just a question

stan marino

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i dont want anyone to rip my head off here, but i would like a decent answer. why is it that everyone hear says our corner backs are the best tandem in the league? last year we couldnt stop the run so obviously the teams didnt need to pass. we couldnt stop the run, and still left the safeties back to help our corners. i have been told this is because of the defensive system. now when u build a team dont u tweak ur system around the talent u have? dont u have a plan for all contingencies, such as not stopping the run.(the patriots last year seemed to adapt to the offences they were playing) is this more because our system sucks or is it that they think our corners will give up too many big plays? if it is the system not being flexible enough then y didnt we fire the guy? is wanny not involved enough? too much? i like our corners, but theres no way that they are the best tandem in the league.
 

Muck

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I disagree. I think we've got the best tandem of CBs in the NFL. If we're not the best tandem, then who do you think is the best, Stan??

Sometimes idiots stick around for no reason at all. Look how long TOM OLIVADOTTI hung out in Miami. It's the coach's fault for this. Rest assured though......Wanny will get involved this year. And if the D fails again, I think Bates could get the ax.

As for our CBs giving up big plays.......it's gonna happen. Just look at the 1999 season. When you put your guys out on an island in press coverage 99.9% of the time like we did that year, you're going to give up a some big plays and draw some interference calls. That's just the nature of the beast. And that was our Achilles' Heal. Teams took so many shots down the field that, eventually, they had success. And this costed us many a game. The Nickelback position really killed us as well. I like to think that Sam and Pat are better CBs now than in 1999.

So when Bates came aboard, he adjusted the system TOO MUCH. He eliminated the big passing plays, but he NEVER brings the safety up. And that makes us predictable and vulnerable to the run. You just keep plugging away until you find a chink in the armor. Plus, it makes it to where nobody wants to test our CBs.

I think you answered your own question, Stan. You build your system around the talent you have and tweak accordingly. Bates and Wanny didn't do this and we failed. Belichick did and they went all the way.

There needs to be BALANCE. Bring the safety up sometimes. Stop the run. Dare them to throw against Sam and Pat. Change things up a bit. Don't give the exact same look for 4 quarters. Attack more often.
 
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stan marino

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so last year was a practise season? There was an article saying that they were tinkering around with bringing up the safeties this year. so what were they thinking last year? our team will not do well if they cant adapt. that is a fact. with the talent on our team theres no way they shouldnt be adaptable. why was madison on the pro bowl anyway? he was hurt for how long? maybe daryl gardner should have been there too. With our schedule were playing the top teams, we need to adapt.
 

dolfan87

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We sucked against the run for two big reasons, and their names are Daryl Gardener, and Jermaine Haley. Both of those guys went down, and that was it for our running defense. Bringing Walker up to the line would have helped, but honestly if the RB is through the hole up to the secondary, you have already given up 5 yards easy.

Our D line was banged up, and even Timbo wasn't 100%.

Expect to see Arturo Freeman closer to the L.O.S., and if Tim Bowens, and Larry Chester can get a groove going, there won't be much running going on.

87
 

stan marino

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im just sayin whats wrong with our coaching staff? if it isnt surtain and madison then why? they must not trust the corners if they didnt even try to adapt to it. and all the other teams that keyed on our run with 8 in the box seemed to do a great job last year.
 

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They didn't want to bring 8 up to the box because it wasn't practiced much. Why do something you haven't practiced? Practices are full enough with preparing a game plan, there is no way they could have had enough time to learn to play with the 8th man in the box effectively. Thus, they stayed with what they knew what to do, despite it not working.
 

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I don't know why they stayed with it. That's why Dolphin fans have been beating their heads against the wall. They've stayed with this scheme for TWO seasons. And coincidentally, that's when we started having trouble with the run (smell the sarcasm). We were always stout in that department. Now we've given up over 4 ypc the last two years.

We've got the personel to do all kinds of damage. I wish we had a guy like Jim Johnson (Philly's DC) or Belichick running the D. Versatile guys who'll come at you from all over the place. Hell, even DAVE could do the job. Wanny is an awesome defensive coach. He had champs at UM and Dallas. Now that Norv is taking care of the offense, maybe Dave will pull a Dungy and fix the defense.
 

akfinfan

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Our Defense was wickedly awesome in 1998, 1999 we created turnover after turnover..... problem was when we got too the playoffs, everyone was hurt on Defense, Zach Thomas, Jason Taylor etc... we just got our *** kicked everywhere
 

stan marino

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hey dont get me wrong i love the phins but i think theres something wrong if they havent practised it so they aint going to use it philosophy. this is the nfl!!!!!u dont win by havin half a game plan. u need to be flexible cuz every team is completely different. vanilla dont win championships. thats y i think theres something wrong with our corners. they just dont seem to trust them at all. its been 2 years!!!!!!!!!!
 

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NOTHING'S wrong with them. Have you ever read or heard anything that implies otherwise?? All you have to do is look at the Colts game and you'll see what Sam Madison's all about when singled up. Also, the Raider game (against Tim Brown and Jerry Rice) will put you at ease.

That "we didn't practice it this week" garbage was limited to the offense. And it came out after the Rams game when we Chan and Dave decided to pack it up in the 3rd quarter. I don't think we'll be seeing that from Norv Turner.

As for the vanilla defense. Nobody's arguing there.
 

stan marino

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Lets just say that they are as good as any in the nfl, then why isnt our defensive co-ordinator fired then? If wanny is such a defensive mind why would he sit back and watch his team be destroyed by the run? Im really just curious to see if someone can explain to me how any nfl team goes into the season with half a defensive game plan. We didnt practise bringing up the safeties so we aint goin to use it. Thats ****in horrible. We went out and got an excellent offensive co-ordinator, why couldnt we get an excellent defensive co-ordinator?
 

dolfan87

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Like I said Stan, when your big guys in the middle are injured, your gonna give up some yards. Bringing one saftey up to the line is not going to solve a missing Gardener, or even Haley.

Bates' whole defensive scheme is based on playing the safties back in coverage. Now, I think he is being forced to change his ways. Wannstedt is making him.

Why isn't he fired? Well, while I think Dave has made some serious progress as far as his overall coaching methods from the Chicago days, he is still a homer. He is good friends with Bates, and he isn't going to fire him until he has exhausted every method he can think of to fix his coaching "problems". Thus this year we will see more of Sam and Pat on an Island, with Freeman closer to the L.O.S.

Look for change, cause it's a comin.
 

stan marino

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i hope so cuz if we dont put 8 in the box and we dont start blitzing we might as well stop worry about the offence and start worrying about the defence
 

grooves12

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A big difference this year though... is we might not NEED to play 8 in the box. If Bowens and Chester are healthy, and do what everyone thinkgs they are capable of doing together, there will be no need for that 8th guy. The problem last year was simply like Dolfan87 said... we were hit with too many injuries. Our base defense works great when our personnel is healthy, but the problem is, not all the backups can line up man to man and succeed like our starters can, so if they go down we are in deep ****... like you saw last year. I beleive we will still see a 7 in the box with the safties deep as our base defense, but Wannstedt will add in some more blitzes and formations utilising a saftey closer to the line of scrimmage as a contingency plan (and to hopefully mix things up now and then.)
 

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The bottom line for this year is we have to get preasure on the QB. We didn't do this at all last year, and thats why the ints went way down. The key to our run d is we have to stay healthy and our offense has to have more time of possesion. If DG and Bowens can remain healthy, and are well rested our front 4 will stop the run, for get about moving 8 in the box. To many 3 and outs in the first half of games last year left our defense fighting fatique in the 2nd half moreless the oposing running game.
 
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