Is OC REALLY where we want "on the job training"? | Page 2 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Is OC REALLY where we want "on the job training"?

Yeah, I'm not comfortable with an on the job training at OC either. We've tried that before. BUT, I've got to be optimistic and give him his shot. Who knows, he may be the next John Gruden. Good luck Joel.
 
I'm worried for most of the reasons outlined in this thread. I'm worried that we're having a rookie QB step into a situation where a rookie OC is feeling out what will be the tenets of his own offensive philosophy, and this could be confusing and detrimental to the rookie QB.

Thank god we have Trestman here for a while to make sure Collier's inexperience doesn't damage whatever kid we draft or trade for (Rivers, Henson, Losman, etc.)
 
Every single OC in the league had a lower position at one point. Collier has been the RB coach for 10 years so it isn't like he has no experience at all in the NFL.
 
Which means Collier could be ok in the long run but once again I'd like to emphasize the short run as particularly important, not just because of all that "our window of opportunity is closing" stuff that everyone keeps saying but also because the next 2 years will be critical as years we attempt to 'incubate' a rookie QB into a franchise QB.
 
Originally posted by PhinPhan1227


He has never been the guy who made the final decision on an offensive play. I know this for a fact because it's right there in his resume'. I'm sure he's had input, and might even have been drawing up schemes which WERE utilized. Heck, it's entirely possible that he was drawing up every single GOOD offensive scheme for the last year, and Norve just gave his approval to them(doubtful, but within the realm of possibility). But that doesn't change the fact that he has never been THE man. As I said in my post, it's entirely possible that he will wind up as a great OC...anythings possible. But it's also PROBABLE that he will make costly mistakes this season while he is LEARNING to be THE man. Seriously, is there ANY possibility of us NOT having a veteran at QB this season now? Would any coach in his right mind have a rookie at QB and OC at the same time? Maybe it all works out. Maybe we have a great season. I hope and pray that it does the same way I hoped and prayed that we would make it through the season without any injuries on the O-line. Unfortunately, the odds won out in that situation, and I suspect that the odds will win out here as well. I just don't want to see Ricky suffer the same fate as Marino....his best years wasted on missed opportunities.
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Well John Fox was never "the man" before either and his team is still playing. just food for thought.

Your statement about us fans and Collier having the same experiance is way out there.
OK how many of us coached in the NFL? Don't be shy, stand up and be counted.
It's been said before, an OC has to start somewhere. Besides I doubt we start a rookie QB. Unless injuries dictate that we do.
 
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You're damned if you do, damned if you don't, it appears.

The biggest reason Collier is getting the offensive coordinator's job is because he will the same offensive system the Dolphins have run over the past two years. This isn't like Kippy Brown, who was hired to install a system that he had never worked with. Joel Collier has been here and has worked closely on the gameplans with Norv (and last year with Norv and Mike Shula).

Miami will have that continuity. The players that will be returning won't be immediately put behind the 8 ball by having to learn a new system. The Dolphins will have the same blocking schemes, same wide receiver routes, and the same plays/terminology. What they want to add is more punch to the passing game in the form of big plays/vertical passing. They aren't going to throw more often, and they shouldn't throw more often. What they want to do is get more passes to the wide receivers of the 10-20 yard variety and hit on more passes that go for 20+ yards.

Ricky Williams is still going to get the football 350+ times on the ground. That's not going to change, and that's ultimately why Marc Trestman didn't get the offensive coordinator position. His background and experience is in the west coast offense.
 
Originally posted by Hellion


Well John Fox was never "the man" before either and his team is still playing. just food for thought.

Your statement about us fans and Collier having the same experiance is way out there.
OK how many of us coached in the NFL? Don't be shy, stand up and be counted.
It's been said before, an OC has to start somewhere. Besides I doubt we start a rookie QB. Unless injuries dictate that we do.
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Ask the same question of Collier. Raise your hand if you've been the OC in ANY job. I'll wait....still waiting.....Put your hand down Tressman, you just worry about the QB's and carrying Wanny's mid-day snack....ok....NOBODY on this board, OR in the current position of OC for the Miami Dolphins has ever BEEN an OC? Heck, if I'm not mistaken we have someone here who coached in the college level, so maybe we DO have someone who was an OC. But the fact is that the guy we have IN that position has no experience in the most important aspect of the job. Maybe the guy is a prodigee, but it's certainly something to be VERY concerned about.
 
Originally posted by KBISBACK
You're damned if you do, damned if you don't, it appears.

The biggest reason Collier is getting the offensive coordinator's job is because he will the same offensive system the Dolphins have run over the past two years. This isn't like Kippy Brown, who was hired to install a system that he had never worked with. Joel Collier has been here and has worked closely on the gameplans with Norv (and last year with Norv and Mike Shula).

Miami will have that continuity. The players that will be returning won't be immediately put behind the 8 ball by having to learn a new system. The Dolphins will have the same blocking schemes, same wide receiver routes, and the same plays/terminology. What they want to add is more punch to the passing game in the form of big plays/vertical passing. They aren't going to throw more often, and they shouldn't throw more often. What they want to do is get more passes to the wide receivers of the 10-20 yard variety and hit on more passes that go for 20+ yards.

Ricky Williams is still going to get the football 350+ times on the ground. That's not going to change, and that's ultimately why Marc Trestman didn't get the offensive coordinator position. His background and experience is in the west coast offense.
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Problem is, when we're facing the Patriots twice a season and looking at freakishly strange Defensive stances, we don't have someone who has any experience trying to outscheme that. If all we're going to do is run, run, throw, than what does it matter WHO we have at OC?
 
He continued to say himself that the one big concern was "play calling." My major complaint about the move was that this a team that wants to win NOW, but has a weak offense, and they are entrusting the offense to someone with NO experience when there were much more proven candidates out there, including on your own staff.
 
I'm certain that Collier will do fine. He has two former OCs on staff (Sullivan and Trestman) with one of them (Trestman) being his boss (Trestman). He'll get plenty of input from everyone on the staff (including Marino). Let's take a wait and see approach to this before we start calling 2004 a lost cause...please.
 
Originally posted by phinphanbill
I'm certain that Collier will do fine. He has two former OCs on staff (Sullivan and Trestman) with one of them (Trestman) being his boss (Trestman). He'll get plenty of input from everyone on the staff (including Marino). Let's take a wait and see approach to this before we start calling 2004 a lost cause...please.
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There's a difference between pointing out a VERY legitimate concern, and calling the season a "lost cause". In point of fact, it makes LESS sense to declare "I'm certain that Collier will do fine". You have NO evidence that he will do "fine". Yes, he's got people around him who can help out, but he's THE GUY. On game day at half time will it be Collier or Trestman who makes the mid-game adjustments? If it's Trestman, why not just GIVE him the freakin job? As I said last season concerning the O-line...maybe it works out fine, but the ODDS are against it. Right now the IRRATIONAL view would be "I'm sure everything will be fine", rather than "I'm worried".
 
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