How to fix our OL - FA Focus

[FearTheBeard]

[FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]Right now I'm looking at how few OT's have been entering the draft, and it's hard to see us not bringing in at least two mid-high cost guys, and then retaining one of Jerry, Clabo or McKinnie. I actually think this could work out well for us if we can attract the right players in FA and we won't be handcuffed with our top pick. Right now this is how I'd break it down. I posted this over in the VIP forum but I'd like to hear input from everyone early in the process.[/FONT]


[FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]Get a LT[/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]
1.Jared Veldheer: He is a top tier pass protector who still has plenty of upside. I think he would be as rich as I would go. I would pull the trigger on 6.5 mil per.

2. Jordan Gross: I know he runs a power scheme, I know he's still old, fact of the matter ishe's a top level blocker and has been for a long time. He would bring power to the line from a tackle slot, and there aren't that many FA's that offer that. He's already considering retirement and I doubt he'd want to leave Carolina, but he's just flat out impressive.

3.Anthony Collins: This is my personal vote and I think it's realistic. A rock solid pass protector, always been a fan of his since he cameout. He is a pretty weak run blocker, but if we want a discount on LTI can live with a softer LT as long as we beef up the interior andgive him a mauler at LG. He could be had in the 4.5-6 million range.

4. Roger Saffold: I've recently come around to Saffold, he has really improved over the last couple years and has the flexibility to play guard and both tackle spots. He also excels as a pass blocker and isn't an overly impressive run blocker. But if we have a pass centric offense, I'd have no problem bookending the line with himself and Collins. I think he nets a contract around 5 mil, but he's an interesting case.


5.Eugene Monroe: He's the most talented guy on this list, but he's here because he will likely cost the most. I'm not willing to drop a Jake Long contract on any offensive tackle, that's just my philosophy.


Other options: Brandon Albert, Bryant McKinnie.


[/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]Geta RT[/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]
1.Roger Saffold: I think he'd be the best value at RT as I've mentioned above.


2. Zach Strief: Top shelf RT this year, great in pass pro.


3. Austin Howard: Has improved over the last 2 years. Yet another guy who is turning into a solid pass protector but isn't a mauler.


4. Tyson Clabo: For as bad as he started the season, he still turned it on in the second half. Once we get past the top 3, this is more of insurance for an early round rookie tackle.


Other options: Mike Johnson, David Stewart, [/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]BryantMcKinnie [/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]


[/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]Getan interior lineman[/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]


1.Jon Asamoah: Sure he got benched this year, but it's tough with an underrated guy like Schwartz sneaking up behind you. I think he's the best value of the free agent guards.


2. Chad Rinehart: Has played well for the Chargers this year.


3. Travelle Wharton: Was just rewatching him and Gross vs the niners, they are extremely powerful. The don't fit our system but if we switched to a power scheme him and Gross shoot to the top.


4. Geoff Schwatz: Again the same issue of him not being athletic enough forour system, but if we changed it up he would be a great option.


5.John Jerry: Doesn't fit our system, but hasn't stop us from playinghim constantly.


Other options: Zane Beadles


We could also look into moving Pouncey over to guard. That would give usguys like Mack, Velasco, Dietrich-Smith. Smith has actually looked better the more I've watched and has the GB connection. Mack is toorich for me and I'm not sure how I feel about Velasco yet.

The way I look at it, is we can allot between $10-14 in new OL. We are going into the offseason with Pouncey, Brenner, Garner, Thomas,Arkin, Yeatman (RFA). That's about $6.5 million for 5 guys. So we have 1 for sure starter, potentially a starter at guard between Brenner/Garner/Thomas. I think we can more or less commit to 4/5 guys being on the roster, mostly in a reserve role. At minimum we're bringing in 3 more starters. How would you approach it? Bring in a big money guy and then some role players? Maybe rely on the draft?

Here's what I would do, obviously you need some secondary plans. My first step would be to find an affordable LT that excels in pass protection. I'd go Anthony Collins as my first choicebecause I don't think we'd need to break the bank for him, lets say4.[/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]5[/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]million per. [/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]I'dlike to bring in a RT but unless there's a fit in the sub 3 millionrange I think we retain one of our own as a stop gap to a early-middraft pick. [/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]ThenI'd go after Asamoah/Rinehart, which should come in around the 3-4million range, or I would look at shifting Pouncey to guard andbringing in a guy like Dietrich-Smith or Velasco. Then I'd look tothe draft for an interior lineman probably in round 2. In a perfectworld this is what my line would look like next year.

LT:Anthony Collins (4.5) | Yeatman
LG: David Yankey (R) | Thomas
C:Mike Pouncey | Garner
RG: Jon Asamoah (3) | Brenner
RT: [/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]TysonClabo (1) | Hurst (R)[/FONT]

 

[JERSEYFINFAN23]

they need to scrap the Zone Blocking and go to a normal pass blocking and Run blocking scheme.
block the guy in front of you an get to the next level!!
with the speed of Miller they should be able to counter and toss enough to keep the D honest!
Power in the trenches win games!

 

[AllFinsAllDay]

Said it before

Carl Nicks and Branden Albert. O-line solved

 

[FearTheBeard]

Said it before

Carl Nicks and Branden Albert. O-line solved

I don't buy into that philosophy of paying top $ for o-linemen, but to each their own. Both those guys haven't been able to stay healthy but Carl Nicks is an interesting guy because I haven't really dug deep into guys who are gonna be cuts. I'm not an Albert fan, if we HAVE to pay top $ for an o-lineman I'd rather have Monroe, but realistically I'd rather get someone cheaper who excels at pass blocking and can be passable in the run game. It's a cap era, we can't overspend like we have been every where else. I wanted Jennings last year instead of Wallace, this is a similar situation.

And Jerseyfinfan agree 110%, there's just more personnel to choose from. It's like trying to find guys for a 3-4, smaller pool.

 

[Rev Kev]

Monroe and draft a RT in second round

BPA -> #19

 

[AllFinsAllDay]

I don't buy into that philosophy of paying top $ for o-linemen, but to each their own. Both those guys haven't been able to stay healthy but Carl Nicks is an interesting guy because I haven't really dug deep into guys who are gonna be cuts. I'm not an Albert fan, if we HAVE to pay top $ for an o-lineman I'd rather have Monroe, but realistically I'd rather get someone cheaper who excels at pass blocking and can be passable in the run game. It's a cap era, we can't overspend like we have been every where else. I wanted Jennings last year instead of Wallace, this is a similar situation.

And Jerseyfinfan agree 110%, there's just more personnel to choose from. It's like trying to find guys for a 3-4, smaller pool.

I think Nicks will be released and barring he is healthy from the MRSA he had id take a flier on him. Albert is pobably going to cost a ton so that might not be feasible so another alternative might be Monroe who might not command as much.

Big thing is that we need to find out what type of blocking scheme we will be running and weather we need to get the right type of guys in here. I think a quicker scheme would work a little better but, that would eliminate Nicks how is massive man at 340 lbs but would be perfect in a power scheme if we decide to go that way.

 

[crossfit93]

Give me strief and alex mack move pouncey to lg and draft greg Robinson in 1st round.problem solved

 

[AllFinsAllDay]

Like that idea but moving Pouncey is probably going to be a cap issue eventually, where guards get a hell of a lot more money than centers do.

 

[FearTheBeard]

I think Nicks will be released and barring he is healthy from the MRSA he had id take a flier on him. Albert is pobably going to cost a ton so that might not be feasible so another alternative might be Monroe who might not command as much.

Big thing is that we need to find out what type of blocking scheme we will be running and weather we need to get the right type of guys in here. I think a quicker scheme would work a little better but, that would eliminate Nicks how is massive man at 340 lbs but would be perfect in a power scheme if we decide to go that way.

First of all, love getting down voted by some dude I've never heard of. Feel free to add some input ry-dbar, just trying to give some background on guys out there.

Nicks is definitely a pure power guy, personally I'd like a more balanced scheme. Regardless of the scheme, we need a pass-pro first LT and there's plenty out there that we won't have to go it the 7+mil annual route. Really like Collins, he has a smaller sample size. Also really like Saffold because he brings so much versatility. Those are the guys I'd target, the most expensive guy I'd look at is Veldheer, 6.5 is as high as I'm going for a LT. I rather have 2 guys worth 3-5 million, than a guy getting 9 per, 2 starters vs 1. If we really wanted to solidify the tackle spots I think Collins (3-4 per) and Saffold (5 per) > than Monroe/Albert (8-9 per) and a rookie.

And crossfit in a perfect world yes. But unfortunately we aren't picking top 10 and Robinson will be long gone before our pick, end of the day he could be the top tackle off the board. That leaves you with guys like Anthonio Richardson and Cyrus Kuoandijo, and I would not be happy with either from what I've watched regardless of scheme.

 

[AllFinsAllDay]

First of all, love getting down voted by some dude I've never heard of. Feel free to add some input ry-dbar, just trying to give some background on guys out there.

Nicks is definitely a pure power guy, personally I'd like a more balanced scheme. Regardless of the scheme, we need a pass-pro first LT and there's plenty out there that we won't have to go it the 7+mil annual route. Really like Collins, he has a smaller sample size. Also really like Saffold because he brings so much versatility. Those are the guys I'd target, the most expensive guy I'd look at is Veldheer, 6.5 is as high as I'm going for a LT. I rather have 2 guys worth 3-5 million, than a guy getting 9 per, 2 starters vs 1. If we really wanted to solidify the tackle spots I think Collins (3-4 per) and Saffold (5 per) > than Monroe/Albert (8-9 per) and a rookie.

And crossfit in a perfect world yes. But unfortunately we aren't picking top 10 and Robinson will be long gone before our pick, end of the day he could be the top tackle off the board. That leaves you with guys like Anthonio Richardson and Cyrus Kuoandijo, and I would not be happy with either from what I've watched regardless of scheme.

Solid points,I see us having a lot of room going forward next year but i do see your point not blowing our cap right now when we can fix alot with it wth some good pickups. I think Collins is going to command alot as the tackle market is going to be pretty weak. And don't mind the trolls they are a bunch of 12 year old kids roaming around here

 

[FearTheBeard]

Solid points,I see us having a lot of room going forward next year but i do see your point not blowing our cap right now when we can fix alot with it wth some good pickups. I think Collins is going to command alot as the tackle market is going to be pretty weak. And don't mind the trolls they are a bunch of 12 year old kids roaming around here

Haha more funny than anything.

And personally I don't see Collins commanding more than 5 million as it stands. He doesn't have much of a sample size, I doubt the Bengals are gonna retain him and I think there's a good mix of tackles in this pool. You've got top tier LT's like Monroe, Albert, Veldheer, Gross. Middle tier guys like Collins and Saffold, and that doesn't take into account the guys who are gonna get cut and there's always a couple of those. I'd say Collins is the 6th ranked tackle in the grand scheme of things more or less. That doesn't even take into account the RT's like Strief, Howard, Oher. There's options out there for the tackle needy teams, I'd love to tell myself we aren't gonna break the bank but I find it highly likely we do, hard to judge till we see who are GM is going to be. The biggest thing that got me going on this OL talk today is all the returnees in the class, because it makes it much harder for us to draft a day 1 starter at tackle now.

 

[Rev Kev]

First of all, love getting down voted by some dude I've never heard of. Feel free to add some input ry-dbar, just trying to give some background on guys out there.

Getting "voted down" is like losing one's virginity to FH... Be careful not be anyone's skank...

 

[FearTheBeard]

Getting "voted down" is like losing one's virginity to FH... Be careful not be anyone's skank...

Not the first time, won't be the last. Just like calling it out when it makes sense haha, all good.

And to add to my last post, AllFinsAllDay the market obviously won't be as large as I'm drawing it up to me. There'll be a handful of guys who don't even see the market. If I had to read the tea leaves I'd say there's an extremely low chance that Veldheer sees FA. Said he wants to be a Raider for life, they have tons of cap space and as many issues on the OL as us, not banking on him. The Ravens ponied up a 4th and a 5th, better believe he's gotta be a priority (but they don't have a great cap situation and probably won't bring back Oher). Gross is also contemplating retirement and I doubt he'd want to play anywhere other than Carolina. I think OUR pool is gonna be Albert, Saffold, Collins for LT.

 

[AllFinsAllDay]

I think the major catch would be Albert but he wanted to get paid 10 mil and up in the range of Thomas and Clady range. I don't think we can really afford to do that and will Probably go after collins as he fits a little better than Saffold who leaves a lot to be desired as far as staying healthy and overall performance.

Also the Rams maybe thinking of moving Long to RT and moving Saffold back over to Left due to Long's injuries.

 

[OnDaChainWax]

Mack with Pouncey over at gaurd is a dream ive been having for three days. We wouldnt even need another gaurd lol. Mack isnt going anywhere unfortunately.

Our best option to upgrade OT is Albert, IMO. His situation is the shakiest and even that may have vanished because thats what winning can do.