mdolfan27
Practice Squad
michael egnew and ted ginn were great picks in the draft. NOT
Jeff Ireland good at drafting but sucks when it comes to free agents...why?
- Thread starter fisi
- Start date
I read the title of this thread and thought it was in reference to Dez's mom. Oops my bad.
Ferretsquig
Perennial All-Pro
I don't think hes done all that bad in free agency. The big time signings of Dansby and Pennington worked out pretty well, even if you think Dansby is overpaid. Wake was a great find. Goodman and Hill were great signings....just wish they hadn't let them go. Wilford was the only guy they paid big bucks to that turned out to be a complete dud.
Penny just fell on our laps that year. They all hit and miss, not just Ireland.
Ozzy rules!!
---------- Post added at 10:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:45 PM ----------
We don't know about Egnew yet. I know you think if he's not a probowler in his first season then he's a bust but sometimes it takes time. Soliai was not very good at first and now he's a top player for us.You need to give the kid some time.
Ozzy rules!!
Maybe you should go look for a Randy Mueller thread
normaniii
Active Roster
Irelands first draft in full control was the 2011 draft, where we have 4 guys out of 5 drafted, contributing in their 2nd season (Pouncey, Thomas, Clay & Wilson). That is, in anybody book an outstanding draft.
This year we already have a starting QB & RT and a rotational RB & DE who is also contributing superbly in ST.
IMO, Ireland since he has taken full control has been superb come draft day.
This year we already have a starting QB & RT and a rotational RB & DE who is also contributing superbly in ST.
IMO, Ireland since he has taken full control has been superb come draft day.
Gofish1331
Starter
Good at drafting....like Ted Ginn....or Pat White......or Chad Henne....?
always hard to tell how vets will react to a new system. Look at Nnamdi Asomaugh. Nobody even thought about throwing against him in Oakland. In Philly he's been constantly burnt.
Agree, but wouldn't be shocked if they went after a top WR, DE, CB or FS that may hit the market.
Fish-Head
U made the pudding but forgot the proof.
It never ceases to amaze me how when evaluating Jeff Ireland people are comfortable with the simplest math... A look at how many players contributing will, for most on here, provide the entire picture when the reality is... It is not close.
One of the most IMPORTANT aspects of a GM's 'performance' are his philosophies... I think we can all agree that the league is pass centric and has been for QUITE SOME TIME now... Even BEFORE Ireland came on board... Over his tenure we have had the same weaknesses... and strengths... The number of picks, cap space and free agent try outs along the line (on both sides) is completely disproportionate to other areas of the team... You don't have to be Einstein to figure out that Jeff's philosophy has been to build from the trenches out... A philosophy which has LONG been outdated...
I'm sorry but an all 'world' top 3 center (like Pouncey might be) will just not have the same impact on a game as even a top 20 receiver... It is just the way the game is now. Couple that with the YEARS it takes to build at 8 positions and you have a VERY difficult time building a group that peaks at the same time let alone keeping them together!!! Hence we stand on the verge of losing Jake Long BEFORE we're truly competitive... Ireland's centerpiece, good or bad...
I think when you talk about GM that you should be talking about the 'plan', the 'vision', the big picture and regardless of the number of so called 'hits' (subjective) he has had in the draft or 'misses' in FA (also subjective) you must take into account the overall philosophy and structure to build around. This team is sorely lacking in talent at WR... and it's biggest weakness is stopping the pass... In a pass centric league that is simply unacceptable... It has taken us 5 years and 2 rebuilds to stabilize the QB position... I think that Jeff has proven his philosophies are outdated. Just like his mentor.
One of the most IMPORTANT aspects of a GM's 'performance' are his philosophies... I think we can all agree that the league is pass centric and has been for QUITE SOME TIME now... Even BEFORE Ireland came on board... Over his tenure we have had the same weaknesses... and strengths... The number of picks, cap space and free agent try outs along the line (on both sides) is completely disproportionate to other areas of the team... You don't have to be Einstein to figure out that Jeff's philosophy has been to build from the trenches out... A philosophy which has LONG been outdated...
I'm sorry but an all 'world' top 3 center (like Pouncey might be) will just not have the same impact on a game as even a top 20 receiver... It is just the way the game is now. Couple that with the YEARS it takes to build at 8 positions and you have a VERY difficult time building a group that peaks at the same time let alone keeping them together!!! Hence we stand on the verge of losing Jake Long BEFORE we're truly competitive... Ireland's centerpiece, good or bad...
I think when you talk about GM that you should be talking about the 'plan', the 'vision', the big picture and regardless of the number of so called 'hits' (subjective) he has had in the draft or 'misses' in FA (also subjective) you must take into account the overall philosophy and structure to build around. This team is sorely lacking in talent at WR... and it's biggest weakness is stopping the pass... In a pass centric league that is simply unacceptable... It has taken us 5 years and 2 rebuilds to stabilize the QB position... I think that Jeff has proven his philosophies are outdated. Just like his mentor.
Well said. When people are citing jimmy Wilson, Charles clay and Daniel Thomas as proof to excellent drafting you know it's just grasping at straws.
I think with the help of Philbin/Croyle we will be able to sign a limited # of FAs who will not cost us much and will fit right in. We havent had a real head coach paired with Ireland, so now that we do I expect us to have a good FA class. It will be small but I know we will pick up a few Def players to fill some holes.
Canadi-Phin
I hate everyone else in the AFC East
I don't really disagree with you but to use some Parcelss like terms, if I have a thai chef I'm not giving him italian ingredients. Sparano wanted to run the show with the line play. Old school I agree. Look at last year under a new coach and we grab a QB, RT which as a big need and fit the ZBS, Vernon a pass rusher, a seam threat TE, ZBS RB and then two late round WR that seem to fit the West Coast offense. If Ireland would have been drafting players for a WCO and we werent running it I would have had a bigger problem. The coaching staff does dictate alot of the GMs success. Sparano and stafff did a terrible job developing players I think we can all agree. Philbin already seems to be getting more out of guys after 8 games. We shall see truly 3 years from now. In my opinion Parcells bringing in Sparano to run that Old School offense was more Irelands problem then anything.
Ferretsquig
Perennial All-Pro
His job is to evaluate talent within the set framework, not define the path the franchise goes down. Parcells was handed a blank slate and was able to mold it in his image but either by fortune or design that's not what Ireland is presented with.
Irishfinfan1
Active Roster
Agree with this, 2011 was an odd year because Parcells and co were gone, Sparano was still here but anybody could tell was for the chop. In circumstances like that it is a bit difficult to know what kind of players to go for, I wouldn't label Thomas a success just yet though. This year has been much more simple because with Philbin and co on board it was clear what type of players they want, and again Ireland appears to have had the best draft in over a decade.
For those who say Ireland's philosophy is build from the lines out and invest high picks there I'm not overly sure you can be certain on that. The problem was picks were being spent on the oline and because Sparano was so useless they weren't panning out, meaning Ireland has to invest more picks there. Ireland was using the picks to match Sparano's philosophy and now he is using them to match Philbin's philosophy, that's what I think anyway.