Philbin vs Sparano? | Page 2 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Philbin vs Sparano?

For me,the jury is still out on Philbin...but,I hope we are shooting for something more than just being better than Sparano!!!!
Being a little better than Sparano,to me is like being the tallest midget.....We deserve much more.
 
ConvenientTruth said:
Very interesting.....can't wait to see the finished results
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Don't hold your breath, its probably years away because even a 2 season sample is much too small. The theory is good coaches should win at a high percentage when their QB plays well, its kind of a coaching rating system. One interesting result I've found so far is Marvin Lewis wins at a higher percentage than I would have guessed, I think he may be an example of a good coach mired with bad QBs over the years.

I can't believe Garrett hasn't been fired, everything about him screams terrible coach from game management to his body language on the sideline then you couple that with his pathetic win percentage and its just mind boggling that he still has a job. I guess Jerry Jones likes having a yes man as his coach.
 
Southbeach 2 said:
So far, I don't see much of a difference between the two, which can change this year. However, I think I would have preferred Sparano to instill some fire in the team the last two games of last year. We had none.
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If Sparano had the ability to win those 2 games at the end of last year due to his firing people up, how do you explain him going 7-9 twice and 4-9 before being fired?
 
Southbeach 2 said:
Never knew that. Where did it come from?
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Out of his ass....Sparano had one yr with good QB play and the team went to the playoffs, if Sparano had RT at QB we would be a playoff team.....The D would be better (at least the LB and DL would be) and ST would be better.....Sparano was building a strong OL, good running game, and if he had a QB would have had a descent TE and good WR....his D coordinators were top 5 guys whose D stopped the run, tackled well and was physical......Sparano made some mistakes but he was undermined by his GM then by the owner....then lost the respect from his team.....Philbin took over the team, changed the players, changed the style and the only thing good that's come from it is RT....The Oline is worse, the running game is poor, still looking for a real TE ( though the rookie showed promise last yr, excited to see his development this yr)
On the D his DL is good with two possibly 3 pass rushers, can't stop the run, can't cover TE and the secondary is much improved, Sparano issue with the secondary was he wasn't afraid to play rookies back there...something Philbin refuses to do.....

If I was owner of a team and had to pick a HC and could only choose between these two, I would hire Sparano.....
 
roy_miami said:
Its a project I'm working on.

Sparano won 64% of games when his QB had a passer rating of 88+. Compare that with a few coaches I consider bad like: Norv Turner won at 72%, Jason Garrett wins at 59%, and Mike Shanahan with the redskins 63%. For good coaches Belichick is at 87% (over the past 5 season, much higher all time), Jim Harbaugh in the 90's, Sean Payton is 90% (but Brees only won 7 of 10 the year Payton was suspended). And Joe Philbin wins at 93% when his QBs have a PR of 88 or higher.
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This is a great example of why stats only tell some of the story......Sparano was playing with Henne who could not throw the ball down field and when he did he threw int...so they used the check down were he threw to backs coming out of the back field and slant routes to big WR.....that helped his QB rating but once he got in the redzone he was useless....the team couldn't score....they kicked FG.....once you lose confidence in your QB in the redzone (Henne had some rough games early throwing INT in the redzone) the coach got conservative down there......if you watch the games, the team played better under Sparano, if he had a QB the team he and Ireland assembled would be in the playoffs....now RT is very good in the redzone, when he gets down there the play calling is more aggressive which amounted to more TD....that's why I say put that guy behind Sparano OL and running game and give him Sparano Defense and ST and we are in the playoffs......
 
jvw said:
Out of his ass....Sparano had one yr with good QB play and the team went to the playoffs, if Sparano had RT at QB we would be a playoff team.....The D would be better (at least the LB and DL would be) and ST would be better.....Sparano was building a strong OL, good running game, and if he had a QB would have had a descent TE and good WR....his D coordinators were top 5 guys whose D stopped the run, tackled well and was physical......Sparano made some mistakes but he was undermined by his GM then by the owner....then lost the respect from his team.....Philbin took over the team, changed the players, changed the style and the only thing good that's come from it is RT....The Oline is worse, the running game is poor, still looking for a real TE ( though the rookie showed promise last yr, excited to see his development this yr)
On the D his DL is good with two possibly 3 pass rushers, can't stop the run, can't cover TE and the secondary is much improved, Sparano issue with the secondary was he wasn't afraid to play rookies back there...something Philbin refuses to do.....

If I was owner of a team and had to pick a HC and could only choose between these two, I would hire Sparano.....
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no offense but I hope to god you don't have enough money to buy the Fins, or any of the pro teams I root for...
 
jvw said:
This is a great example of why stats only tell some of the story......Sparano was playing with Henne who could not throw the ball down field and when he did he threw int...so they used the check down were he threw to backs coming out of the back field and slant routes to big WR.....that helped his QB rating but once he got in the redzone he was useless....the team couldn't score....they kicked FG.....once you lose confidence in your QB in the redzone (Henne had some rough games early throwing INT in the redzone) the coach got conservative down there......if you watch the games, the team played better under Sparano, if he had a QB the team he and Ireland assembled would be in the playoffs....now RT is very good in the redzone, when he gets down there the play calling is more aggressive which amounted to more TD....that's why I say put that guy behind Sparano OL and running game and give him Sparano Defense and ST and we are in the playoffs......
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But, that formula was a winner with the noodle at the helm

Sparano and his coaching staff ruined what chance Henne had, once they brought in Penny and put him under Penny limp wing.
While both are gone, one still matters on Sundays here and there, the other is pumping his fist as a positional know nothing at a irrelevant landing spot in the NFL. The Black Hole of NFL Sundays, where gang members and the trash of society mingle to cheer on their pathetic franchise.
 
jvw said:
This is a great example of why stats only tell some of the story......Sparano was playing with Henne who could not throw the ball down field and when he did he threw int...so they used the check down were he threw to backs coming out of the back field and slant routes to big WR.....that helped his QB rating but once he got in the redzone he was useless....the team couldn't score....they kicked FG.....once you lose confidence in your QB in the redzone (Henne had some rough games early throwing INT in the redzone) the coach got conservative down there......if you watch the games, the team played better under Sparano, if he had a QB the team he and Ireland assembled would be in the playoffs....now RT is very good in the redzone, when he gets down there the play calling is more aggressive which amounted to more TD....that's why I say put that guy behind Sparano OL and running game and give him Sparano Defense and ST and we are in the playoffs......
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To my eyes Sparano coached like a baboon and the stats back that perception up. I don't know where you guys are getting this Sparano would have been a God with Tannehill stuff from, like I said Philbin is 13-1 when he gets good QB play which is a 93% win percentage. Even when Sparano had Pennington he was still only 8-3 when Pennington played well which is 73%. The diference is Pennington gave Sparano 11 good games for the season and had a passer rating of 100+ on the season, it would take a bad coaching job to not make the playoffs when your QB plays to 100+ PR.
 
NBP81 said:
no offense but I hope to god you don't have enough money to buy the Fins, or any of the pro teams I root for...
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No offense taken, so I take it that you would take Philbin.....team under performed in the two most critical games of his HC career, had a national bullying scandal on his watch, allowed Richie to be voted in as a Team leader, made a great decision on picking RT in the draft then allowed Martin to be his starting LT knowing he had head issues which resulted in RT almost getting killed, traded or cut all of the real leaders on the team and then had the nerve to be upset when Dungy called him out for his lack of leadership......I liked Philbin his first yr, was ok with him during the second until all the behind the scenes crap came out and we got the chance to see his decision making skills......I hope he can turn it around in his 3rd yr.......
 
roy_miami said:
To my eyes Sparano coached like a baboon and the stats back that perception up. I don't know where you guys are getting this Sparano would have been a God with Tannehill stuff from, like I said Philbin is 13-1 when he gets good QB play which is a 93% win percentage. Even when Sparano had Pennington he was still only 8-3 when Pennington played well which is 73%. The diference is Pennington gave Sparano 11 good games for the season and had a passer rating of 100+ on the season, it would take a bad coaching job to not make the playoffs when your QB plays to 100+ PR.
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He was 8-3 with Pennington and a team that was 1-15 the previous yr, that team had holes and if it wasn't for the Wild Cat they would have been a 500 ball team....Pennington QB rating was great because he didn't turn the ball over not because he was putting up big numbers in the passing game....he threw about 220 yrd a game with his weak arm, that team was 28th in scoring with Pennington 100 QBR...they won that yr because of the running game and defense and Pennington didn't turn the ball over.....

I don't think Sparano is a god by no means (with or without RT), but he is better than Philbin and this stage of Philbin career.......
 
jvw said:
No offense taken, so I take it that you would take Philbin.....team under performed in the two most critical games of his HC career, had a national bullying scandal on his watch, allowed Richie to be voted in as a Team leader, made a great decision on picking RT in the draft then allowed Martin to be his starting LT knowing he had head issues which resulted in RT almost getting killed, traded or cut all of the real leaders on the team and then had the nerve to be upset when Dungy called him out for his lack of leadership......I liked Philbin his first yr, was ok with him during the second until all the behind the scenes crap came out and we got the chance to see his decision making skills......I hope he can turn it around in his 3rd yr.......
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I wonder why Ireland was fired, was it just because he screwed up one too many coffee orders? It seems silly to be paying a guy millions of dollars a year to be responsible for nothing but according to some that must have been the case.
 
DolfanDuBbZ~ said:
But, that formula was a winner with the noodle at the helm

Sparano and his coaching staff ruined what chance Henne had, once they brought in Penny and put him under Penny limp wing.
While both are gone, one still matters on Sundays here and there, the other is pumping his fist as a positional know nothing at a irrelevant landing spot in the NFL. The Black Hole of NFL Sundays, where gang members and the trash of society mingle to cheer on their pathetic franchise.
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I disagree, Sparano, his staff and the fans gave Henne every chance possible to get it done and he couldn't.....that's on Henne......

---------- Post added at 06:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:02 PM ----------
roy_miami said:
I wonder why Ireland was fired, was it just because he screwed up one too many coffee orders?
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How did Ireland get in the discussion?
 
Southbeach 2 said:
Her's a thread I put up on VIP, with reasonable replies I do not expect here. However, I'm willing to take the hits to give posters something to post about in these VERY BORING times. Take your best shots. lol

Sparano took a 1-15 team to 11-5, winning the division, and our first playoff in 7 years, tied fr the biggest turnaround in the NFL, with Penny having a great year. Then, it was two 7-9 seasons with Henne, before the Harbaugh mess, 4-9 before being fired.

He had an antique as an OC, and a VG DC, did not get along with Ireland, and had limited talent.

Philbin came in and went 7-9 and 8-8 with Tannehill, an antique at OC, and a good DC. He also did not get along with Ireland, and had his own mess with Bully Gate.

Has either one proven to be better than the other so far?
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In reality at this point Sparano had proven to be better based on his year one. You know though as fans many people only see things as rosy in the now.
People take all credit away from a player or a coach and put it elsewhere when they are gone.
I don't think either coach is really a good head coach
 
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