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Originally posted by Beantown Bronco
"See being a homer pointing out another persons homerism makes you a hypocrite homer."

What an idiot! I never said the Broncos should be #1. In fact, as much as it pains me, I have to put the Faiders at the top until they lose. You can only beat who you play and they've done that. It's just retarded to put a team with a loss above a team that's undefeated, except in some cases in college ball where there are teams like Rutgers, etc...
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Did I ever say that you think (or even I for that matter) the Broncos should be #1? Gee and here I was just reading a thread where you claim not to put words in other peoples mouths and not insult others.

Perhaps people should take some comprehension lessons. Such as reading the quote I am responding to in the first place.
 
Originally posted by Beantown Bronco
You can only beat who you play
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I'm just surprised to see that statement coming from someone, who in other threads, has used the teams that Miami has played as a barometer for rating the team.
Just sounds a little like a double standard to me... :rolleyes:
 
Wharfrat, I've never rated them as a team based on who they played. What I've done is rate the play of Ricky Williams vs. the other running backs that have faced the defenses he's faced. He has done just what other, average, running backs have done. He's produced against weak units.

Now look what Oakland has done. They may have beaten weak teams, but they did more. They beat these weak teams by more points than the other teams that have faced the same teams. In other words, they are doing more than the other guy while Ricky is doing more or less the same as the other guy IMO.
 
Not that I'm saying that the Raiders don't belong on top, but let's face the facts here. You say that the Raiders have beaten the weak teams by more? Well when Miami has played the weak teams, there's been more than a 20 point differential in the score each time (Lions and Jets), and we're also holding the teams we play to far fewer points than what the Raiders are allowing (except the Chiefs.)

Finally, I've read your Ricky Williams "logic" both here and on the Broncos sight and it makes no sense either place; it's simply flawed. Ricky Williams has been the catalyst behind this teams success this year, he's the second leading rusher in the NFL no matter who we've played, and if you would have taken the time to watch some of the games, you'd see that in about half his bigger runs (7 plus yards) he makes most things happen himself. The guy flat runs over, around, and through people.
 
I am facing the facts. Both Miami and Oakland have beat up on weak teams. Yippee. Time to go to the tie-breaker then: the difference, Miami has a loss. End of story.

Again, I never said Ricky wasn't a good runner. I just said that I think he's overrated by the media and many fans. All off-season and now early this season, all I keep hearing about is how Ricky is going to be the missing link and lead the Dolphins to the promised land. I just don't agree, especially this early in the season. Miami, like Oakland and Tampa Bay, almost always starts off a season well. It's not until the season wears on and the cold weather starts creeping in that they seem to level off....

By definition, a person can be either underrated, accurately rated, or overrated. I think we can all agree that he is clearly not underrated. That leaves accurately rated or overrated. To determine if Ricky is the real reason why Miami is 4-1, that he "has been the catalyst behind this teams success this year" and prove me wrong, you must be able to say that there are not at least 5 other running backs in the league capable of doing what Ricky is doing right now. Can you say that? That's all I'm saying....
 
Actually, you'd be incorrect in saying that there are 5 backs that could clearly do what Ricky's doing right now, there are four that I can think of who would be good enough to step into his role: Edgerrin James, Marshall Faulk, Priest Holes, and Ahman Green. Shaun Alexander, Curtis Martin, and Fred Taylor are all good backs but not quite Ricky this year.

Now to your point that in order to say that he's not overrated I would have to say that there aren't other backs out there with similar ability? What in the name of all that's stupid does that have to do with anything? It makes no difference if another player has similar ability, that other player (unless they're Priest Holmes) isn't putting up the kind of numbers Ricky is and hasn't come onto a team that's been without a running back for the better part of three decades.

Williams is the catalyst, and if you doubt that just look at the the fact that the only loss we've had all year came in a game where Ricky didn't get his 100 yards (should have but some questionable coaching decisions prevented that.) Quit being such a homer and face the facts that Ricky is the man this year, isn't overrated, and has been the sledge hammer this team's been looking for.
 
"Actually, you'd be incorrect in saying that there are 5 backs that could clearly do what Ricky's doing right now"

I don't know how you could say that with any degree of certainty. There are several running backs on crappy teams that don't have the numbers because their QB stink but, given the chance to play for Miami, could put up great numbers and not cost the team a 4-1 start. Shaun Alexander and Corey Dillon jump out at me...

Being a homer has nothing to do with this. Months ago I was saying that it was a good pickup for Miami, but (contrary to what some of the media were reporting) he wouldn't make the difference in them getting to the SB. This has nothing to do with this week's game. It's an opinion that was formed this off-season from an outsiders point of view.

For Ricky to be a catalyst, he needs to be the reason the team is doing something it didn't do before he was there. It may be having more success in the running game early, but it's not necessarily causing the team to win more. Last year, the Dolphins started off great, going 9-3. Until Ricky makes them 11-1 or 10-2, and leads them deep into the playoffs, he's not making them any better than they were before he got there...
 
Obviously Ricky's not going to do it all himself, but I feel, as do many people inside the national media, that this Miami team is very different in many ways from the teams of the past couple of years that have fallen apart towards the end of year. We have more weapons on both sides of the ball than we've had since the early 70's and this team isn't playing from behind like they always have in the past; they're winning games from the front.

I'm still somewhat tenuous when considering the recent past, but I do have good reason to believe that this team is different, and will not collapse this year. At any rate, it should be a good year.
 
What do you have to back up your idea of Ricky being overated?
Because he hasn't done what other backs have done to certain teams??? Maybe you should look at YPC and not total yards.. 3 out of the 5 games Ricky sat out most of the 4th quarter, and 1 of those games he was done a few minutes into the 3rd. Of course he is not racking up yards sitting on the bench.
 
Not only does Ricky give us a balanced attack but he also gives us the ability to drain the clock when we have a lead.. that is something we have not had as long as i have been watching football.
 
That last line was just stupid. You seriously think the Dolphins are no better with Ricky than they were w/out him? If so, continue moving at your own risk, because those blinders you are wearing are huge!

Of course you are going to say that RW won't be the catalyst to get the Dolphins to the Super Bowl.........if you said he would be, then you would have to believe that Denver is NOT going to the Super Bowl. What more could we expect from such a Denver homer?
 
First of all, I'm not a homer. I'm a realist.

I don't realistically think at this point that the Broncos will make the SB. I obviously really want them too, but I don't have any reason to think they will just yet. They are playing well for the most part, but they'll need to play better to go all the way.

And yes, so far record-wise, the fins are no better this year with Ricky than they were last season without him. They are a better running team, but the end result is the same so far.

Gottahavefootball, you say "What do you have to back up your idea of Ricky being overated? Maybe you should look at YPC and not total yards.. "

OK, I will - RW is averaging 4.8 yds/carry. There are 6 running backs in the NFL with better yds/carry.
 
Yeah, and only one of them has as many carries and that's Holmes. Be careful with your stats, they just might bite you in the arse.
 
Originally posted by Beantown Bronco
Gottahavefootball, you say "What do you have to back up your idea of Ricky being overated? Maybe you should look at YPC and not total yards.. "

OK, I will - RW is averaging 4.8 yds/carry. There are 6 running backs in the NFL with better yds/carry.
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I was talking about per game.. one of your reasons was cause other running backs had as many yards against certain teams as Ricky did... but those other RB's didn't come out of the game in the 3rd quarter.. the only reason his overall ypc is only 4.8 is cause the patriots dedicated their entire team to stopping him.. and he still had over 100 yards.. you guys better hope grease head can get you an early lead.. cause if not.. the predator will be out hunting for some fresh horsey meat..
 
Originally posted by Beantown Bronco
I am facing the facts. Both Miami and Oakland have beat up on weak teams. Yippee. Time to go to the tie-breaker then: the difference, Miami has a loss. End of story.
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Originally posted by Beantown Bronco
OK, I will - RW is averaging 4.8 yds/carry. There are 6 running backs in the NFL with better yds/carry.
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Originally posted by Beantown Bronco
First of all, I'm not a homer.
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A) Yes you are a homer

B) I already disproved your weak team theory in TWO threads now. Raiders opponents 5-13 no winning records. Miami opponents 11-12 with 3 winning records. Denver opponents 11-12 with 2 winning records.

C) Again I keep talking about your manipulation of stats. Only one RB with over 60 carries has a higher average then Ricky Williams and that is Priest Holmes (LD is tied with Williams). Comparing people that have 115+ carries to 55 (being the highest # of carries after Priest/Ricky/LD with avgs higher then them. That's less then HALF the carries). Not to mention Ricky has been PULLED early from 2 games (4 plays into the 3rd quarter against Detroit and early 4th against the jits so there goes your argument of running it up on weak teams to) where he could have easily kept piling up the yards.

Come on bean........keep spewing it out. Your starting to act more like Mr Bean.
 
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