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Looking at the QB's....

O'townPhinFan

O'townPhinFan

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I have been reading a lot of these posts and I see the mixed reviews on who everyone wants at QB. Lets say for arguments sake that Peterson pays TG just to screw with us....yea...I know...not too smart and the chances of that happening are slim to none.

But lets just say we start camp and even go into the season with the QB's we currently have on the roster. The odd man out is obviously G. Hamdan...he will go to the PS. But then that leaves our rookie QB, CL and DC. All reports are pointing to DC being 100% by TC and even participating in the upcoming June TC. Yes I know....we heard that before so don't smash me. So lets say we start the June TC with a healthy DC, Beck and CL. Is it entirely possible that Beck has memorized the playbook like he said he has? Can he actually execute it? Time will tell. I know he may not be a start but in the end...maybe by next year, he will be the starter if not sooner like all the other QB's have like Palmer and Rivers.....pretty good examples if you ask me. So whats the worst that can happen there.... Beck learns the system inside and out and is a star.

Now with DC... Lets hope all reports are true and he is 90% only to be 100% come the June TC. Lets hope in this time he has done a lot of film study on defenses and such....unlikely but here is to hoping. It would be good to see him come out like his old self but I don't see a lot of patience there as far as lienincy(sp?). Fans want to win and win now and rightfully so. I do too. Who is to say that a DC of old will show up even at 100%....no one. DC has the heart but the head of knowledge has always been the culprit and everyone knows it. He is constantly getting bashed about being dumb to defenses and such. I can't defend him there because I don't know the deal. So I am for him coming in and COMPETEING for the starting role. I would be upset if it were handed to anyone. They need to EARN it....period.....even DC.

As for CL....he may show promise right now in practice but thats just it.....it is practice. He is at best a back up. I can never see him being a starting QB. I say this because it seems as we drafted Beck and Cam and Randy are high on him according to reports that he was rated up there with Quinn. CL will be a good back-up till they figure out the starting position. So for all those that think CL will start for us....not gonna happen.

Green.... I know he may know the offense...but who is to say it is a guarantee he will be here? Will Peterson sign him for 2007 to spite everyone in our orginization only to groom Croyle over there? Green is one hit from getting coloring books for Xmas for the rest of his life. He was great back in the day but he hasn't been the same since his concussion. How do you think he will be behind an OL that hasn't been set? If he got that concussion from being behind a line that was better than ours...just think of what will happen if we don't get our OL set and gelling like a fine, smooth machine. No QB will make it out alive.

And lastly....Hamdan.....I wont go there. He is as good as gone....maybe Europe...PS or just cut....who knows and who cares.

So be gentle with me....I was just voiceing some thoughts I was having.....

I am all for who WINS the job because they EARNED it and that goes for all positions. I look forward to a possible exciting year....GO PHINS!!!!
 
Green's concussion didn't come behind a line, it was during a scramble....
 
Agreed

O'townPhinFan said:
I have been reading a lot of these posts and I see the mixed reviews on who everyone wants at QB. Lets say for arguments sake that Peterson pays TG just to screw with us....yea...I know...not too smart and the chances of that happening are slim to none.

But lets just say we start camp and even go into the season with the QB's we currently have on the roster. The odd man out is obviously G. Hamdan...he will go to the PS. But then that leaves our rookie QB, CL and DC. All reports are pointing to DC being 100% by TC and even participating in the upcoming June TC. Yes I know....we heard that before so don't smash me. So lets say we start the June TC with a healthy DC, Beck and CL. Is it entirely possible that Beck has memorized the playbook like he said he has? Can he actually execute it? Time will tell. I know he may not be a start but in the end...maybe by next year, he will be the starter if not sooner like all the other QB's have like Palmer and Rivers.....pretty good examples if you ask me. So whats the worst that can happen there.... Beck learns the system inside and out and is a star.

Now with DC... Lets hope all reports are true and he is 90% only to be 100% come the June TC. Lets hope in this time he has done a lot of film study on defenses and such....unlikely but here is to hoping. It would be good to see him come out like his old self but I don't see a lot of patience there as far as lienincy(sp?). Fans want to win and win now and rightfully so. I do too. Who is to say that a DC of old will show up even at 100%....no one. DC has the heart but the head of knowledge has always been the culprit and everyone knows it. He is constantly getting bashed about being dumb to defenses and such. I can't defend him there because I don't know the deal. So I am for him coming in and COMPETEING for the starting role. I would be upset if it were handed to anyone. They need to EARN it....period.....even DC.

As for CL....he may show promise right now in practice but thats just it.....it is practice. He is at best a back up. I can never see him being a starting QB. I say this because it seems as we drafted Beck and Cam and Randy are high on him according to reports that he was rated up there with Quinn. CL will be a good back-up till they figure out the starting position. So for all those that think CL will start for us....not gonna happen.

Green.... I know he may know the offense...but who is to say it is a guarantee he will be here? Will Peterson sign him for 2007 to spite everyone in our orginization only to groom Croyle over there? Green is one hit from getting coloring books for Xmas for the rest of his life. He was great back in the day but he hasn't been the same since his concussion. How do you think he will be behind an OL that hasn't been set? If he got that concussion from being behind a line that was better than ours...just think of what will happen if we don't get our OL set and gelling like a fine, smooth machine. No QB will make it out alive.

And lastly....Hamdan.....I wont go there. He is as good as gone....maybe Europe...PS or just cut....who knows and who cares.

So be gentle with me....I was just voiceing some thoughts I was having.....

I am all for who WINS the job because they EARNED it and that goes for all positions. I look forward to a possible exciting year....GO PHINS!!!!
Click to expand...


All along as the starter has earned the spot, I still believe in DC and believe he will regain his old form due to the fact he has alot of people to prove wrong and how sweet will that be for the dolphins. I will support whatever Cam wants to do, for he has the true understanding of where these players fit into our organization.
 
As I was heading to college today, I heard Joe Rose talking to Cleo and I believe he has been named the starter as of right now. The guy has only started 1 game against the Colts. Clearly 1 game is not enough to evaluate him. Nonetheless, we almost beat the Colts with him at the helm. Who knows what he can bring to the table. We have not seen much of what he's got. I think Culpepper will eventually get healthy and Cleo will be the starter. We shall see in pre-season how Cleo fares.

All just mentioned is pending Trent Green does not sign with Miami. So hang on tight people, the fun is just getting started! :evil:

(The GM from the Chiefs wants a higher pick than we offer, he is still bitter of the Surtain trade. I think we got a higher pick than we deserved) :sidelol:

 
Good post. I agree with most of it. I would prefer for Beck to have a few games or even a season to build his comfort level with the speed of an NFL game, but if the Phins don't get Green (or even if they do, will he be any good even supposedly knowing 90% of the offense already) and DC just can't handle Cam's style of offense, then he may get thown in.
We won't know anything until we see how they all do in capm and practice I guess.
 
If the roster stays the way it is now (ie. no TG) then I see Culpepper starting the season. If he is truly 100% and plays good enough to win then he will keep the job for the year, otherwise Lemon or Beck (whoever wins the #2 spot) will come in and have a chance to shine. If Culpepper has a great year (comes close to his old form) then Beck will have two to three years to learn from the bench. If he plays average or below average, Beck may find himself behind center sooner and we will release or trade Culpepper. Of course if Green finds his way to Miami evenutally than this whole scenario could play out far different.
 
O'townPhinFan said:
I have been reading a lot of these posts and I see the mixed reviews on who everyone wants at QB. Lets say for arguments sake that Peterson pays TG just to screw with us....yea...I know...not too smart and the chances of that happening are slim to none.

But lets just say we start camp and even go into the season with the QB's we currently have on the roster. The odd man out is obviously G. Hamdan...he will go to the PS. But then that leaves our rookie QB, CL and DC. All reports are pointing to DC being 100% by TC and even participating in the upcoming June TC. Yes I know....we heard that before so don't smash me. So lets say we start the June TC with a healthy DC, Beck and CL. Is it entirely possible that Beck has memorized the playbook like he said he has? Can he actually execute it? Time will tell. I know he may not be a start but in the end...maybe by next year, he will be the starter if not sooner like all the other QB's have like Palmer and Rivers.....pretty good examples if you ask me. So whats the worst that can happen there.... Beck learns the system inside and out and is a star.

Now with DC... Lets hope all reports are true and he is 90% only to be 100% come the June TC. Lets hope in this time he has done a lot of film study on defenses and such....unlikely but here is to hoping. It would be good to see him come out like his old self but I don't see a lot of patience there as far as lienincy(sp?). Fans want to win and win now and rightfully so. I do too. Who is to say that a DC of old will show up even at 100%....no one. DC has the heart but the head of knowledge has always been the culprit and everyone knows it. He is constantly getting bashed about being dumb to defenses and such. I can't defend him there because I don't know the deal. So I am for him coming in and COMPETEING for the starting role. I would be upset if it were handed to anyone. They need to EARN it....period.....even DC.

As for CL....he may show promise right now in practice but thats just it.....it is practice. He is at best a back up. I can never see him being a starting QB. I say this because it seems as we drafted Beck and Cam and Randy are high on him according to reports that he was rated up there with Quinn. CL will be a good back-up till they figure out the starting position. So for all those that think CL will start for us....not gonna happen.

Green.... I know he may know the offense...but who is to say it is a guarantee he will be here? Will Peterson sign him for 2007 to spite everyone in our orginization only to groom Croyle over there? Green is one hit from getting coloring books for Xmas for the rest of his life. He was great back in the day but he hasn't been the same since his concussion. How do you think he will be behind an OL that hasn't been set? If he got that concussion from being behind a line that was better than ours...just think of what will happen if we don't get our OL set and gelling like a fine, smooth machine. No QB will make it out alive.

And lastly....Hamdan.....I wont go there. He is as good as gone....maybe Europe...PS or just cut....who knows and who cares.

So be gentle with me....I was just voiceing some thoughts I was having.....

I am all for who WINS the job because they EARNED it and that goes for all positions. I look forward to a possible exciting year....GO PHINS!!!!
Click to expand...

I don't think you are so far off base. Basically as you said, we are either looking at Duante Culpepper or Trent Green as our starter at the beginning of this season. We all are optimistic about Beck, but rookies rarely do well their first year at QB. The front office wants to improve on 6-10 and also wants to set John Beck up to succeed, make no mistake about that. Mueller tied his future to him when he selected Ginn over Quinn. We all know that.

The Green Scenario is basically about if he can get released or traded from the Chiefs, and if he can avoid another concussion. The answer to both of those points is probably yes to the first and maybe to the second.

The Culpepper scenario is just as interesting to me. Alot of people seem to claim that he's Stupid and can't read defenses, and so on and so forth. I'm not sure I agree with that. No doubt, when he was younger and had two good wheels he used his size and athleticism. Does this mean he is stupid just because he has(d) those gifts? I'm not sure I buy into that. I think like all QB's in the NFL, he has made some good decisions and some bad decisions with the football, but I haven't seen anything in his stats (completion percentage for example when he was healthy) or in his history in the NFL that says he's stupid or can't read defenses. I don't think you can throw 40 touchdowns, and have a QB rating of 110 for the year as well as several others in the 90's by being stupid.

The biggest thing with Pep is if he's healthy and can trust the offensive line, then he has proven that he can be a very good QB in this league. If he never regains 100% of his mobility, then he still has his size, experience, and Arm and can then play the game like a slow white guy. :sidelol:

But, he has to learn how to adapt to playing in the pocket with less mobility. I don't think it's about his intelligence, but rather more about his need to adjust to playing without relying on his ability to escape the rush with his legs. People talk about Carson Palmer and compare him to Pep. fair enough since they both had similar injuries. But, Palmer never had the athleticism Culpepper had, so he didn't need as much mobility, he had much better talent at all of the skill positions, and a very good offensive line, so he didn't have to run for his life like culpepper did last year.

I guess my point is, that I'm not ready to throw Cpep under the bus just yet. Did he make some bad decisions last year? Sure he did. Was he running for his life playing behind a leaky Offensive line with a bad wheel? Yeah, you think that might have effected his decision making?

Not sure Green's going to be an upgrade over Culpepper. We have to take a look at him during training camp in my opinion...
 
Dolfndav34 said:
All along as the starter has earned the spot, I still believe in DC and believe he will regain his old form due to the fact he has alot of people to prove wrong and how sweet will that be for the dolphins. I will support whatever Cam wants to do, for he has the true understanding of where these players fit into our organization.
Click to expand...


I am the same way. As long as he earns it...I am all for whoever is there. I trust what Cam is doing. He is setting this team up the best way to win. He has done what it takes to get these players attention. I would love nothing more than to see DC prove all people wrong. But if Cam sees things in a different light, then so be it. Cam will put the best man behind center.
 
I am no expert, but as I see it culpepper is out. As you stated and most of the league realizes he has the physical tools but the mental part of the game seems to escape him, has always relied on scrambling to create a broken play for the homerun throw as opposed to running an offense the way it was designed.
If Green is cut grab him and let him start, worst case he gets here around the start of TC and is somewhat familiar with the system and will do an adequet job, providing our line doesnt get him killed:tongue: . But I have confidence in Houck to get the line gelling.
In some strange situation Green stays with KC, unlikely, I would rather see Lemon start over Beck. In no way amI saying Lemon is a better QB but I dont want Beck thrown to the wolves and ruining his career before it gets started. Seen it with to many talented QB's coming out of college. Lemon, while not great did an adequet job in the last game last season and with the addition of our rookies plus and offensive minded HC I think the offense will be better than last year regardless of who you start.....

Just my two cents......GO PHINS
 
JT99Dfense said:
As I was heading to college today, I heard Joe Rose talking to Cleo and I believe he has been named the starter as of right now. The guy has only started 1 game against the Colts. Clearly 1 game is not enough to evaluate him. Nonetheless, we almost beat the Colts with him at the helm. Who knows what he can bring to the table. We have not seen much of what he's got. I think Culpepper will eventually get healthy and Cleo will be the starter. We shall see in pre-season how Cleo fares.

All just mentioned is pending Trent Green does not sign with Miami. So hang on tight people, the fun is just getting started! :evil:

(The GM from the Chiefs wants a higher pick than we offer, he is still bitter of the Surtain trade. I think we got a higher pick than we deserved) :sidelol:
Click to expand...
Cleo is the starter considering Hamden and Beck. Culpepper isn't even in the picture as he's still rehabbing. So, no real surprise there. If we hang on to Culpepper and he's healthy by training camp, then I fully expect that he'll regain/earn the starting spot.
 
metalman32060 said:
I am no expert, but as I see it culpepper is out. As you stated and most of the league realizes he has the physical tools but the mental part of the game seems to escape him, has always relied on scrambling to create a broken play for the homerun throw as opposed to running an offense the way it was designed.
If Green is cut grab him and let him start, worst case he gets here around the start of TC and is somewhat familiar with the system and will do an adequet job, providing our line doesnt get him killed:tongue: . But I have confidence in Houck to get the line gelling.
In some strange situation Green stays with KC, unlikely, I would rather see Lemon start over Beck. In no way amI saying Lemon is a better QB but I dont want Beck thrown to the wolves and ruining his career before it gets started. Seen it with to many talented QB's coming out of college. Lemon, while not great did an adequet job in the last game last season and with the addition of our rookies plus and offensive minded HC I think the offense will be better than last year regardless of who you start.....

Just my two cents......GO PHINS
Click to expand...

I would not "give" it to him. He needs to prove he can execute it. No one should be given the job like I stated.

As far as your point on starting a rookie QB... I agree 100%. That is too much pressure for a young QB to be under. It wont help him at all. Granted there are some cases where it has worked out...Ie...Pitt and Tenn....but here in Miami where we have the Legend that is Marino and being compared to him not to mention a "Win now" mentality...too much for a young guy like Beck. He may be able to handle it but I wouldn't do it...
 
Kyndig said:
I don't think you are so far off base. Basically as you said, we are either looking at Duante Culpepper or Trent Green as our starter at the beginning of this season. We all are optimistic about Beck, but rookies rarely do well their first year at QB. The front office wants to improve on 6-10 and also wants to set John Beck up to succeed, make no mistake about that. Mueller tied his future to him when he selected Ginn over Quinn. We all know that.

The Green Scenario is basically about if he can get released or traded from the Chiefs, and if he can avoid another concussion. The answer to both of those points is probably yes to the first and maybe to the second.

The Culpepper scenario is just as interesting to me. Alot of people seem to claim that he's Stupid and can't read defenses, and so on and so forth. I'm not sure I agree with that. No doubt, when he was younger and had two good wheels he used his size and athleticism. Does this mean he is stupid just because he has(d) those gifts? I'm not sure I buy into that. I think like all QB's in the NFL, he has made some good decisions and some bad decisions with the football, but I haven't seen anything in his stats (completion percentage for example when he was healthy) or in his history in the NFL that says he's stupid or can't read defenses. I don't think you can throw 40 touchdowns, and have a QB rating of 110 for the year as well as several others in the 90's by being stupid.

The biggest thing with Pep is if he's healthy and can trust the offensive line, then he has proven that he can be a very good QB in this league. If he never regains 100% of his mobility, then he still has his size, experience, and Arm and can then play the game like a slow white guy. :sidelol:

But, he has to learn how to adapt to playing in the pocket with less mobility. I don't think it's about his intelligence, but rather more about his need to adjust to playing without relying on his ability to escape the rush with his legs. People talk about Carson Palmer and compare him to Pep. fair enough since they both had similar injuries. But, Palmer never had the athleticism Culpepper had, so he didn't need as much mobility, he had much better talent at all of the skill positions, and a very good offensive line, so he didn't have to run for his life like culpepper did last year.

I guess my point is, that I'm not ready to throw Cpep under the bus just yet. Did he make some bad decisions last year? Sure he did. Was he running for his life playing behind a leaky Offensive line with a bad wheel? Yeah, you think that might have effected his decision making?

Not sure Green's going to be an upgrade over Culpepper. We have to take a look at him during training camp in my opinion...
Click to expand...


Wasnt trying to imply he was dumb....just stating what people have said about him. I have the same way of thinking you do. We will see where he is at come TC. If you see this whole Green thing submarine...then it may look like DC is 100% and can handle this offense. Only Cam knows for sure...
 
chuckcole said:
Cleo is the starter considering Hamden and Beck. Culpepper isn't even in the picture as he's still rehabbing. So, no real surprise there. If we hang on to Culpepper and he's healthy by training camp, then I fully expect that he'll regain/earn the starting spot.
Click to expand...


Not to mention that the Green coming here may stop completely. I think if you see this Green coming here die...that may be an indicator that DC is healthy and Cam thinks he can run this offense...IMO.
 
O'townPhinFan said:
I would not "give" it to him. He needs to prove he can execute it. No one should be given the job like I stated.

As far as your point on starting a rookie QB... I agree 100%. That is too much pressure for a young QB to be under. It wont help him at all. Granted there are some cases where it has worked out...Ie...Pitt and Tenn....but here in Miami where we have the Legend that is Marino and being compared to him not to mention a "Win now" mentality...too much for a young guy like Beck. He may be able to handle it but I wouldn't do it...
Click to expand...


Definately needs to earn the spot, but from the reports I am hearing Lemon has done well thus far and does know the system. I know MC is to soon to make assumptions, but thats what I'm hoping for. Mabye we end up with a Brees/Rivers situation?

Hey I can dream cant I??
 
metalman32060 said:
Definately needs to earn the spot, but from the reports I am hearing Lemon has done well thus far and does know the system. I know MC is to soon to make assumptions, but thats what I'm hoping for. Mabye we end up with a Brees/Rivers situation?

Hey I can dream cant I??
Click to expand...


Nothing wrong with having a situation like that.... I would love to have a great QB not alone 2.....lol. The more the merrier I say....

Dream away man.....dream away....just make sure we win the SB...lol
 
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