Offensive scoring leads to having a defense that gives up yards | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Offensive scoring leads to having a defense that gives up yards

Fins1971

Fins1971

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Just look at the past year in the NFL

The top 5 scoring teams were

1. Green Bay
2. New Orleans
3. New England
4. Detroit
5. Carolina

Conversely these team all ranked in the bottom 10 of defensive yards allowed.

23. Detroit
24. New Orleans
28. Carolina
31. New England
32. Green Bay

This seem to hold true from the past also. I remember when we drafted Dan Marino. At the time our offensive scoring was average usually around 12th in the league. But our defense was good an not giving up yards. Then Marino started and in 5 of the next 11 years we had a top 5 scoring offense. In those 5 years the best defensive yards ranking we had was 19th. So it seems that as your offense scores more your defense get worse at allowing yards. When Marino left we have not been in the top 5 scoring since. Then all of a sudden our defensive yards ranking was in the top 10 consistently. The defense does what it has to to keep you in a game.

There are a few examples through out NFL history where a team was so dominant that the D still didn't allow yards even though the offense was top 5 scoring.

1971 Dolphins 4th in scoring, 5th in defensive yards.
1972 Dolphins 1st in scoring, 1st in defensive yards.
1973 Dolphins 5th in scoring, 3rd in defensive yards.

Those are the only teams in Dolphin history to have top 5 scoring offense and top 5 defensive yards ranking. This was a dominant team that had the best winning percentage in the history of NFL over 3 years (43-6) (87.8%)

Other teams

1985 Bears 2nd in scoring, 1st in defensive yards (Super Bowl Winner)
2006 Bears 2nd in scoring, 5th in defensive yards (Super Bow Loser)
2007 Patriots, 1st in scoring, 4th in defensive yards (Super Bowl Loser- 16-0 reg. season) None of the other Patriots championship teams acoomplished top 5 in both.
2008 Giants, 3rd in scoring, 5th in defensive yards (eliminated in 1st round) None of the 4 Giant super bowls teams accomplished top 5 in both.

The 73 thru 79 Steelers teams accomplished it 5 times during their dynasty of 4 Super Bowl wins. After that only able to accomplish 1 time in 1995 when they lost the Super Bowl to Dallas

The 92 thru 96 Cowboy team accomplished it 2 times during their dynasty of 3 Super Bowl wins. After that they havent been able to repeat the feat.

The 84 thru 89 49ers team accomplished it 2 time during their dynasty of 3 Super bowl wins in 6 years.

There aren't alot of example of top 5 in both of these categories except for the teams that were very dominant.

That being said Hopefully our defense doesnt get any more generous at giving up yards as our offense improves it scoring output like it did last year.

2010 30th in scoring, 6th in yards allowed.
2011 20th in scoring, 15th in yards allowed.

Thoughts?
 
interesting and proves the point that our defense is over rated simply because we don't score and give the ball to the other team.
 
We were 6th in the NFL in rushing attempts last season. Running the ball a lot is the old tired and true method of keeping the score down and keeping your defense off the field. Perfect example is the Broncos last season. They ran ran ran the ball and only passed when they needed to. The plan was to keep the score close then win it at the end. This is one reason that Tim Tebow's completion rating was so low, he NEVER attempted a 3-5 yard dump off pass.

It is true that the faster you score, the quicker the other offense has the ball and the quicker your defense has to go back on the field. I've always called it the NBA way of playing football.

No one had more pass attempts then Green Bay and I'm sure that the Saints and the Patriots were close behind. What becomes important for those teams is A) scoring a lot and B) making the big stops when needed.

If we are going to run a hurry up offense then we make to make a lot of first downs over and over or our defense is going to be run ragged.

The 85 Bears were a special team in that their overpowering defense got them the ball a lot and lead to a lot of their scoring. But their secondary was weak and Marino shredded them. IMO, they could not cope with the modern Patriots, Saint's etc offensives with the rule changes.
 
Fins1971 said:
Just look at the past year in the NFL

The top 5 scoring teams were

1. Green Bay
2. New Orleans
3. New England
4. Detroit
5. Carolina
Click to expand...

I found this really weird.. We can compare it to practicing boxing with Mike Tyson or Golf with Tiger Woods - I will definitely improve my skills if I had one of these guys tutoring me....

Now, these defenses face Brady, Bress, Rodgers in practice EVERYDAY and still manage to rank in the bottom of the NFL...:confused:
 
Mike Tyson in his prime knocking you out every 46 seconds is not going to teach you that much. The only lesson you might learn is not to get in the ring with Mike Tyson.

IMO, one big problem with this teams is that they score so quickly. Plus, much like the Dolphins did under Marino, they put most of the effect and draft picks into their offense.
 
Ill take an offense that can score TDs over an elite defense.
 
Out of curiosity how far back did you go? If you went back to the 70 season when the NFL and AFL merged regular seasons, then by your count that's 16 teams in 42 years ranked in the top 5 in each category. That means once every 2-3 years a team ranks top 5 in both categories and you think that is not a lot? You realize how hard it is to actually do that right?
 
well when you play with the lead most of the time your defense usually plays prevent which gives alot of cushion in coverage.
 
Here's the deal....if you have a high scoring offense the opposing team is usually playing catch up, especially if your team scores first. This forces the opposing team to change their offensive playcalling from "run heavy ball control, eat up some clock" mode to "pass heavy, stay in the game, try to score points" mode...

It is why Indy was bad last year, their defense is built to play with a lead, ie get after opposing QB's...but teams were not playing to come from behind on them last year, their opponents were playing with the lead, and a Defense that is built aroud D. Freeney getting after the QB is going to suck at trying to stop at team from puoning them with run game trying to protect a lead...hope that makes sense
also, the more time your team has the lead, the more time they spend in those God-awful prevent defenses...
 
regency said:
well when you play with the lead most of the time your defense usually plays prevent which gives alot of cushion in coverage.
Click to expand...

Props to you...You said in one sentence, what it took me two paragraghs to say...
:hi5:
 
jwiley3493 said:
Out of curiosity how far back did you go? If you went back to the 70 season when the NFL and AFL merged regular seasons, then by your count that's 16 teams in 42 years ranked in the top 5 in each category. That means once every 2-3 years a team ranks top 5 in both categories and you think that is not a lot? You realize how hard it is to actually do that right?
Click to expand...


I went back to 70, however that is NOT a comprehensive list of all the teams that have done it. There are probably a few more in there that we could come up with. I just looked at the dynasties of the last 40 years and a few other teams that I knew accomplished the feat. And yes I realize how hard is is to do. I have been waiting for almost 40 years for the Dolphins to do it again.

Dominant on both sides of the ball. That is what I like to see.
 
regency said:
well when you play with the lead most of the time your defense usually plays prevent which gives alot of cushion in coverage.
Click to expand...

Which is one of the reasons why I would rate the 2011 Patriots defense as much better than most people give them credit for.
31st against yards but 15th in points allowed. And they forced alot of turnovers while the offnese was near the top of the league in scoring.
 
Obviously, in football or basketball, if you score quickly and frequently then it's going skew your defensive numbers a little bit because the opposition will have more opportunities to score. At the same time, those quick strike teams that you listed (Packers, Patriots, Saints) are always in the playoffs and are always in a position to win it all. That isn't a coincidence. You obviously need to have a balanced team and make stops on defense, but there's no way that it's a negative to have a great quarterback and an explosive offense that can put the ball in the end zone at any time.
You can't possibly tell me that you don't want to have the offense that the Packers, Saints, Patriots or Panthers have right now.
 
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