I dont understand reaching when you have a top 10 pick... | Page 4 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

I dont understand reaching when you have a top 10 pick...

azfinfanmang said:
Man, the entire premise of this thread is not reaching for a guy at 9, then putting Jarrett in that "Not a reach spot":shakeno:

We better address OLine or OLB in first round if Quinn isnt there. Otherwise we blow a pick. Of course if somebody really good is still there like Quinn, Russell, Anderson Peterson ......(Not Jarrett or Ginn), then we address Oline in the second:wink:
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While I think Ginn and Brown are reaching I belive Jerrett is top 10 in most polls. My question, now that ive thought about it better is this, "if we dont trade up or down, and lets just say every other team was smoking crack and picked horribly, who would have the most value (ill go ahead and say Thomas, C Johnson, and J Russell are gone but everyone else is fair game).

Do you still reach for a need position rather then the OMFG how is he still on the board pick?
 
IluvJuMiami said:
IMO, reaching is taking one player over another because that player fills a need.

As much as I do not want to take Adams, Anderson, Landry, or Hall, if they are better prospects than Brown, with more upside, better profile, etc, don't reach for Brown. Take the BPA.
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I hear what you're saying. But how do you place that BPA value on players in different positions?

If you have shot at the #1 WR, the #1 LT, and the #1 DE... which one do you take?

Answer: You take the one that fills the biggest need on your team.

Take Houston for instance. They already have Mario Williams and Andre Johnson. All things being equal, should they draft Calvin Johnson, Joe Thomas, Jamaal Anderson, or Gaines Adams?
 
IluvJuMiami said:
I agree. if we are going to stick with Daunte Culepepper, and for now, signs point to "We have no choice", why not get him a guy who you could always send on a go route? Tell Daunte to drop back and if there's nothing else, do what you do best, launch the ball down field, to Ginn running like the wind. It worked with Moss.

If nothing at all, it will make defenses have to respect the long ball. How good of a route runner do you have to be to take off straight down field?

I'd rather have Quinn if he falls, Branch if he's there, Brown in a trade down, but if we have to stay at 9 with Brown being as big as a reach as Ginn, I'd like to have Ginn. I'd like to have a possible superstar and possible bust over a probable solid player.

A solid LT would be nice, yes, but it's not enough to take us to the next level.
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Perhaps, and Daunte has one heck of an arm, but even he cant throw the bomb while on his backside.
If we dont get some serious horses up front, its gonna be another long season.

One think I have ALWAYS lamented over is the fact that you hardly ever see Brady get sacked (Cept against us of course:lol: ). That guy usually has time to go over not only first and second read, but ALL his progressions. Last year, our collective QB's didnt have time to try to spot the primary much less secondary.

So, unless our passing game consists of Ginn going long and the other nine guys back blocking, we better figure out the Oline---IMO of course:wink:
 
Dmarino110 said:
While I think Ginn and Brown are reaching I belive Jerrett is top 10 in most polls. My question, now that ive thought about it better is this, "if we dont trade up or down, and lets just say every other team was smoking crack and picked horribly, who would have the most value (ill go ahead and say Thomas, C Johnson, and J Russell are gone but everyone else is fair game).

Do you still reach for a need position rather then the OMFG how is he still on the board pick?
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I have to disagree with that. I've seen Brown higher overall than the other two, especially Jarrett.
 
Dmarino110 said:
While I think Ginn and Brown are reaching I belive Jerrett is top 10 in most polls. My question, now that ive thought about it better is this, "if we dont trade up or down, and lets just say every other team was smoking crack and picked horribly, who would have the most value (ill go ahead and say Thomas, C Johnson, and J Russell are gone but everyone else is fair game).

Do you still reach for a need position rather then the OMFG how is he still on the board pick?
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Fair enough, and I think you need to add Anderson to Thomas, C John, Russell...and probably Adrian Peterson as well, but point well made.

I still dont see Jarrett as a top 10 pick. I havent seen any of the "Big Boards" that have him higher than 16-20. If there is and I missed it, please feel free to show me.
I live in Pac-10 Country. Jarrett was NOT that big a blip on the radar scope coming to Tucson..
 
IluvJuMiami said:
I agree. if we are going to stick with Daunte Culepepper, and for now, signs point to "We have no choice", why not get him a guy who you could always send on a go route? Tell Daunte to drop back and if there's nothing else, do what you do best, launch the ball down field, to Ginn running like the wind. It worked with Moss.

If nothing at all, it will make defenses have to respect the long ball. How good of a route runner do you have to be to take off straight down field?

I'd rather have Quinn if he falls, Branch if he's there, Brown in a trade down, but if we have to stay at 9 with Brown being as big as a reach as Ginn, I'd like to have Ginn. I'd like to have a possible superstar and possible bust over a probable solid player.

A solid LT would be nice, yes, but it's not enough to take us to the next level.
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Besides, from what I read, Ginn is new to the position, works hard, and has a ton of upside. I could see him develop into a Steve Smith type of WR, and also provide a crazy return threat like we have never had.

This would not only open up things for CC, but would take some pressure off the running game. Teams would not be able to cheat the safety up as often.
:dolphins:
 
azfinfanmang said:
Perhaps, and Daunte has one heck of an arm, but even he cant throw the bomb while on his backside.
If we dont get some serious horses up front, its gonna be another long season.

One think I have ALWAYS lamented over is the fact that you hardly ever see Brady get sacked (Cept against us of course:lol: ). That guy usually has time to go over not only first and second read, but ALL his progressions. Last year, our collective QB's didnt have time to try to spot the primary much less secondary.

So, unless our passing game consists of Ginn going long and the other nine guys back blocking, we better figure out the Oline---IMO of course:wink:
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:yeahthat:

Speed means nothing unless you have time to throw. To those who want a 1st rd speed pick no matter what, uh who is our starting LT? We have to pick Brown, especially if we're priced out of any top FA tackle before the draft.
 
Dmarino110 said:
While I think Ginn and Brown are reaching I belive Jerrett is top 10 in most polls. My question, now that ive thought about it better is this, "if we dont trade up or down, and lets just say every other team was smoking crack and picked horribly, who would have the most value (ill go ahead and say Thomas, C Johnson, and J Russell are gone but everyone else is fair game).

Do you still reach for a need position rather then the OMFG how is he still on the board pick?
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I take the OMG pick every time, regardless of position.
 
Dmarino110 said:
While I think Ginn and Brown are reaching I belive Jerrett is top 10 in most polls. My question, now that ive thought about it better is this, "if we dont trade up or down, and lets just say every other team was smoking crack and picked horribly, who would have the most value (ill go ahead and say Thomas, C Johnson, and J Russell are gone but everyone else is fair game).

Do you still reach for a need position rather then the OMFG how is he still on the board pick?
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Let's assume Thomas, Johnson, and Russell don't fall to #9. That's three players gone leaving eleven players...

Adrian Peterson
Brady Quinn
Jamaal Anderson
Alan Branch
Ted Ginn Jr.
Amobi Okoye
Gaines Adams
LaRon Landry
Reggie Nelson
Dwayne Jarrett
Levi Brown

Any of those guys would be a solid pick at #9.
 
Finole said:
I hear what you're saying. But how do you place that BPA value on players in different positions?

If you have shot at the #1 WR, the #1 LT, and the #1 DE... which one do you take?

Answer: You take the one that fills the biggest need on your team.

Take Houston for instance. They already have Mario Williams and Andre Johnson. All things being equal, should they draft Calvin Johnson, Joe Thomas, Jamaal Anderson, or Gaines Adams?
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Good point. But the BPA can never hurt your team. DE's get rotated, there's usually 2 or more WRs on the field, and you can move you're current LT to RT if Thomas is better or vice versa.

In our case, we have needs everywhere. Our CBs need a stud, Jason Allen may be a bust and if his career ended today, that's exactly what he'd be, OL needs lots of help, Culpepper is a question mark, Chambers pulls more dissapearing acts than Houdini in his prime. IMO, we can not go wrong with BPA but I wouldn't be upset if they reach on Brown or Ginn(if they are considered reaches by the time the draft rolls around).

I'd be much more comfortable if Mueller would come out and say we picked Landry(not my choice) because he was the best player at 9 even though Bell, Allen and Hill are serviceable than have him say we took brown at 9 because we needed an OT.
 
Finole said:
Let's assume Thomas, Johnson, and Russell don't fall to #9. That's three players gone leaving eleven players...

Adrian Peterson
Brady Quinn
Jamaal Anderson
Alan Branch
Ted Ginn Jr.
Amobi Okoye
Gaines Adams
LaRon Landry
Reggie Nelson
Dwayne Jarrett
Levi Brown

Any of those guys would be a solid pick at #9.
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Its all a matter of opinion at this point. I still don't think Ginn or Jarrett would be "solid" picks.
 
Dmarino110 said:
I realize we have needs, but we have a top 10 pick. Unless you can get a 2 1st rounders or a decent 1st round and 2 or 3 other 1st day picks i dont see trading down.

right now Levi brown is listed as the 2nd best olineman but NOBODY has him listed as a top 10 pick. So why would we waste our pick? Why take advantage of the fact that we have an opportunity to pick up a stud at another position?

If Joe Thomas fell to 9 and so did brady it would be a hard pick for me. If things dont change now til the draft we would have a chance to pick up [SIZE=-1]Dwayne Jarrett. I dont have the ability to pass up a 6'4 reciever with his ability. He is a break away reciver and we havent had a reciver that fast since mcknight (he couldnt catch but thats another issue). [/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]I dont think Pep is gonna ever be at is 2004 season level again. I think he knee is shot, but if I'm wrong and he can play again then why not get a Moss clone (although a little slower) that he can air it out to? [/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]And if Quinn manages to fall to us, why not pick up a QB that Weis said was one of the smartest he'd ever worked with?[/SIZE]
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your way off on the whole Jarret is a breakaway guy and that we havent had a guy of his speed since McKnight thats just wrong in too many ways.
 
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