talent teams like florida can get away with crappy zone reads (screens, draws and options) but when they play top 25 ranked teams they look like crap.

If you wanna crown their arss then crown their arss!!!! :thanks:
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Now I see what the problem is...YOU are confusing the zone blocking scheme with the zone read offense.

Teams like the Houston Texans and Indianapolis Colts uses concepts of the zone blocking scheme in their offenses and have been very successful at it. The Colts stretch play uses zone blocking concepts and Houston's Arian Foster, well you know what he has done the past couple of years running in that scheme.
 
Ok so you didnt like the Thomas pick, maybe there was some guy more familiar to you that was available...... Understandable.
But to call a guy who had a productive rookie year a bust is just plain pathetic. I don't think you know what a bust is. We're trying not to be the dumbest fanbase in the nation but some fans here really drive down our average. Imagine a Titans fans saying they've seen enough of Jake Locker to know he's never going to be a good quarterback. Clueless, I'd say.

Anyone who can prove how productive they can be in their 1st game is hardly a bust. A Bust contributes close to nothing or less. Thomas is loaded with potential and has already proved in very limited time that he can be more than effective. Bust ? What a bunch of clowns !
 
HybridPHIN 23 said:
Ok so you didnt like the Thomas pick, maybe there was some guy more familiar to you that was available...... Understandable.
But to call a guy who had a productive rookie year a bust is just plain confusing. We're trying not to be the dumbest fanbase in the nation but some fans here really drive down our average. Imagine a Titans fans saying they've seen enough of Jake Locker to know he's never going to be a good quarterback. Clueless, I'd say.
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DT was hardly productive last season. The jury's out, but lets not get crazy.
 
Geforce said:
Now I see what the problem is...YOU are confusing the zone blocking scheme with the zone read offense.

Teams like the Houston Texans and Indianapolis Colts uses concepts of the zone blocking scheme in their offenses and have been very successful at it. The Colts stretch play uses zone blocking concepts and Houston's Arian Foster, well you know what he has done the past couple of years running in that scheme.
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No I'm not, your assuming that I confused the 2. I understand the difference clearly.

If you read my prior post #14, I clearly explain what a zone block "running" scheme is and the difference in a zone block "passing" scheme.
 
DT is not a bust, but he is nothing special. He runs too high and from what I have seen of him in games and on DVR, he consistantly misses blocks and cut back lanes. He lacks running instincts, and a quick cut back. This is the same oline that Reggie Bush(5.0 average) ran behind. Colombo(right side of the OL) was terrible at pass protection, but he did ok run blocking.
In the Jets game, the coaching staff stopped using him and gave the carries to Steve Slayton. Slayton looked pretty good, DT was stuffed.
I don't buy into the playing with injuries excuse. All of the players are hurt in some way by the end of the season.
DT is replacable. I don't think he has earned any position IMHO.
I would not mind seeing us draft Richardson and let DT compete with Hilliard for a spot on the team.
 
z0eboy said:
No I'm not, your assuming that I confused the 2. I understand the difference clearly.

If you read my prior post #14, I clearly explain what a zone block "running" scheme is and the difference in a zone block "passing" scheme.
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I read and responded to your earlier post. Your explaination of what zone blocking is in both the running and passing game are...shall I say...not correct.
 
Geforce said:
I read and responded to your earlier post. Your explaination of what zone blocking is in both the running and passing game are...shall I say...not correct.
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Ok, care to make sense out of the 2 instead of an empty post?
 
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