OL Woes-Blame it on JJ ? | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

OL Woes-Blame it on JJ ?

WILLIS21 said:
You can blame Wannstedt if you want. JJ hasn't been in Miami for 6 years now.
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Check that: or blame Spielman, whoever had final authority at the draft (Wade Smith, Taylor Whitley, Seth McKinney). Looks like they got a good one in Carey though.
 
WILLIS21 said:
Check that: or blame Spielman, whoever had final authority at the draft (Wade Smith, Taylor Whitley, Seth McKinney). Looks like they got a good one in Carey though.
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wouldn't be a bit surprised if JJ had plenty of input after he left and DW took over...Keeping in mind their close friendship due to the many years they had together...JJ was just a phone call away - and still lived down in the Keyes. If anyone was a crutch for DW it was JJ.
 
Fran2fin said:
wouldn't be a bit surprised if JJ had plenty of input after he left and DW took over...Keeping in mind their close friendship due to the many years they had together...JJ was just a phone call away - and still lived down in the Keyes. If anyone was a crutch for DW it was JJ.
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Good point.
 
Catch 22 said:
So was Jimmy responsible for our OL woes? He didnt believe in spending money or high draft picks for offensive lineman.

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/sports/12460690.htm
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Its a good point.

''You need two dominant linemen, and the Dolphins don't have any,'' former Dolphins fullback and 790 Radio analyst Rob Konrad, who retired this year, said off-air Tuesday. ``This is not new. The problem is the philosophy of Jimmy Johnson of never drafting a lineman before the third round.

''You never had a bunch of high picks except [ Dave Wannstedt draft pick] Todd Wade, and they made a mistake letting him go. You have to spend some high picks on offensive linemen or you're going to spend through the teeth'' in free agency.
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WILLIS21 said:
Check that: or blame Spielman, whoever had final authority at the draft (Wade Smith, Taylor Whitley, Seth McKinney). Looks like they got a good one in Carey though.
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Spielman actually got this team 40% of its likely starting OL in the one draft he had authority over. If there is anybody you *shouldn't* blame, I'd say it's him.
 
Now that I've done a little research in the 5 years Wannstedt was with the Dolphins he did take a O-lineman with Miami's 1st pick in 3 drafts

2000 Todd Wade 2nd Round
2002 Seth McKInney 3rd Round
2004 Vernon Carey 1st Round

In 2001 Wany took Jamar Fletcher at 26 and Chambers at 52. The only lineman between these two picks who ended being good were Matt Light and Dominic Raiola.

Can't argue with Wanny taking Chambers at 52 as he's been a very good WR. The only decent O-Lineman taken after Chambers was Jonas Jennings and Casey Rabach neither who have ever been in the Probowl. IN 2003 Wanny took Eddie Moore in the 2nd Round and 2 OL in the third round (Smith and Whitley). SO Wanny did take O-Lineman with "first day" picks, they just weren't very good with the exception of Carey and Wade. Not having 1st rounds picks in 02 and 03 didn't help but they were used to trade for Ricky Williams, who obviously was a huge upgrade over Lamar Smith.
 
Jimmy James said:
Spielman actually got this team 40% of its likely starting OL in the one draft he had authority over. If there is anybody you *shouldn't* blame, I'd say it's him.
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Yep your right. Carey and Hadnot are on the way to being very good O-Lineman. As you stated, Spielman shouldn't be blamed, as he drafted these guys in the only draft where he had authority.
 
Jimmy James said:
Spielman actually got this team 40% of its likely starting OL in the one draft he had authority over. If there is anybody you *shouldn't* blame, I'd say it's him.
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But he also spit out the unnecessary 4th for Carey. IMO that disqualifies the pick from being a success, regardless who it is or what position. Sorry but I prioritize doing the right thing. That 4th could have turned out to be anyone, maybe a Pro Bowl savior. All the Spielman apologists rave about his late round prowess. Fine, I say this time. By donating a 4th Spielman gave away rights to the guy who would be the best player on our roster right now.

That opinion is no more idiotic than giving away the 4th in the first place.

Hadnot may be a fine player. Based on less than overwhelming athletic ability I estimate otherwise, a functional pro but someone we will want to replace once the line takes shape elsewhere. Admittedly, I have not focused on Hadnot enough yet, block after block.

Spielman's one year also included dumping Todd Wade, a very solid RT just entering his prime. That position could have been set for another half decade. Yeah, the money. Spielman had no problem getting rid of a terrific young DE and our best offensive lineman. Then he delights to shower cash on the likes of Reggie Howard and Damion McIntosh, the latter situation spared the big payout by a fluke friendly gesture from the Raiders. Frankly, I wish that call had never been made. If Spielman had been publicly embarrassed by the McIntosh contract terms and unaware of the injury, perhaps he would have been weakened as a GM, with someone else assuming power alongside, long before the pathetic Ogunleye and Gordon trades took place.
 
Was it really necessary to veer from the premise of this thread to bash Spielman? We were talking about a very particular thing (the drafting of offensive linemen), and the bulk of what you wrote has nothing to do with it.
 
One thing is for sure, JJ 's o-line draft picks all sucked besides Wade. But despite the fact that JJ did not know how to draft healthy and great offense players (Jabbar? Avery? Green? ) at all, you can not blame him for everything which Wannstedt did or did not. Of course there is no player on which Wannstedt could build a line on, but then it was Wanny 's fault not to get a decent player in the draft instead of hiring awful FA's (Perry), drafting prospects (Smith ) while giving up high picks for them or drafting simply (below) average guys (McKiney, Whitney) in the 3rd round or later.
In the end what killed us what this constant win-now attitude: giving up picks (3rd this year against 2nd next year) and a total lack of 1st rounders.

Still I think JJ is vastly overrated. He picked JZ, Zach, Sam Madison, Surtain, Gardner (great when healthy), but besides those truly amazing players there aren't many to remember. I mean the guy had a zillion of picks but 60% never made it and 25% are not in the NFL anymore (the Mixons, Bromells...).
 
Well you gotta blame it on something, you gotta blame it on something, Blame it on the Rain that was falling, falling.;)
 
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