Just noticed Edelman was held in check | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Just noticed Edelman was held in check

terphin said:
When is the last time anybody shut Yosemite Sam down, I guess Flores used the Pats idea of taking away the opponents best player....what a way to end the season
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I think he was doubled a lot.....and you can see the impact that had on the Pats offense.

I noticed it yesterday, but assumed Flores learned from BB so decided to take their best weapon away from them.....
 
dolfan91 said:
Flores had Edelman doubled. Needham held him to 1 catch, while he covered him. Flores also knows it's Edelman who powers the passing game for New England.
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Fans have seen Brady with a bad OL. Not good. They've seen seen him without elite receivers. Not good. Yet, some hold to the myth QB can carry his team. Edleman goes down, NE is done
 
I heard his shoulder was shotty and might need surgery, so he was used as a decoy. Whatever makes someone sleep better at night, they simply were outplayed at home.
 
fansinceGWilson said:
Fans have seen Brady with a bad OL. Not good. They've seen seen him without elite receivers. Not good. Yet, some hold to the myth QB can carry his team. Edleman goes down, NE is done
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What many don’t realize or acknowledge is most the titles the Pats have won were largely on the strength of their defense and special teams. When NE had their most dynamic offense, they lost.

Brady surely has been a great QB, but like many QB’s, he’s received far too much credit for their success. The 1st 3 SB’s he was largely a caretaker. Stingy defense and the clutchest kicker in NFL history were how they won games.

The defense clearly was the reason they won last season against LA, yielding only 3 points and also made the game-winning INT against Seattle in 2015.

While Brady received all the credit for the comeback against ATL, people forget it was the defense that caused the strip sack that made the comeback even possible. That, and some terrible situational play calling by Kyle Shanahan and decision making by Matt Ryan.

In short, many of the factors that determined whether NE won or lost were outside of Brady’s control. Brady didn’t make clutch kicks or play defense or force Pete Carrol to throw a slant pass at the 1 yard line.

If the things outside Brady’s control had happened differently, the Pats SB record during his tenure could easily be 4-5 or perhaps even minus a couple of appearances.

Brady’s done a lot to help, but he’s more a product of a great organization with numerous other clutch HOF worthy players around him, not to mention a candidate for GOAT head coach. Brady never led a team devoid of talent or without a capable defense/ST’s to a title. While some of their teams lacked star studded names, they were always well balanced.

I bet Jim Kelly wished his kicker was Adam Vinatieri. If he had been, Kelly and the Bills legacy would appear much differently despite not being any greater than they were.
 
EJay said:
What many don’t realize or acknowledge is most the titles the Pats have won were largely on the strength of their defense and special teams. When NE had their most dynamic offense, they lost.

Brady surely has been a great QB, but like many QB’s, he’s received far too much credit for their success. The 1st 3 SB’s he was largely a caretaker. Stingy defense and the clutchest kicker in NFL history were how they won games.

The defense clearly was the reason they won last season against LA, yielding only 3 points and also made the game-winning INT against Seattle in 2015.

While Brady received all the credit for the comeback against ATL, people forget it was the defense that caused the strip sack that made the comeback even possible. That, and some terrible situational play calling by Kyle Shanahan and decision making by Matt Ryan.

In short, many of the factors that determined whether NE won or lost were outside of Brady’s control. Brady didn’t make clutch kicks or play defense or force Pete Carrol to throw a slant pass at the 1 yard line.

If the things outside Brady’s control had happened differently, the Pats SB record during his tenure could easily be 4-5 or perhaps even minus a couple of appearances.

Brady’s done a lot to help, but he’s more a product of a great organization with numerous other clutch HOF worthy players around him, not to mention a candidate for GOAT head coach. Brady never led a team devoid of talent or without a capable defense/ST’s to a title. While some of their teams lacked star studded names, they were always well balanced.

I bet Jim Kelly wished his kicker was Adam Vinatieri. If he had been, Kelly and the Bills legacy would appear much differently despite not being any greater than they were.
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Post of the year. Couldn’t have said it better if I tried but have felt this way forever. Those 1st 3 SBs he was exactly that - a care taker. Heck, Jake Delhome was better in that one. FGs at the end decided a couple of those games. The ATL comeback - all Atlanta has to do is tell Matt Ryan not to snap the ball in the 2nd half until there is only 1 sec on the play clock. Just that alone and you take away one NE possession. And they needed ALL of them to tie it. And yes, the strip sack started it and the other sack took Melty Ice out of FG range after Julio caught it at the 22 for what would have been a 39 yard FG to put it away. The Rams last year? Brady sucked ass in the SB and was shut down. Problem is, Goff sucked worse and was shut down harder. Seattle not handing it to Lynch was criminal.
I hate Tom Brady the player and the person. Anyone who can’t shake hands after a SB loss (Eli and Foles) but can’t wait to hug you (Matt Ryan) when he wins is a total douchebag.
 
royalshank said:
Post of the year. Couldn’t have said it better if I tried but have felt this way forever. Those 1st 3 SBs he was exactly that - a care taker. Heck, Jake Delhome was better in that one. FGs at the end decided a couple of those games. The ATL comeback - all Atlanta has to do is tell Matt Ryan not to snap the ball in the 2nd half until there is only 1 sec on the play clock. Just that alone and you take away one NE possession. And they needed ALL of them to tie it. And yes, the strip sack started it and the other sack took Melty Ice out of FG range after Julio caught it at the 22 for what would have been a 39 yard FG to put it away. The Rams last year? Brady sucked *** in the SB and was shut down. Problem is, Goff sucked worse and was shut down harder. Seattle not handing it to Lynch was criminal.
I hate Tom Brady the player and the person. Anyone who can’t shake hands after a SB loss (Eli and Foles) but can’t wait to hug you (Matt Ryan) when he wins is a total douchebag.
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Great post.

Its the Belichick show over there not the Brady show.
 
Easy to hold a guy " in check" when he is hurt.... Playing with an old QB who is hurt as well. It doesn't really matter how good you use to be when ur old and beat up. With that said , we were starting a lot of players who are 3rd stringers and beat them. So it was great to see.
 
I started to notice after they lost to the other division winners that they were not as potent or dangerous as we thought. That favorable schedule saved them and kept a ton of the holes covered.

The bills I thought could take it to them but were super conservative and unprepared for them. Lost a real chance at the division because they had no game plan.

Brady is old and Edelman is busted up and it hurts that offense as a whole. Flores figured if he could force Brady to throw it down field he would struggle more tines than not. He was right and more teams should play with less fear against them
 
royalshank said:
Post of the year. Couldn’t have said it better if I tried but have felt this way forever. Those 1st 3 SBs he was exactly that - a care taker. Heck, Jake Delhome was better in that one. FGs at the end decided a couple of those games. The ATL comeback - all Atlanta has to do is tell Matt Ryan not to snap the ball in the 2nd half until there is only 1 sec on the play clock. Just that alone and you take away one NE possession. And they needed ALL of them to tie it. And yes, the strip sack started it and the other sack took Melty Ice out of FG range after Julio caught it at the 22 for what would have been a 39 yard FG to put it away. The Rams last year? Brady sucked *** in the SB and was shut down. Problem is, Goff sucked worse and was shut down harder. Seattle not handing it to Lynch was criminal.
I hate Tom Brady the player and the person. Anyone who can’t shake hands after a SB loss (Eli and Foles) but can’t wait to hug you (Matt Ryan) when he wins is a total douchebag.
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Don't get me wrong, I’d love for MIA to have had the success the Patriots have enjoyed the last 18 years (Without the cheating, of course). And I’d never foolishly claim that Brady is Trent Dilfer or Brad Johnson or even Eli Manning. He’s much better than that.

But he’s no Dan Marino or John Elway either.

You‘d never see Brady carry average or below average teams like those two players proved capable of doing. I don‘t even believe Joe Montana was capable of it either.

Like Brady, Montana was a product of one of the better dynasties in modern history. Both the 1980’s 49ers and 2000’s Pats boasted HOF head coaches that were ahead of the curve and were also littered with HOF talent. I mean, Montana was able to throw to a player widely considered one of the top 2 players of all time, along with Jim Brown. And let’s not forget that one of the all time defensive players was there too.

Meanwhile, Marino only had Shula and Dwight Stevenson with regard to HOF talent during his prime years.

As I’ve maintained for a long time now, fans overvalue titles when comparing individual talents. Football isn’t singles tennis or golf. Instead it is the ultimate team sport. It’s not even comparable to basketball, which involves far less players and allows individual impact on both offense and defense.

While QB tends to be the position with the most potential for impact individually, it in now way trumps the rest of the positions as a whole. And that’s what people tend to overlook. That no matter how good a QB might be, they can be held back by a subpar supporting cast.

Conversely, lesser but still good QB’s can be elevated by a strong and well balanced supporting cast. IMO, that’s the category both Brady and Montana fall into. Also Elway in the latter stage of his career. Prime Elway that was part of 3 SB losses was a much better and more capable player than the aging player that was part of 2 titles.

Thats precisely the point. It’s all about the supporting cast.
 
EJay said:
Don't get me wrong, I’d love for MIA to have had the success the Patriots have enjoyed the last 18 years (Without the cheating, of course). And I’d never foolishly claim that Brady is Trent Dilfer or Brad Johnson or even Eli Manning. He’s much better than that.

But he’s no Dan Marino or John Elway either.

You‘d never see Brady carry average or below average teams like those two players proved capable of doing. I don‘t even believe Joe Montana was capable of it either.

Like Brady, Montana was a product of one of the better dynasties in modern history. Both the 1980’s 49ers and 2000’s Pats boasted HOF head coaches that were ahead of the curve and were also littered with HOF talent. I mean, Montana was able to throw to a player widely considered one of the top 2 players of all time, along with Jim Brown. And let’s not forget that one of the all time defensive players was there too.

Meanwhile, Marino only had Shula and Dwight Stevenson with regard to HOF talent during his prime years.

As I’ve maintained for a long time now, fans overvalue titles when comparing individual talents. Football isn’t singles tennis or golf. Instead it is the ultimate team sport. It’s not even comparable to basketball, which involves far less players and allows individual impact on both offense and defense.

While QB tends to be the position with the most potential for impact individually, it in now way trumps the rest of the positions as a whole. And that’s what people tend to overlook. That no matter how good a QB might be, they can be held back by a subpar supporting cast.

Conversely, lesser but still good QB’s can be elevated by a strong and well balanced supporting cast. IMO, that’s the category both Brady and Montana fall into. Also Elway in the latter stage of his career. Prime Elway that was part of 3 SB losses was a much better and more capable player than the aging player that was part of 2 titles.

Thats precisely the point. It’s all about the supporting cast.
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100% x 100,000%

I’ve said similar things such as your point about the HOF players. The Niners had them everywhere. Dwight Stephenson only played 2-3 full seasons w Dan -coincidence we fell off substantially after his career ending injury?

always have compared Brady and Montana - while I think Montana was better than Brady because he could run.

and isn’t it funny how Elway was dubbed (unfairly) “a loser” when his teams were busy getting blown out in SBs. Then as an aging, decrepit shell of himself he’s a part of (QBR of 35 in his first SB win I believe) 2 wins and he’s a football God?

your follow up post should be post of the year no 1b.

so well articulated.

PS - we’ll never really know to what extent the cheating helped get the Pats another ring or two. Taping the Rams red zone plays before the SB. Funny how the rams bogged down in that game all day until their last two, 2 minute drives. Or deflating footballs for 10 seasons and coincidentally no one fumbling during the same 10 years. The latter has been statistically proven to be about as likely as getting hit by lightning 6 times over a 3 day span - while traveling in 3 different countries - wearing a rubber suit.

it’s a team game. And defense wins championships. Brady was never immune to that rule. No QB has ever powered their way to a SB win on a team that had a dreadful defense. The more balanced team usually wins the game. Usually.
 
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