Merged:Corner back deals over the last two years./trading Surtain...

PhinsPhan

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Corner back deals over the last two years.

This has already been beat to death but this is a bit of a different approach.

At the start of free agency when there were still corners available on the market New England traded a 3rd round pick for Duane Starks.

Last year New Orleans traded a second round pick and a QB prospect in JT O'Sullivan for Mike McKenzie.

Now the corner market is completely empty except for an injured Law, who the Patriots would rather trade a 3rd round pick to get someone to replace him.

IF the Chiefs want to offer us their 4th round pick that is fine. But I cant see any way that Saban lets Surtain go for less than a third. The sad part is Surtain wont fetch the same value that McKenzie did, and will probably barely fetch just over what Duane Starks did. I just wish we were able to re-sign this guy so that an unfair trade wasnt our only option.
 

KB21

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PhinsPhan said:
This has already been beat to death but this is a bit of a different approach.

At the start of free agency when there were still corners available on the market New England traded a 3rd round pick for Duane Starks.

Last year New Orleans traded a second round pick and a QB prospect in JT O'Sullivan for Mike McKenzie.

Now the corner market is completely empty except for an injured Law, who the Patriots would rather trade a 3rd round pick to get someone to replace him.

IF the Chiefs want to offer us their 4th round pick that is fine. But I cant see any way that Saban lets Surtain go for less than a third. The sad part is Surtain wont fetch the same value that McKenzie did, and will probably barely fetch just over what Duane Starks did. I just wish we were able to re-sign this guy so that an unfair trade wasnt our only option.
Well, Nick isn't going to trade Surtain just for the hell of it. He isn't going to sit back and say "Well, the only offer we have is a 4th, so we will take it." This isn't that type of situation. If we don't get value for Patrick, we will let him play out this contract.
 

Spray Mucus

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I've said this before and I'll say it again...


We will get much more value out of Surtain AFTER the draft... teams who think they will address there DB need in the draft, and there guy doesn't fall to them... they will trade an 06 pick for pat.
 

His Dudeness

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i agree also, if mckenzie was shopped now, there isnt anyway they could get the same value they got for him. the stock for trading pat is at an all-time low. don't trade him yet.

the thing getting lost in all of this, is why is KC so stupid? they should fork over a couple of thirds or something and run all the way to the bank. they have a great offense.. and NO DEFENSE which costed them playoff wins, and the whole season last year.. what are they being cute and dicking around?

really, its an insult to the dolphins and the KC fans... heres' a top of the line corner that we can get, for relatively nothing.. and we're going to play hardball? and probably shoot ourselves in the foot.
 

marino2duper73

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Trading Surtain......

Why are there not any better offers for Patrick Surtain ? It's quite simple, actually. Pat has exceptional coverage skills, but has had a bit of trouble throughout his career defending the 4.3 speedsters on the go route. He has the all around ability of the position, but has shown a bit of weakness when the speed comes straight at him. With the new breed of speedy WRs in the league, maybe more teams are looking for smaller , faster CBs who can keep up, and bring a safety over to help past 30 yards. The man coverage scheme is dwindling in this league. More defensive coordinators are going to spread nickel and dime packs when it's a deep threat offense that they are facing. And with more teams using 5 WR sets more often, a great man-toman CB just isn't in high demand. That's my thoughts...Any help ?
 

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I agree with everything you said and would also add the new pass interference enforcement makes man cover corners in even less demand.
 

His Dudeness

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because its what the market is dictating. kc knows we can't get much better for him right now.
 

marino2duper73

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UltraDol-Fan said:
I agree with everything you said and would also add the new pass interference enforcement makes man cover corners in even less demand.
Great point..Forgot about that dumb rule !!
 

Celtkin

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marino2duper73 said:
Why are there not any better offers for Patrick Surtain ? It's quite simple, actually. Pat has exceptional coverage skills, but has had a bit of trouble throughout his career defending the 4.3 speedsters on the go route. He has the all around ability of the position, but has shown a bit of weakness when the speed comes straight at him. With the new breed of speedy WRs in the league, maybe more teams are looking for smaller , faster CBs who can keep up, and bring a safety over to help past 30 yards. The man coverage scheme is dwindling in this league. More defensive coordinators are going to spread nickel and dime packs when it's a deep threat offense that they are facing. And with more teams using 5 WR sets more often, a great man-toman CB just isn't in high demand. That's my thoughts...Any help ?
Could be but I think that the reason is a combination of our demands for a high draft pick and Pat's demands. I don't think that any team doubts Surtain's ability against almost any receiver. The fact of the matter is he rarely gets burned on routes. It boils down to negotiating and I think that something will get done closer to draft day than sooner.
 

Shamboubou

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UltraDol-Fan said:
I agree with everything you said and would also add the new pass interference enforcement makes man cover corners in even less demand.
That is exactly what I was going to say. Pat is a in your face type of CB and he isn't really allowed to play that style anymore. I would rather just restructure him, cut some dead weight (Minor, Rosenfelds, ect) and put him back in a Fins jersey. We're not going to get anything out of him and its pointless throwing a pro-bowl player away for a 4th round pick.
 

His Dudeness

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Shamboubou said:
That is exactly what I was going to say. Pat is a in your face type of CB and he isn't really allowed to play that style anymore. I would rather just restructure him, cut some dead weight (Minor, Rosenfelds, ect) and put him back in a Fins jersey. We're not going to get anything out of him and its pointless throwing a pro-bowl player away for a 4th round pick.
:roflmao:

obviously, that would be ideal, but it isnt going to happen.. you cant just say ok RESTRUCTURE. the man wants to get paaayyeeed.
 

FinFan Brazil

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KC ofter only a 4rth cause they can´t restruture Pat´s salary, and after the next season he is a free man...
 

BrazForPhins

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Shamboubou said:
That is exactly what I was going to say. Pat is a in your face type of CB and he isn't really allowed to play that style anymore. I would rather just restructure him, cut some dead weight (Minor, Rosenfelds, ect) and put him back in a Fins jersey. We're not going to get anything out of him and its pointless throwing a pro-bowl player away for a 4th round pick.
it's not easy like that..maybe we can get some value at draft day or after..
and if he was going to restructure he would not be shopped the way he's being
 

FIN-IN-RI

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Spray Mucus said:
I've said this before and I'll say it again...


We will get much more value out of Surtain AFTER the draft... teams who think they will address there DB need in the draft, and there guy doesn't fall to them... they will trade an 06 pick for pat.
I agree with this. Saban is in no rush.
 
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