Thundercracker
Practice Squad
sign me up to that jake grove bandwagon!
Marvez Q&A April 8, 2004
- Thread starter dolphan39
- Start date
sign me up to that jake grove bandwagon!
Ohiophinphan
Practice Squad
I'm on the same page as the others who want to solve our Oline problem first. The right side still has too many question marks. Can Whitely step up? Who will play RT? I think with the depth of this draft at WR we will be able to get someone in Rd 3 or 4 who Sullivan will be able to bring along. Round 1(or with a trade down round 2) should go to solve one of the outstanding Oline questions.
my only concern with the current WR situation ... is that boston isn't a guaranteed to be a model citizen ... an chambers F/A status for 2005 .. my thinking is that we have enough olineman .. and can't keep sinking sooooo much money into the OL ... there isn't any proven depth behind the current starters at WR .. and in any other draft we wouldn't be in a position to draft a talent at #20 that we could be getting in this draft... i know we all aren't comfortable with our oline as is.. but we did sign 3 lineman .. and with andrews not guaranteed to be there @ 20 ... why beat a dead horse.. now if andrews is there .. i can see miami jump on him.. IF he is in shape and ready to knock some serious butt ... but IF he isn't .. go for the more serious threat and draft the WR .. giving them a opportunity to open the attack up sooooo much more than in the past ...
LarryFinFan
Left So Fla, never the Fins...
91...Minnis, Thompson, and Wilkens were all starters...however, I agree that could use another WR. If RS and DW have seen some things that Tolver can do that we haven't seen, then perhaps they are not too worried about the 3rd WR position. But as has been said, with CC, DB, RM, RW, and RK in our base offensive set...there won't be as much need for a 3rd WR....in addition, when RW comes out, Minor has been great on third down situations....All of this leads us back to OL as where I think they will go in the 1st, unless they can trade down, still get the OL they want and get a mid 2nd round pickup at WR. That is all speculation...I think quite a few teams will be looking to trade down from the 18th-24th picks....Quality is not there for most positions, sans WR.
ckparrothead
Premium Member
Some teams have a weakness at 3rd CB and some have slowness in their LB corp. It would do well if the Dolphins offense could take advantage of either or depending on who they play and that means getting a dangerous 3rd WR. Not a first rounder mind you, but a 2nd or 3rd rounder might due.
TheBostonBomber
Practice Squad
Take o-line with 1st then best available wr with the third. IMO trade down if andrews not there pick up smiley grove snee or carey(whoever is available) Then pick up best available wr with a late second or earlier third. o-line trumps wr this draft.
TheyHateUs
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Dolfans....
I'm pretty new to this site and have read many posts go back and forth regarding what the Fins should draft with their draft picks especially in the 1st round. The talk has been OL or WR mostly. I've read some legitimate points on why we should be drafting this or that position as well. Well I just wanted to write to add some food for thought.
Everyone is saying our line is in shambles and they are horrible and we must draft OL in the first round. I disagree with that opinion partially because of this one point. Do any of you remember who were our lineman in 2002 when Ricky rushed for 1853? The difference in 2003 was Mark Dixon and a healthy Jaime Nails. Well I anticipate that Wade Smith will be better his 2nd year than in his first year. Jeno James is an upgrade from Jamie Nails last year. I really couldn't tell the difference with either Ruddy or McKinney starting at center. Right guard will be a competition with several guys already on the roster plus a possible addition via mid round draft or after June 1st. Right Tackle is a position we will probably have good competition until McIntosh can come back IF (most likely) we sign Randall. It seems to me in IMO that if we can resemble the same type of scrappy guys we had in 2002 and muster about 1500 yards running. IF that's the case then we should all be happy. Remember the last 2 Super Bowl winners didn't have 1000 yard backs. Our line wasn't great last year, but they weren't horrible. I believe our biggest concern still at QB, DT, LB, S in that order. Quarterback is still the most important ingredient to an offese. I know the line gets the job done, but do you really think it was our offensive line that helped Marino to all he low sack totals. I would love to see A.J. Feely be our guy, but if history repeats itself we would now have two injury prone QB's on our roster. Feely has great size and good arm strength, but the reason why you never really got to see much of him is due to him always being injured during college. As for Fiedler I congratulate him for toughing it out the last couple of years. He gave us everything he had and I respect him for that, but he isn't consistent enough for us to get over the hump. And we all know that hump is pretty huge in South Florida. Right now, is the time to draft a young talented quarterback. We must seize the moment. If this quarterback can sit back and learn a year or possibly two CC, DB, RM, RW will all still be relatively young and could all excell together. If not quarterback, then DT so we can rest TB knee's which he is on his last legs. If not QB or DT, then a speedy LB like D.J. Williams could help hammer running backs or stay in coverage with his 4.55 speed in the 40. If not QB, DT, LB we take S which would probably sit a year before playing. IMO if your not a quarterback and your a 1st round pick you better play and contribute your first year.
I'm not trying to be pessimistic but the way I see it is Wanny will be out soon enough. Hopefully we can have pieces already in place for the next coach to take us over the hump ala John Gruden/Tony Dungy.
I know I wrote a book, but what do the rest of you guys think about all this.....
TheyHateUs
I'm pretty new to this site and have read many posts go back and forth regarding what the Fins should draft with their draft picks especially in the 1st round. The talk has been OL or WR mostly. I've read some legitimate points on why we should be drafting this or that position as well. Well I just wanted to write to add some food for thought.
Everyone is saying our line is in shambles and they are horrible and we must draft OL in the first round. I disagree with that opinion partially because of this one point. Do any of you remember who were our lineman in 2002 when Ricky rushed for 1853? The difference in 2003 was Mark Dixon and a healthy Jaime Nails. Well I anticipate that Wade Smith will be better his 2nd year than in his first year. Jeno James is an upgrade from Jamie Nails last year. I really couldn't tell the difference with either Ruddy or McKinney starting at center. Right guard will be a competition with several guys already on the roster plus a possible addition via mid round draft or after June 1st. Right Tackle is a position we will probably have good competition until McIntosh can come back IF (most likely) we sign Randall. It seems to me in IMO that if we can resemble the same type of scrappy guys we had in 2002 and muster about 1500 yards running. IF that's the case then we should all be happy. Remember the last 2 Super Bowl winners didn't have 1000 yard backs. Our line wasn't great last year, but they weren't horrible. I believe our biggest concern still at QB, DT, LB, S in that order. Quarterback is still the most important ingredient to an offese. I know the line gets the job done, but do you really think it was our offensive line that helped Marino to all he low sack totals. I would love to see A.J. Feely be our guy, but if history repeats itself we would now have two injury prone QB's on our roster. Feely has great size and good arm strength, but the reason why you never really got to see much of him is due to him always being injured during college. As for Fiedler I congratulate him for toughing it out the last couple of years. He gave us everything he had and I respect him for that, but he isn't consistent enough for us to get over the hump. And we all know that hump is pretty huge in South Florida. Right now, is the time to draft a young talented quarterback. We must seize the moment. If this quarterback can sit back and learn a year or possibly two CC, DB, RM, RW will all still be relatively young and could all excell together. If not quarterback, then DT so we can rest TB knee's which he is on his last legs. If not QB or DT, then a speedy LB like D.J. Williams could help hammer running backs or stay in coverage with his 4.55 speed in the 40. If not QB, DT, LB we take S which would probably sit a year before playing. IMO if your not a quarterback and your a 1st round pick you better play and contribute your first year.
I'm not trying to be pessimistic but the way I see it is Wanny will be out soon enough. Hopefully we can have pieces already in place for the next coach to take us over the hump ala John Gruden/Tony Dungy.
I know I wrote a book, but what do the rest of you guys think about all this.....
TheyHateUs
FinaciousOne
Practice Squad
I for one have not said our line is in shambles or horrible. I believe we’ve made definite progress so far this off-season, but we not finished talent or depth wise. While the line was good at run blocking two years ago, we’ve not had a good pass blocking line (which most linemen find harder to excel at) for some time now. Nor have we had sufficient depth. This has increased our predictability, made it easier for opposing defensive coordinators to game plan us, hurt our flexibility to execute plays like screens and made us overuse Ricky. Marino was hard to sack for many reasons; quick release, quick reading defenses, WRs who new how to read blitzes and follow the playbook, and for much of his career, a line that was better at pass blocking than run blocking (an anomaly). If you ever get a chance to see the 85 Bears game 1st half, watch the line play. Excellent performance against what many regard as one of the best ever defenses. By the way, Marino too had a bad college injury (knee) that kept him from playing much his senior year. Marino never won a Superbowl and only got us there once because of the lack of a balanced team. Finding a new Marino is not the key. Balance, Value, Depth. (BVDs) Your reference to past SB winners is well taken, but misleading. Look at total yards rushing. Also review the number of SB participants with adequate QB. A great team can make an adequate QB look great (and protect him from injury). A lot of fans focus on the QB because their eye follows the ball much like in chess where the queen gets all the attention. But at the Grandmaster level it’s the Pawns that win the game. Likewise, Line play is the soul of football.
Dolphan_B
Practice Squad
Folks, Marvez's main point has nothing to do with drafting a WR at #20.
I doesn't matter who we sign or who we draft if Wanny interferes with the offensive play calling and goes Kippy Brown like he did last year.
Norv is one of the most dangerous offensive coordinators in the league and had Miami averaging 27 PPG with the starters playing in 2002. That crashed and burned to 21 PPG with the starters playing in 2003 because the offense became stale and predictable.
Miami has all the talent it needs right now on offense with the exception of a ORG. THE QUESTION is whether Wanny can loosen his sphincter when the QB has some INTs or we go into big games to keep the offense mixed and to pass on first down.
If we playcall like last year, Miami doesn't make the playoffs again.
I doesn't matter who we sign or who we draft if Wanny interferes with the offensive play calling and goes Kippy Brown like he did last year.
Norv is one of the most dangerous offensive coordinators in the league and had Miami averaging 27 PPG with the starters playing in 2002. That crashed and burned to 21 PPG with the starters playing in 2003 because the offense became stale and predictable.
Miami has all the talent it needs right now on offense with the exception of a ORG. THE QUESTION is whether Wanny can loosen his sphincter when the QB has some INTs or we go into big games to keep the offense mixed and to pass on first down.
If we playcall like last year, Miami doesn't make the playoffs again.
Naturally, I would like to see both a healthy O-Line and a great 3rd WR, but without a 2nd and 4th round pick, we may have to prioritize.
As long as Wannstedt is coach, we have to go back to what has worked. His best season was by far his 1st season with us. We didn't have a lot of great talent on that team, but we did have a very good O-Line (Webb, Dixon, Ruddy, Donnalley, and Wade). Most of those guys, by the way, had their best seasons as pros that year. It was an underrated line.
Therefore, I think we still have to think about the O-Line. I like Smiley, because he is low-risk, very productive, and offers great athletic ability. I would love to see James and Smiley pull and make downfield blocks. Ricky must return to 2002 form and the passing game (this year) will be fine.
Maybe a good WR will be available after June 1, or perhaps Tolver will develop. We have a great WR coach now in Jerry Sullivan.
As long as Wannstedt is coach, we have to go back to what has worked. His best season was by far his 1st season with us. We didn't have a lot of great talent on that team, but we did have a very good O-Line (Webb, Dixon, Ruddy, Donnalley, and Wade). Most of those guys, by the way, had their best seasons as pros that year. It was an underrated line.
Therefore, I think we still have to think about the O-Line. I like Smiley, because he is low-risk, very productive, and offers great athletic ability. I would love to see James and Smiley pull and make downfield blocks. Ricky must return to 2002 form and the passing game (this year) will be fine.
Maybe a good WR will be available after June 1, or perhaps Tolver will develop. We have a great WR coach now in Jerry Sullivan.