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Jim Bates

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PhinsPhreak

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I'm new here so if this was discussed befor Sorry!!!

With all the talk about upgrading (no longer overhauling) the Dolphins this offseason I find it interesting that once again no one has mentioned Jim Bates. IMO he is one of the most over rated DC's in the NFL. With the amount of talent on this defense we should be shutting teams down every week. There is a complete lack of schemes and packages. The safeties are always out of position and how many times do we have to watch Zach chase someone downfield flailing his arms with his back to the quarterback? We have one of the most if not the most talented defenses in the league, yet we are consistently inconsistent. The only reason we can hold our own most of the time is because the incredible amount of talent. I drool thinking of what someone like Romeo Crennel could do with this D considering what he did in NE with much less talent.
 
Bellicheck was a big part of that defense but Crennel was obviously a big part as well. Plus Crennel is gaing valuable Bellicheck knowledge every minute he works for him.
 
I disagree, I think Bates does a good job of scheming. The only games I saw where Miami really broke down on D were Philly and Tennessee. The Tennessee game was a total collapse, and the less said, the better. But in the Philly game, the defense failed because they missed at least a dozen tackles. The positioning was good, the schemes worked, they just didn't make tackles. Can't blame the DC for that.

I think Bates does a good job of working with what he has. Bates relies on the front 4 to create pressure and doesn't blitz too much, which is a sound strategy, given that the Phins have an excellent front 4. He relies on the corners to make plays, often without help, which is usually a good strategy, except that Mad Dog slipped a little this year. As the year went on, there was more safety help going to that side, a sound adjustment by Bates.
 
It's awful presumptious of you to assume that this hasn't been brought up......If you try the search feature, you'll find many many threads about this subject....you'll also find quite a few questioning just how much "talent" this defense has/had...even a few blaming the defense for the yearly collapses....your own post even contains contradiction....
The safeties are always out of position and how many times do we have to watch Zach chase someone downfield flailing his arms with his back to the quarterback? We have one of the most if not the most talented defenses in the league, yet we are consistently inconsistent. The only reason we can hold our own most of the time is because the incredible amount of talent.
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.....are they talented or are they out of position and running around flailing their arms??? They can't be both.
 
The defense is without a doubt talented. Zach Thomas is one of the best LB's in the league, but his strength is definitely not downfield coverage. As far as safeties being out of position I don't really know if its players or schemes but I feel Marion and Knight are both respectable Safeties and IMO being out of position is a direct result of them having too much field to cover. There was more safety help to Madison's side at the end of the year but I can't say that it was a good move by Bates. If he didn't realize Madison needed some help then he definitely wouldn't deserve to be the DC.

And don't forget about an 80-yard overtime collapse against the once again Super Bowl champs, possibly the biggest collapse of the season.
 
Im not sure if this is true or not but didnt opposing teams say our D was predictable & we didnt show many different looks or we didnt have many different schemes? I rem hearing this a while back but not sure if this is true or not. I could be wrong though.
 
Why was it a bad move? Madison was considered an excellent corner coming into this year. Bates probably figured he was slumping and could/would play his way out of it. Nothing wrong with that. As for the 80 yard bomb, hey, it happens. It's silly to expect that over the course of a 16 game season that you're not going to be beaten deep. The Pats spent most of the game setting up that bomb. It was a good job of coaching on their part more than a bad job on Bates's part.

BTW, I would also like to welcome you to the board. It was downright unneighborly not to do it first.
 
Im not saying it was a bad move, just an obvious necessity.

It seems to be the MO here to shoot first, welcome later:)
 
Originally posted by PhinsPhreak
The defense is without a doubt talented. Zach Thomas is one of the best LB's in the league, but his strength is definitely not downfield coverage. As far as safeties being out of position I don't really know if its players or schemes but I feel Marion and Knight are both respectable Safeties and IMO being out of position is a direct result of them having too much field to cover. There was more safety help to Madison's side at the end of the year but I can't say that it was a good move by Bates. If he didn't realize Madison needed some help then he definitely wouldn't deserve to be the DC.

And don't forget about an 80-yard overtime collapse against the once again Super Bowl champs, possibly the biggest collapse of the season.
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I think that our safeties are a bit slow in pass coverage, especially Knight, and it's a good thing they don't play in the CFL because then they would definately have too much ground to cover.......Zach is not good at picking up the back or the tightend, especially last year.....We get zero pass rush from out DTs, making it all or nothing for the DEs.....Madison is giving up quite few big plays per year recently....and Morlon Greenwood is MIA from most games.....and late in the year the undersized nature of the whole D turns them into punching bags for big strong offenses.....then again, you may be right...it may all be Bates' fault although I see alot of other concerns that I would need to see addressed before I would draw that conclusion.
 
Our D as good as it is, has issues shutting down the teams in games that matter most. They let Houston score 22, Philly (when the playoffs were on the line) score more then 30. The problem with Miami for as long as I can remember has always been consistency. Which team will show up. Look how we played against Dallas then compare that to the 2nd Pats game.

Our D more times then not, chokes from pressure. I contribute some of that to the coordinator.
 
Im just suffering from lack of change. I can't take another "Let's give this team one more year" situation. It would be more palatable to me to make big changes and fail then keep the same team and fail.
 
Originally posted by PhinsPhreak
Im just suffering from lack of change. I can't take another "Let's give this team one more year" situation. It would be more palatable to me to make big changes and fail then keep the same team and fail.
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I know everybody said this last year but, I believe it to be true(r) this year......This WILL be the last year of the same thing.....as close as this orginization came to losing the fans this year there is no way in the world they will be able to pass this off to us again next year if things don't go drasticly different.
 
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