IRELAND: Didn't feel like we needed a new starting quarterback | Page 7 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

IRELAND: Didn't feel like we needed a new starting quarterback

I tend to agree with what Nublar said a few pages back in that Ireland may not be on the hot seat like most think he is. Most everyone here tie Sparano and Ireland together, and I think that may be a mistake in thinking. Of course this is all speculation on my part, but I think Ross thinks pretty highly of Ireland. I think Ireland presented his "State of the Dolphins" address to Ross and outlined his plan for improving the team, and Ross liked what he heard. IMO Ireland doesn't seem to making the "win at all costs now" moves you would expect from a desparate GM either.

If the season goes bad I would not be the least bit surprised to see Sparano gone (heck, nobody would), but I would be surprised (as of right now) to see Ireland get the axe. I just think he is a lot safer than most think.
 
Wildbill3 said:
but if we didn't draft mallet in the 1st, he wouldn't be any good for us anyway.
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Yes Bill, the odds are overwhelmingly in favor of a 1st round pick quarterback becoming a championship quarterback in this league versus guys drafted rounds 2-7 or undrafted.....history proves that.

However, for one reason or another sometimes guys with 1st round quality drop farther than they should. Marino nearly dropped out of round one due to drug rumors and a less than amazing senior season. Drew Brees slipped barely into round 2 because Wannstedt was an idiot and picked Jamar Fletcher instead.

In the case of Mallett, he had several issues and rumors which caused his drop. But nearly everyone agreed he had the best arm in the draft without a doubt. So here was a first round talent slipping, where a quarterback starved team like Miami should have rolled the dice....and they chose a very average looking runningback instead.
 
BlueFin said:
Yes Bill, the odds are overwhelmingly in favor of a 1st round pick quarterback becoming a championship quarterback in this league versus guys drafted rounds 2-7 or undrafted.....history proves that.

However, for one reason or another sometimes guys with 1st round quality drop farther than they should. Marino nearly dropped out of round one due to drug rumors and a less than amazing senior season. Drew Brees slipped barely into round 2 because Wannstedt was an idiot and picked Jamar Fletcher instead.

In the case of Mallett, he had several issues and rumors which caused his drop. But nearly everyone agreed he had the best arm in the draft without a doubt. So here was a first round talent slipping, where a quarterback starved team like Miami should have rolled the dice....and they chose a very average looking runningback instead.
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and clearly they were going to roll the dice. in round three.
 
Nublar7 said:
Here is the thing, I don't think Ireland's seat is as hot as some might think. In fact, I think it is ice cold. I think he wants to replace Henne, but didn't see any major upgrades in the draft or free agency/trades. Next year is a much better draft class and I think he is planning on getting someone next year. Doesn't mean he is trying to "suck for Luck", but he just might see better available options next year. He obviously feels comfortable that the Dolphins can compete for the playoffs this year and didn't think any player was worth the draft picks and money it would have taken, especially if they were not any better than Henne.
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You see Nubs this is the problem... Right there... BINGO. You can't simply halt the building process because the draft doesn't line up the way you like... You cannot control who is coming out, or how the board falls... Quite simply you take the steps needed to build and keep moving forward... The proverbial swimming shark.

It is no excuse to say you didn't like the draft... NOT AT QB... Sorry it just ain't true... YOU NEVER STOP DEVELOPING AT THAT POSITION EVER... NEVER EVER. It is why you have coaches to get the most out of lesser talent... To turn guys into Pro's... and if it doesn't work out, you do it again... And again... Miss... Whiff... and Bust over and over until you find the diamond. The sad part is that the board fell the Dolphins way... Mallet was INSANE value where he went... Very little risk. Which is why it is no surprise he went to the one organization that adheres to that simplest rule... DO NOT stop developing.

It isn't enough that the Pats are in our Division... :bobdole: You see the funny part is that people here talk about wasting assets in the search for a QB when in fact a developmental QB is one of the most PRIZED assets there is... Not only to your organization... But on the market. Do I really need to cite the Bledsoe/Brady/Cassel and now Mallet example????

The hilarious fact is... That most Henne 'haters' on here would be quite content with sitting with him for one more year if there was someone... ANYONE being groomed in the shadows... The fact that we are going to BEGIN this process a year from now is the sickening part and that... ALL OF IT... Is on Ireland.
 
Caue Ierland didnt feel like we needed a starting QB is why this Franchise will have yet another sub .500 year, and he and ****** will get can at years end.
 
Fish-Head said:
You see Nubs this is the problem... Right there... BINGO. You can't simply halt the building process because the draft doesn't line up the way you like... You cannot control who is coming out, or how the board falls... Quite simply you take the steps needed to build and keep moving forward... The proverbial swimming shark.

It is no excuse to say you didn't like the draft... NOT AT QB... Sorry it just ain't true... YOU NEVER STOP DEVELOPING AT THAT POSITION EVER... NEVER EVER. It is why you have coaches to get the most out of lesser talent... To turn guys into Pro's... and if it doesn't work out, you do it again... And again... Miss... Whiff... and Bust over and over until you find the diamond. The sad part is that the board fell the Dolphins way... Mallet was INSANE value where he went... Very little risk. Which is why it is no surprise he went to the one organization that adheres to that simplest rule... DO NOT stop developing.

It isn't enough that the Pats are in our Division... :bobdole: You see the funny part is that people here talk about wasting assets in the search for a QB when in fact a developmental QB is one of the most PRIZED assets there is... Not only to your organization... But on the market. Do I really need to cite the Bledsoe/Brady/Cassel and now Mallet example????

The hilarious fact is... That most Henne 'haters' on here would be quite content with sitting with him for one more year if there was someone... ANYONE being groomed in the shadows... The fact that we are going to BEGIN this process a year from now is the sickening part and that... ALL OF IT... Is on Ireland.
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The Pats had the amo to go get him we did not it is as simple as that. It probably would have taken next years first to take Mallet in the 2nd round before the Pats got him. Was he worth that to you? Not to Ireland obviously.
 
phintim said:
The Pats had the amo to go get him we did not it is as simple as that. It probably would have taken next years first to take Mallet in the 2nd round before the Pats got him. Was he worth that to you? Not to Ireland obviously.
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Eh? Mallett was taken in the third round... Miami had a number of chances to take him ahead of the Patsies... Without costing them ANYTHING next year.
 
Fish-Head said:
Eh? Mallett was taken in the third round... Miami had a number of chances to take him ahead of the Patsies... Without costing them ANYTHING next year.
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No duh but like I said all they really had amo wise was next years draft picks. Nobody was going to accept the phins next years 2nd round pick for their own 2nd round pick this year. So we logically would have had to given up next years 1st or possibly a 2nd and a 3rd. "If" we had not traded for Marshall then we very well could have traded for Mallet this year but that is the danger you run into when trading future picks. Ireland had a vision or priority in this years draft weather you agree with it or not a OL and a RB. Mallet was a luxury value pick to him.
 
phintim said:
No duh but like I said all they really had amo wise was next years draft picks. Nobody was going to accept the phins next years 2nd round pick for their own 2nd round pick this year. So we logically would have had to given up next years 1st or possibly a 2nd and a 3rd. "If" we had not traded for Marshall then we very well could have traded for Mallet this year but that is the danger you run into when trading future picks. Ireland had a vision or priority in this years draft weather you agree with it or not a OL and a RB. Mallet was a luxury value pick to him.
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Yeah but we got Daniel Thomas....we got that going for us....which is nice.
 
We should have jumped at Mallet. There's no excuse for not doing it. It's really that simple.
 
NCFINFAN13 said:
We should have jumped at Mallet. There's no excuse for not doing it. It's really that simple.
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Right, but even though an overwhelming majority of Dolphin fans have no faith in Henne any longer.....our GM saw no need to get another QB in the mix as fall back plan, just in case he was wrong.

Now best case scenario, if Henne flops again, we are starting with a rookie next year...which sets us back a year, and cuts another year off our veterans lives.
 
BlueFin said:
Right, but even though an overwhelming majority of Dolphin fans have no faith in Henne any longer.....our GM saw no need to get another QB in the mix as fall back plan, just in case he was wrong.

Now best case scenario, if Henne flops again, we are starting with a rookie next year...which sets us back a year, and cuts another year off our veterans lives.
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Who would have helped this team more this season? Mallet or Moore?

Also, which QB prospects are supposedly better prospects? This years draft class including Mallet or next years?

Do you draft one for the sake of drafting one, or do you target and go for a better option?

Do you spend a 2nd and a D-player for Orton? Or do you use that 2nd and a D-lineman next year to get a guy like Barkley or any of the any QB's who are better prospects then any 1 QB from this years draft?

Listen I wanted a new QB as much as any. I hated the drafting of Henne since the moment his name was called. But who should we have gone after seriously? If we drafted Mallet would he be starting day 1? Especially with the lockout? Trust me I was a huge supporter of drafting Mallet
 
phintim said:
No duh but like I said all they really had amo wise was next years draft picks. Nobody was going to accept the phins next years 2nd round pick for their own 2nd round pick this year. So we logically would have had to given up next years 1st or possibly a 2nd and a 3rd. "If" we had not traded for Marshall then we very well could have traded for Mallet this year but that is the danger you run into when trading future picks. Ireland had a vision or priority in this years draft weather you agree with it or not a OL and a RB. Mallet was a luxury value pick to him.
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Umm.. Look.. picks aside... Clearly I don't agree and I would go as far as to actually question the very loose definition of the term 'vision' with Ireland in mind... Ireland has painted himself into a corner time and again with the way he has handled this 'situation'. He didn't take a developmental QB when he had the chance and put himself at the mercy of the market as a result... His ONLY option to upgrade was Free Agency... So is it any wonder why the Broncos and Orton demanded a king's ransom??? Ireland had ZERO leverage and did it to himself.

Now here is where it gets really good... Let's say, Henne *ahem* busts out, so then we BEGIN our search a year from now... AWESOME...

Now wait 'cause it gets better... What if Henne plays 'lights out' and tears it up when he is in a CONTRACT YEAR??? What is Irelands leverage against another team driving up his price or actually stealing him away???? What is Ireland's leverage in negotiations with Henne himself???? When there are ZERO options behind him???? :lol: What about the possibility of injury..? and on it goes. This debate is not actually about Henne but moreso about the total lack of options Ireland has given himself and us.

It's comical... People LOVE to applaud Ireland for acquiring so much depth :bobdole: and yet the man has left us desperately thin at the position MORE important than any other... And worse... put himself in NO POSITION to bargain in almost EVERY eventuality. Bad or Good... If this is exemplary of any sort of 'vision' then the authorities need to pocket his driver's license because he is terribly shortsighted.
 
Quite simply what pisses me off is the same tired reaction from management at the QB position.

I've heard arguements on a few boards that Henne is 'good enough' and if we surround him with talent then he's fine for us to make a run.

Yeah, SO? We'll make a one time SB run like Baltimore did with Dilfer and then what? Back to no SB appearance for 25 years?

I guess that means we can then just sit at that all important position and stop searching for something better?

WTF?

How come we can afford to always look for a better player at every other damn position but at QB we must always get it when we need it, then when we get an average player there, we are fine and we can sit tight.

I realize Marino's, Montana's, Elway's, Manning's, Brady's dont come around very often, but that doesnt mean you dont earnestly look for him. I dont consider a GM saying that he felt like we didnt need another starting QB someone who EARNESTLY is looking for an improvement at that position.
 
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