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PFW: Why didn’t Harrington work out in Detroit?

TXFinFan

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Reynolds: The most candid response on that subject came from Charley Casserly in an interview last year. Casserly said he knew of teams who placed a second- or third-round grade on Harrington in 2002, meaning his value was that of an early-middle-round pick. The Lions then were in the relatively early stages of a front office headed by Matt Millen and personnel director Bill Tobin. Head coach Marty Mornhinweg had zero experience calling the shots. According to league sources, the Lions had phoned other teams the week of the draft to get their opinions on Harrington. April being National Liar’s Month in the NFL, you can imagine the type of mixed response Millen likely received. It was telling that the Texans, who had the No. 1 overall pick in ’02, considered only David Carr and Julius Peppers (interestingly, had they selected Peppers, they might now have Reggie Bush). Harrington wasn’t even in the picture for Casserly when he pulled the trigger five years ago and brought in Carr.

Once Harrington made it to Detroit, his professional growth was extremely limited by the inexperience of the front office, coaching staff and roster. Harrington had little help on the field and didn’t show much improvement through practice and offseason repetition. Harrington was a Jeff Tedford prodigy and was drilled to the hilt at Oregon. He didn’t receive the same meticulous attention to detail in Detroit, and his preparation habits suffered because he didn’t have a mentor to follow. By his third season, there were still only flashes of ability and no long-term stretches of brilliance to indicate he could be a long-term starter.

Harrington’s position coaches, including Greg Olson and West Coast offense tactician Ted Tollner, were unable to get a key message across to Harrington  anticipation is a must at this level. Whether it was adjusting to the speed of the game or the proliferation of cover-2 defenses that clouded reads for Harrington, he’s never been able to anticipate location or time up routes with his receivers. He was most successful on stationary short routes or deep throws off vertical routes and failed to grasp the essential elements to make timing patterns  the bread and butter of the West Coast offense  click with the Lions’ assortment of talented receivers. With Mike Martz in Detroit to integrate his timing offense, Harrington was never truly in the equation.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Commentary/Spins/2006/spins051506.htm
 
ckparrothead said:
Ouch. Now THAT to me sounds like a pretty dang good explanation for Joey's career.

I know. I think our offense will play more to his strengths. Plus, he will have better coaching.
 
Ya'll can be optimistic, I won't take that from you. But this looks to me like one of those situations where I know there's not going to be some kind of upward surprise, and later on I'm gonna be like...well, told ya so.

I'm far more optimistic about Cleo Lemon than Joey Harrington. You don't hitch yourself to fallen stars and come out looking like a genius IMO.
 
ckparrothead said:
Ya'll can be optimistic, I won't take that from you. But this looks to me like one of those situations where I know there's not going to be some kind of upward surprise, and later on I'm gonna be like...well, told ya so.

I'm far more optimistic about Cleo Lemon than Joey Harrington. You don't hitch yourself to fallen stars and come out looking like a genius IMO.

You have a point, but I'm mostly optimistic because Saban is so optimistic about Harrington as an insurance policy.
 
TXFinFan said:
You have a point, but I'm mostly optimistic because Saban is so optimistic about Harrington as an insurance policy.

To him it's easy to understand. It's a marriage between pedigree/talent and opportunity. Saban's made a living marrying those two off with positive consequences.

He can't be right every time though. He wasn't right about Stockar McDougle.
 
ckparrothead said:
To him it's easy to understand. It's a marriage between pedigree/talent and opportunity. Saban's made a living marrying those two off with positive consequences.

He can't be right every time though. He wasn't right about Stockar McDougle.


It was also a situation (for Saban) of choosing the lesser of all the evils available.

Who would you have rather Saban gotten?

We tried to re-sign Frerotte.
Maddox?
Collins? (But he apparently doesn't want to sign unless he starts)

Harrington was the best option OVERALL. Talent/experience/cap-hit/etc.
 
ckparrothead said:
To him it's easy to understand. It's a marriage between pedigree/talent and opportunity. Saban's made a living marrying those two off with positive consequences.

He can't be right every time though. He wasn't right about Stockar McDougle.

True, but being right 19 out of 20 times is a pretty good success rate. I think Saban will make Harrington into a better QB than Frerotte. Don't you think that is pretty good for a backup? We already have a franchise QB.
 
Mile High Fin said:
It was also a situation (for Saban) of choosing the lesser of all the evils available.

Who would you have rather Saban gotten?

We tried to re-sign Frerotte.
Maddox?
Collins? (But he apparently doesn't want to sign unless he starts)

Harrington was the best option OVERALL. Talent/experience/cap-hit/etc.

Sage Rosenfels.
 
ckparrothead said:
Sage Rosenfels.

Maybe Sage has more potential than Harrington........maybe.

But Harrington has much more experience than Sage.......definately.


However, in the end, I believe both are QBs with ratings in the 70s (give or take).
Saban certainly saw Sage's abilities first-hand last year, and allowed him to go elsewhere.

Bottom line: If Sage is your BEST answer for another backup QB, then Harrington's OK by me...
:D
 
ckparrothead said:
Sage Rosenfels.

It would've cost us $7 Million to keep Sage.

The Texans signed him to a four-year, $6.4 million contract that included a $2 million signing bonus.
 
If Joey's an improvement over Frerotte - he's well worth it. But let's give Frerotte some props for managing a good game out there. Gus did well for the skills he has (not a very accurate QB).
 
IMO Harrington can be better than Gus, but I don't think either one is a starter you can expect to win it all with. I'm not sure that Joey will be better than Gus would have been this season, but I think in 2 years Joey will be better. I also believe that Lemon has more upside (and also more downside) than Joey.
 
TXFinFan said:
Reynolds: The most candid response on that subject came from Charley Casserly in an interview last year. Casserly said he knew of teams who placed a second- or third-round grade on Harrington in 2002, meaning his value was that of an early-middle-round pick. The Lions then were in the relatively early stages of a front office headed by Matt Millen and personnel director Bill Tobin. Head coach Marty Mornhinweg had zero experience calling the shots. According to league sources, the Lions had phoned other teams the week of the draft to get their opinions on Harrington. April being National Liar’s Month in the NFL, you can imagine the type of mixed response Millen likely received. It was telling that the Texans, who had the No. 1 overall pick in ’02, considered only David Carr and Julius Peppers (interestingly, had they selected Peppers, they might now have Reggie Bush). Harrington wasn’t even in the picture for Casserly when he pulled the trigger five years ago and brought in Carr.

Once Harrington made it to Detroit, his professional growth was extremely limited by the inexperience of the front office, coaching staff and roster. Harrington had little help on the field and didn’t show much improvement through practice and offseason repetition. Harrington was a Jeff Tedford prodigy and was drilled to the hilt at Oregon. He didn’t receive the same meticulous attention to detail in Detroit, and his preparation habits suffered because he didn’t have a mentor to follow. By his third season, there were still only flashes of ability and no long-term stretches of brilliance to indicate he could be a long-term starter.

Harrington’s position coaches, including Greg Olson and West Coast offense tactician Ted Tollner, were unable to get a key message across to Harrington  anticipation is a must at this level. Whether it was adjusting to the speed of the game or the proliferation of cover-2 defenses that clouded reads for Harrington, he’s never been able to anticipate location or time up routes with his receivers. He was most successful on stationary short routes or deep throws off vertical routes and failed to grasp the essential elements to make timing patterns  the bread and butter of the West Coast offense  click with the Lions’ assortment of talented receivers. With Mike Martz in Detroit to integrate his timing offense, Harrington was never truly in the equation.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Commentary/Spins/2006/spins051506.htm

The fact that the Texans didn't consider him is to me irrelevant. Afterall the Texans aren't exactly the model franchise when it comes to drafting players.

Now as far as Joey and Detroit goes it sound to me like they picked him and then tried to fit a round peg into a square hole. Instead of building an offense around their future franchise QB they tried to make him fit into the WCO which only excentuated his weaknesses.
 
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