Killing Time 10/ Wale IS NOT a Product of JT

[taylorj99]

I did not find anything on JT's college stats, don't know if he put his name on Akrons record books or the College's division record books.

That's really irrelevant since he's already proven himself to be one of the top at the highest level.

I'm not knocking Ogun or your post, but JT's been successful year after year, regardless of who's on the line with him. 7 years, 71 sacks. Who's better than that. Double teams, triple teams, teams scheming specifically for him. 71 sacks. Ogun has not proven he's that good. He is better than Kearse or Wistrom or KGB IMO, but not JT. Sorry, but I don't think he's gonna get paid that kind of money here.

 

[AquaAssasin]

No, he is not currently better than JT, I believe they are neck-in-neck though, I thought I wrote that he will probably be better in the future 1-3 years (in the long run). We just need to realize how many years does JT have left to play at such a high level? I did not find anything on JT's college stats, don't know if he put his name on Akrons record books or the College's division record books.

At least I found Wale did, he has the College records to prove that he is not a byproduct, All American in his senior year and such, and so far has not shown to be another T Mandarich or 1st round busts...

Also, Wale got 21% of his season sacks in December, while JT got 54% of them in the same month. Kind of leads me to believe that opposing Offenses were concentrating more on Wale than JT, this is where they complement each other...

I don't want to loose out on CC or RW in the next year or 2, but it could be concievable that the FO can negotiate on a good # that both can be happy with...

they are not neck and neck...jt is alot faster than AO

 

[AquaAssasin]

Wale plays against RTs who are generally not as good pass blockers as LTs while JT goes up against the elite LTs Ogden, Pace, etc. Although JT does seem to occasionaly get shut down by no-name oline men (last year's Texans game comes to mind).

its called chip blocking and thats what every team that played against jt did...

 

[AquaAssasin]

I agree with Van :goof:

The measure of a great DE is their ability to do it "alone" so to speak. Jason Taylor has, you'll never know about O-Gun until he's truly put into that position.

your right on the money!

 

[xiidaen]

Interesting (or distressing) that BOTH JT and O-Gun were completely shut down in the Texans game.

 

[Merman]

I agree with Van :goof:

The measure of a great DE is their ability to do it "alone" so to speak. Jason Taylor has, you'll never know about O-Gun until he's truly put into that position.

Since some on this board consider a 9 sack season ordinary consider this: Jason Taylor can only have a good season if there is a decent DE on the other side.

14.5 sacks in 2000 along side Trace Amrstrong who had 16.5 that year. Since Trace retired ESPN took down his stats and am going on memory. Don't forget Trace was an accomplished sacker before he became a Dolphin. 105 for his career.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/alltime/leaders?cat=sacks

18.5 sacks in 2002 along side of Ogunleye who had 9.5 that year.

13 sacks in 2003 along side of Ogunleye who had 15 that year.

Obviously Jason is a systems DE who gets coverage sacks because of the secondary. :roflmao:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?statsId=3968

 

[Disnardo]

Since some on this board consider a 9 sack season ordinary consider this: Jason Taylor can only have a good season if there is a decent DE on the other side.

14.5 sacks in 2000 along side Trace Amrstrong who had 16.5 that year. Since Trace retired ESPN took down his stats and am going on memory. Don't forget Trace was an accomplished sacker before he became a Dolphin. 105 for his career.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/alltime/leaders?cat=sacks

18.5 sacks in 2002 along side of Ogunleye who had 9.5 that year.

13 sacks in 2003 along side of Ogunleye who had 15 that year.

Obviously Jason is a systems DE who gets coverage sacks because of the secondary. :roflmao:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?statsId=3968

Good points Merman, and I might add that the late 90's T Armstrong was one of the elite DE's, we paid alot of money for him before we drafted JT, and if I recall, JT was considered to play for us as a LB because of his weight...

In 97-> T Armstrong had 5.5 sacks and JT had 5...

In 98-> T Armstrong had 10.5 sacks to JT's 9...

Now don't get me wrong, I believe JT is an Elite DE, but when he came in this league he took advantage of the player opposite of him and avoided alot of double teaming and such, for the first few years, learning from Armstrong and coaches.

Now years later, he has developed into a great all around DE, one of the best in the NFL...

 

[Merman]

Good points Merman, and I might add that the late 90's T Armstrong was one of the elite DE's, we paid alot of money for him before we drafted JT, and if I recall, JT was considered to play for us as a LB because of his weight...

In 97-> T Armstrong had 5.5 sacks and JT had 5...

In 98-> T Armstrong had 10.5 sacks to JT's 9...

Now don't get me wrong, I believe JT is an Elite DE, but when he came in this league he took advantage of the player opposite of him and avoided alot of double teaming and such, for the first few years, learning from Armstrong and coaches.

Now years later, he has developed into a great all around DE, one of the best in the NFL...

I agree that JT is one of the best all around DE in the league.

The rest of your post seems to insinuate that Ogunleye is learning and depending on JT. When players have elite or great years they may still be learning but they have great talent to achieve those results. If not every great DE in the league would have an elite DE playing opposite him because of his great talent. We all know that is not true.

What we do know is that good players do compliment each other.

 

[catapano]

you have to remember trace armstrong was nearing the end of his carear and miami knew his worth was droping quickly im sure being across from jt didnt hurt but trace was a great player in his time he actually almost got ahold of fiedler when we played the raiders but fiedler was able to make him miss and dove into the inzone for a td man that was an awsome game!!

 

[4Dfins]

Hard to compare their college stats cause dont forget that JT was an OLB at Akron...might be why you cant find his stats depending on how you are searching.

 

[Y-TownPhinVet]

All very good thoughts. I hope the FO can find a way to sign him. There is one thing that I didn't see mentioned, that's the fact that JT and AO buth play infront of two Pro Bowl shutdown corners (arguably the best tandum in the league). :) This fact will also lead to higher sack totals for the D line.
Could AO have gotten double digit sacks playing for say the Cardinals? :confused: If you answer yes, then he deserves the money, If you answer no, then it may be a long holdout. :cry:

 

[catapano]

kbg and kearse are over paid and i agree that wally is just as good as either of them.

 

[Jimi]

kbg and kearse are over paid and i agree that wally is just as good as either of them.

As good as Kearse right now at this point in time may b a stretch. I believe he has the potential but not yet. But i do agree with you Kearse is overpaid. On the other hand, i believe he is just as good as KGB, and deserves money like him.