Pre-season Group Position Battles: Edge | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Pre-season Group Position Battles: Edge

Feverdream

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I suspect these remarks will be controversial... so put on your special helmets and climb into my bus-- it starts and stops at random, and has been known to plunge from high places.

There is no greater need in a modern Defense than to kick a QB's ass. If you can put the fear of God into the other team's QB; you've won that game...

Last year, we had 2 massive injuries to our two best Edges. When Chubb went down, I turned to my wife and said, "the season is over." ...and it was.
Chubb's caddy was gone, then Chubb, and all that was left was AVG... who promptly disappeared entirely. (My brothers, Andrew was fun to watch, but he greatly benefited by playing with 2 better players).

"So," you say, "Why are you telling us this? We came to hear about this year's camp battles?"

Because Chop Robinson WAS the target. Mr Grier and Mr. McDaniel did not lie. If Chop had played one more year of college ball, he would have been a top 5 pick. Both of our Edges are coming back from career threatening injuries, (and we just stole Chop Robinson). If both players return to form, we've got one of the best rotations in the NFL. If not... well, it'll be fun to watch Chop's growth.

Let's go down the list

1) Bradley Chubb: 13 sacks, a league-leading 6 forced fumbles, and a PFF score of 88.8. ...and as a bonus, his new money is only 20m/year. If he returns to form, he's underpaid in this market.

2) Jaelen Phillips: 7 sacks and a 79.8 PFF score. His injury is a major worry however. When your Achilles blows up in a non-contact situation. It usually means two things. 1, it is a career threatening injury and 2, that your particular body is probably wound too tight.
Phillips is an amazing athlete, but now he has to be viewed as an even bigger injury risk than he was before... and sadly, if he works himself back into peak shape, he'll ask for 30m/year. Yes, Jaelen might be great some day, but he isn't now, and paying him on projection... Grier doesn't usually do that.
So... hope for the best, but don't get attached.

3) Shaquill Barrett: He'll be 32 this year and has slipped a bit since he was putting up double digit sack totals. Still, he's a solid player here on a one year contract. As a bridge player, we really couldn't have done better (6.75m). He'll start for a few weeks, then hopefully become a rotational pass rusher.

4) Chop: Chop just dominated some of the games he played in. No, he didnt put up huge sack numbers, but he disrupted play after play, usually while being doubled. He is a special talent at 21 years old. Again, we stole this guy, stole him.
If Chop has a hole in his game, it'll be setting the Edge on a running play. For now, he should be a rotational pass rusher, but due to the injuries, he'll probably start... and yes, I expect other teams to run right at him for awhile.

5) Mo Kamara: The polar opposite of Chop statistically. He's not a plus athlete, but he did put up a lot of sacks in college. Sadly, he's a little small, overaged, and played much weaker competition than Chop did... and that's why he slid in the draft. Don't get caught up in his college sack totals, he is three and a half years older than Robinson, and if Chubb and Phillips surprise and are actually ready for the season, Mo may not make the team.

Last year, we cut to three Edges on cut-down day, releasing Goode and describing Ogbah as a lineman... so, this year we'll carry... maybe 4?

Goode is also rehabbing an injury, and in reality, Goode is not. He's a better bet for the PUP list than he is for the 53.

Zeke Vandenburgh is still around and I hear you saying, "who?". Well, he was an UDFA last year and when he was injured, we didn't release him with an injury settlement like we normally do when an undrafted guy is injured. He must have impressed someone... I don't know who or when, but the team kept him via Injured Reserve. I think he's a playable longshot based upon that.

Quinton Bell is 28 and has only a couple of games played in his career. He'll be cut early.

Grayson Murphy is a 5 year college player who lacks the size, athleticism, and arm length of a NFL player. He was pretty good in college, but he's probably maxed out now. He's fighting for a PS gig.

So it comes down to this; are either of our top two anywhere near ready to play? I have no idea, dear brothers... and no one else does either... so my pessimistic prognosis for week 1 is this. Both players on the PUP list and we won't see them til week #5.

We only keep Barrett, Robinson, and Kamara on day one and then we make further moves from the PS as the year goes forward. Because of this, we may carry an extra ILB or DT... perhaps Tindall as a designated pass rusher job... maybe we hit the waiver wire? Either way, if Phillips and Chubb are not ready, we don't have enough here.

So... fire away. I know that a few brothers are going to hate this one.
 
I suspect these remarks will be controversial... so put on your special helmets and climb into my bus-- it starts and stops at random, and has been known to plunge from high places.

There is no greater need in a modern Defense than to kick a QB's ass. If you can put the fear of God into the other team's QB; you've won that game...

Last year, we had 2 massive injuries to our two best Edges. When Chubb went down, I turned to my wife and said, "the season is over." ...and it was.
Chubb's caddy was gone, then Chubb, and all that was left was AVG... who promptly disappeared entirely. (My brothers, Andrew was fun to watch, but he greatly benefited by playing with 2 better players).

"So," you say, "Why are you telling us this? We came to hear about this year's camp battles?"

Because Chop Robinson WAS the target. Mr Grier and Mr. McDaniel did not lie. If Chop had played one more year of college ball, he would have been a top 5 pick. Both of our Edges are coming back from career threatening injuries, (and we just stole Chop Robinson). If both players return to form, we've got one of the best rotations in the NFL. If not... well, it'll be fun to watch Chop's growth.

Let's go down the list

1) Bradley Chubb: 13 sacks, a league-leading 6 forced fumbles, and a PFF score of 88.8. ...and as a bonus, his new money is only 20m/year. If he returns to form, he's underpaid in this market.

2) Jaelen Phillips: 7 sacks and a 79.8 PFF score. His injury is a major worry however. When your Achilles blows up in a non-contact situation. It usually means two things. 1, it is a career threatening injury and 2, that your particular body is probably wound too tight.
Phillips is an amazing athlete, but now he has to be viewed as an even bigger injury risk than he was before... and sadly, if he works himself back into peak shape, he'll ask for 30m/year. Yes, Jaelen might be great some day, but he isn't now, and paying him on projection... Grier doesn't usually do that.
So... hope for the best, but don't get attached.

3) Shaquill Barrett: He'll be 32 this year and has slipped a bit since he was putting up double digit sack totals. Still, he's a solid player here on a one year contract. As a bridge player, we really couldn't have done better (6.75m). He'll start for a few weeks, then hopefully become a rotational pass rusher.

4) Chop: Chop just dominated some of the games he played in. No, he didnt put up huge sack numbers, but he disrupted play after play, usually while being doubled. He is a special talent at 21 years old. Again, we stole this guy, stole him.
If Chop has a hole in his game, it'll be setting the Edge on a running play. For now, he should be a rotational pass rusher, but due to the injuries, he'll probably start... and yes, I expect other teams to run right at him for awhile.

5) Mo Kamara: The polar opposite of Chop statistically. He's not a plus athlete, but he did put up a lot of sacks in college. Sadly, he's a little small, overaged, and played much weaker competition than Chop did... and that's why he slid in the draft. Don't get caught up in his college sack totals, he is three and a half years older than Robinson, and if Chubb and Phillips surprise and are actually ready for the season, Mo may not make the team.

Last year, we cut to three Edges on cut-down day, releasing Goode and describing Ogbah as a lineman... so, this year we'll carry... maybe 4?

Goode is also rehabbing an injury, and in reality, Goode is not. He's a better bet for the PUP list than he is for the 53.

Zeke Vandenburgh is still around and I hear you saying, "who?". Well, he was an UDFA last year and when he was injured, we didn't release him with an injury settlement like we normally do when an undrafted guy is injured. He must have impressed someone... I don't know who or when, but the team kept him via Injured Reserve. I think he's a playable longshot based upon that.

Quinton Bell is 28 and has only a couple of games played in his career. He'll be cut early.

Grayson Murphy is a 5 year college player who lacks the size, athleticism, and arm length of a NFL player. He was pretty good in college, but he's probably maxed out now. He's fighting for a PS gig.

So it comes down to this; are either of our top two anywhere near ready to play? I have no idea, dear brothers... and no one else does either... so my pessimistic prognosis for week 1 is this. Both players on the PUP list and we won't see them til week #5.

We only keep Barrett, Robinson, and Kamara on day one and then we make further moves from the PS as the year goes forward. Because of this, we may carry an extra ILB or DT... perhaps Tindall as a designated pass rusher job... maybe we hit the waiver wire? Either way, if Phillips and Chubb are not ready, we don't have enough here.

So... fire away. I know that a few brothers are going to hate this one.

You left out Calais Campbell who i think starts along with Phillips to open the season

He's terrific setting the edge and still will get you 7 or 8 sacks plus he has history with our DC Weaver

If Phillips isn't ready the guy from Tampa Bay Barrett gets the nod

Both rookies stick and we are loaded when Chubb comes back
 
You left out Calais Campbell who i think starts along with Phillips to open the season

He's terrific setting the edge and still will get you 7 or 8 sacks

If Phillips isn't ready the guy from Tampa Bay gets the nod

Both rookie sticks and we are loaded when Chubb comes back
I listed Campbell as a Tackle in the first piece. There is some carry over between large DE types, and leaner OLB types... last year we had Ogbah in that role.
I put them in the Tackle box because they play 90% of their time with their hand in the dirt, and a lot of them kick inside when the true DTs leave the game on 3rd and 10.
 
I listed Campbell as a Tackle in the first piece. There is some carry over between large DE types, and leaner OLB types... last year we had Ogbah in that role.
I put them in the Tackle box because they play 90% of their time with their hand in the dirt, and a lot of them kick inside when the true DTs leave the game on 3rd and 10.

I missed the first piece but will check it out

Listening to CC being interviewed he said he'll play several spots but is still one of the top edge setters and run defenders.

 
Agree with all of this, especially Chop. I am higher on Kamara than you. I don’t think he’ll be a star or anything, but I think he’s a lock for the roster and will be a useful rotational piece for a long time. He’s got a lot of Joey Porter in him.

I expect Jaelen Phillips to be on the active roster to start the season. Chubb I think starts on PUP.
 
I suspect these remarks will be controversial... so put on your special helmets and climb into my bus-- it starts and stops at random, and has been known to plunge from high places.

There is no greater need in a modern Defense than to kick a QB's ass. If you can put the fear of God into the other team's QB; you've won that game...

Last year, we had 2 massive injuries to our two best Edges. When Chubb went down, I turned to my wife and said, "the season is over." ...and it was.
Chubb's caddy was gone, then Chubb, and all that was left was AVG... who promptly disappeared entirely. (My brothers, Andrew was fun to watch, but he greatly benefited by playing with 2 better players).

"So," you say, "Why are you telling us this? We came to hear about this year's camp battles?"

Because Chop Robinson WAS the target. Mr Grier and Mr. McDaniel did not lie. If Chop had played one more year of college ball, he would have been a top 5 pick. Both of our Edges are coming back from career threatening injuries, (and we just stole Chop Robinson). If both players return to form, we've got one of the best rotations in the NFL. If not... well, it'll be fun to watch Chop's growth.

Let's go down the list

1) Bradley Chubb: 13 sacks, a league-leading 6 forced fumbles, and a PFF score of 88.8. ...and as a bonus, his new money is only 20m/year. If he returns to form, he's underpaid in this market.

2) Jaelen Phillips: 7 sacks and a 79.8 PFF score. His injury is a major worry however. When your Achilles blows up in a non-contact situation. It usually means two things. 1, it is a career threatening injury and 2, that your particular body is probably wound too tight.
Phillips is an amazing athlete, but now he has to be viewed as an even bigger injury risk than he was before... and sadly, if he works himself back into peak shape, he'll ask for 30m/year. Yes, Jaelen might be great some day, but he isn't now, and paying him on projection... Grier doesn't usually do that.
So... hope for the best, but don't get attached.

3) Shaquill Barrett: He'll be 32 this year and has slipped a bit since he was putting up double digit sack totals. Still, he's a solid player here on a one year contract. As a bridge player, we really couldn't have done better (6.75m). He'll start for a few weeks, then hopefully become a rotational pass rusher.

4) Chop: Chop just dominated some of the games he played in. No, he didnt put up huge sack numbers, but he disrupted play after play, usually while being doubled. He is a special talent at 21 years old. Again, we stole this guy, stole him.
If Chop has a hole in his game, it'll be setting the Edge on a running play. For now, he should be a rotational pass rusher, but due to the injuries, he'll probably start... and yes, I expect other teams to run right at him for awhile.

5) Mo Kamara: The polar opposite of Chop statistically. He's not a plus athlete, but he did put up a lot of sacks in college. Sadly, he's a little small, overaged, and played much weaker competition than Chop did... and that's why he slid in the draft. Don't get caught up in his college sack totals, he is three and a half years older than Robinson, and if Chubb and Phillips surprise and are actually ready for the season, Mo may not make the team.

Last year, we cut to three Edges on cut-down day, releasing Goode and describing Ogbah as a lineman... so, this year we'll carry... maybe 4?

Goode is also rehabbing an injury, and in reality, Goode is not. He's a better bet for the PUP list than he is for the 53.

Zeke Vandenburgh is still around and I hear you saying, "who?". Well, he was an UDFA last year and when he was injured, we didn't release him with an injury settlement like we normally do when an undrafted guy is injured. He must have impressed someone... I don't know who or when, but the team kept him via Injured Reserve. I think he's a playable longshot based upon that.

Quinton Bell is 28 and has only a couple of games played in his career. He'll be cut early.

Grayson Murphy is a 5 year college player who lacks the size, athleticism, and arm length of a NFL player. He was pretty good in college, but he's probably maxed out now. He's fighting for a PS gig.

So it comes down to this; are either of our top two anywhere near ready to play? I have no idea, dear brothers... and no one else does either... so my pessimistic prognosis for week 1 is this. Both players on the PUP list and we won't see them til week #5.

We only keep Barrett, Robinson, and Kamara on day one and then we make further moves from the PS as the year goes forward. Because of this, we may carry an extra ILB or DT... perhaps Tindall as a designated pass rusher job... maybe we hit the waiver wire? Either way, if Phillips and Chubb are not ready, we don't have enough here.

So... fire away. I know that a few brothers are going to hate this one.

The biggest questions your post poses to me are simple:

1) Do we have the depth to cover the loss of two key players?
If not, we will need to start poaching players and revisiting free agency.

2) If we will be revisiting free agency, do we have the money (cap space) we will need?

3) Does this mean we may not renegotiate Tua's contract?

I'm starting to feel a little "unsettled". - LOL
 
You left out Calais Campbell who i think starts along with Phillips to open the season

He's terrific setting the edge and still will get you 7 or 8 sacks plus he has history with our DC Weaver

If Phillips isn't ready the guy from Tampa Bay Barrett gets the nod

Both rookies stick and we are loaded when Chubb comes back
OK, now I feel a little better.
 
I suspect these remarks will be controversial... so put on your special helmets and climb into my bus-- it starts and stops at random, and has been known to plunge from high places.

There is no greater need in a modern Defense than to kick a QB's ass. If you can put the fear of God into the other team's QB; you've won that game...

Last year, we had 2 massive injuries to our two best Edges. When Chubb went down, I turned to my wife and said, "the season is over." ...and it was.
Chubb's caddy was gone, then Chubb, and all that was left was AVG... who promptly disappeared entirely. (My brothers, Andrew was fun to watch, but he greatly benefited by playing with 2 better players).

"So," you say, "Why are you telling us this? We came to hear about this year's camp battles?"

Because Chop Robinson WAS the target. Mr Grier and Mr. McDaniel did not lie. If Chop had played one more year of college ball, he would have been a top 5 pick. Both of our Edges are coming back from career threatening injuries, (and we just stole Chop Robinson). If both players return to form, we've got one of the best rotations in the NFL. If not... well, it'll be fun to watch Chop's growth.

Let's go down the list

1) Bradley Chubb: 13 sacks, a league-leading 6 forced fumbles, and a PFF score of 88.8. ...and as a bonus, his new money is only 20m/year. If he returns to form, he's underpaid in this market.

2) Jaelen Phillips: 7 sacks and a 79.8 PFF score. His injury is a major worry however. When your Achilles blows up in a non-contact situation. It usually means two things. 1, it is a career threatening injury and 2, that your particular body is probably wound too tight.
Phillips is an amazing athlete, but now he has to be viewed as an even bigger injury risk than he was before... and sadly, if he works himself back into peak shape, he'll ask for 30m/year. Yes, Jaelen might be great some day, but he isn't now, and paying him on projection... Grier doesn't usually do that.
So... hope for the best, but don't get attached.

3) Shaquill Barrett: He'll be 32 this year and has slipped a bit since he was putting up double digit sack totals. Still, he's a solid player here on a one year contract. As a bridge player, we really couldn't have done better (6.75m). He'll start for a few weeks, then hopefully become a rotational pass rusher.

4) Chop: Chop just dominated some of the games he played in. No, he didnt put up huge sack numbers, but he disrupted play after play, usually while being doubled. He is a special talent at 21 years old. Again, we stole this guy, stole him.
If Chop has a hole in his game, it'll be setting the Edge on a running play. For now, he should be a rotational pass rusher, but due to the injuries, he'll probably start... and yes, I expect other teams to run right at him for awhile.

5) Mo Kamara: The polar opposite of Chop statistically. He's not a plus athlete, but he did put up a lot of sacks in college. Sadly, he's a little small, overaged, and played much weaker competition than Chop did... and that's why he slid in the draft. Don't get caught up in his college sack totals, he is three and a half years older than Robinson, and if Chubb and Phillips surprise and are actually ready for the season, Mo may not make the team.

Last year, we cut to three Edges on cut-down day, releasing Goode and describing Ogbah as a lineman... so, this year we'll carry... maybe 4?

Goode is also rehabbing an injury, and in reality, Goode is not. He's a better bet for the PUP list than he is for the 53.

Zeke Vandenburgh is still around and I hear you saying, "who?". Well, he was an UDFA last year and when he was injured, we didn't release him with an injury settlement like we normally do when an undrafted guy is injured. He must have impressed someone... I don't know who or when, but the team kept him via Injured Reserve. I think he's a playable longshot based upon that.

Quinton Bell is 28 and has only a couple of games played in his career. He'll be cut early.

Grayson Murphy is a 5 year college player who lacks the size, athleticism, and arm length of a NFL player. He was pretty good in college, but he's probably maxed out now. He's fighting for a PS gig.

So it comes down to this; are either of our top two anywhere near ready to play? I have no idea, dear brothers... and no one else does either... so my pessimistic prognosis for week 1 is this. Both players on the PUP list and we won't see them til week #5.

We only keep Barrett, Robinson, and Kamara on day one and then we make further moves from the PS as the year goes forward. Because of this, we may carry an extra ILB or DT... perhaps Tindall as a designated pass rusher job... maybe we hit the waiver wire? Either way, if Phillips and Chubb are not ready, we don't have enough here.

So... fire away. I know that a few brothers are going to hate this one.
I desperately hope you and I are wrong, but I agree with you regarding J. Phillips. I fear he just cant take the pounding (que circumstances) in the NFL. And Achilles are not easy to recover from and have the same drive/explosion. Amazing athlete, great attitude, coachable, etc. But has had injury issues throughout his football career, on/off the field.
 
This is the one position group that's either going to be really, really good or potentially not so good.

The variance will depend on those injuries to Phillips and Chubb. If both can fully heal and, with the addition of Robinson, Miami should be among the better teams at pressuring quarterbacks. That's, of course, the hope.

Great post, Feverdream. You have done an outstanding job on all of these.
 
I suspect these remarks will be controversial... so put on your special helmets and climb into my bus-- it starts and stops at random, and has been known to plunge from high places.

There is no greater need in a modern Defense than to kick a QB's ass. If you can put the fear of God into the other team's QB; you've won that game...

Last year, we had 2 massive injuries to our two best Edges. When Chubb went down, I turned to my wife and said, "the season is over." ...and it was.
Chubb's caddy was gone, then Chubb, and all that was left was AVG... who promptly disappeared entirely. (My brothers, Andrew was fun to watch, but he greatly benefited by playing with 2 better players).

"So," you say, "Why are you telling us this? We came to hear about this year's camp battles?"

Because Chop Robinson WAS the target. Mr Grier and Mr. McDaniel did not lie. If Chop had played one more year of college ball, he would have been a top 5 pick. Both of our Edges are coming back from career threatening injuries, (and we just stole Chop Robinson). If both players return to form, we've got one of the best rotations in the NFL. If not... well, it'll be fun to watch Chop's growth.

Let's go down the list

1) Bradley Chubb: 13 sacks, a league-leading 6 forced fumbles, and a PFF score of 88.8. ...and as a bonus, his new money is only 20m/year. If he returns to form, he's underpaid in this market.

2) Jaelen Phillips: 7 sacks and a 79.8 PFF score. His injury is a major worry however. When your Achilles blows up in a non-contact situation. It usually means two things. 1, it is a career threatening injury and 2, that your particular body is probably wound too tight.
Phillips is an amazing athlete, but now he has to be viewed as an even bigger injury risk than he was before... and sadly, if he works himself back into peak shape, he'll ask for 30m/year. Yes, Jaelen might be great some day, but he isn't now, and paying him on projection... Grier doesn't usually do that.
So... hope for the best, but don't get attached.

3) Shaquill Barrett: He'll be 32 this year and has slipped a bit since he was putting up double digit sack totals. Still, he's a solid player here on a one year contract. As a bridge player, we really couldn't have done better (6.75m). He'll start for a few weeks, then hopefully become a rotational pass rusher.

4) Chop: Chop just dominated some of the games he played in. No, he didnt put up huge sack numbers, but he disrupted play after play, usually while being doubled. He is a special talent at 21 years old. Again, we stole this guy, stole him.
If Chop has a hole in his game, it'll be setting the Edge on a running play. For now, he should be a rotational pass rusher, but due to the injuries, he'll probably start... and yes, I expect other teams to run right at him for awhile.

5) Mo Kamara: The polar opposite of Chop statistically. He's not a plus athlete, but he did put up a lot of sacks in college. Sadly, he's a little small, overaged, and played much weaker competition than Chop did... and that's why he slid in the draft. Don't get caught up in his college sack totals, he is three and a half years older than Robinson, and if Chubb and Phillips surprise and are actually ready for the season, Mo may not make the team.

Last year, we cut to three Edges on cut-down day, releasing Goode and describing Ogbah as a lineman... so, this year we'll carry... maybe 4?

Goode is also rehabbing an injury, and in reality, Goode is not. He's a better bet for the PUP list than he is for the 53.

Zeke Vandenburgh is still around and I hear you saying, "who?". Well, he was an UDFA last year and when he was injured, we didn't release him with an injury settlement like we normally do when an undrafted guy is injured. He must have impressed someone... I don't know who or when, but the team kept him via Injured Reserve. I think he's a playable longshot based upon that.

Quinton Bell is 28 and has only a couple of games played in his career. He'll be cut early.

Grayson Murphy is a 5 year college player who lacks the size, athleticism, and arm length of a NFL player. He was pretty good in college, but he's probably maxed out now. He's fighting for a PS gig.

So it comes down to this; are either of our top two anywhere near ready to play? I have no idea, dear brothers... and no one else does either... so my pessimistic prognosis for week 1 is this. Both players on the PUP list and we won't see them til week #5.

We only keep Barrett, Robinson, and Kamara on day one and then we make further moves from the PS as the year goes forward. Because of this, we may carry an extra ILB or DT... perhaps Tindall as a designated pass rusher job... maybe we hit the waiver wire? Either way, if Phillips and Chubb are not ready, we don't have enough here.

So... fire away. I know that a few brothers are going to hate this one.
No arguments here... :UP:
 
I think the the OP meat to say Phillips in the third paragraph as the first edge that went down, but I also think (Ray) that the whole reason we drafted 2 edges and signed Shaq Barrett was to not only cover the position if our starters were not ready for the regular season but to add depth in a rotational sense. I don't think we have the $$$ to go FA and besides most of the good ones have a contract somewhere. Nice piece OP...
 
I suspect these remarks will be controversial... so put on your special helmets and climb into my bus-- it starts and stops at random, and has been known to plunge from high places.

There is no greater need in a modern Defense than to kick a QB's ass. If you can put the fear of God into the other team's QB; you've won that game...

Last year, we had 2 massive injuries to our two best Edges. When Chubb went down, I turned to my wife and said, "the season is over." ...and it was.
Chubb's caddy was gone, then Chubb, and all that was left was AVG... who promptly disappeared entirely. (My brothers, Andrew was fun to watch, but he greatly benefited by playing with 2 better players).

"So," you say, "Why are you telling us this? We came to hear about this year's camp battles?"

Because Chop Robinson WAS the target. Mr Grier and Mr. McDaniel did not lie. If Chop had played one more year of college ball, he would have been a top 5 pick. Both of our Edges are coming back from career threatening injuries, (and we just stole Chop Robinson). If both players return to form, we've got one of the best rotations in the NFL. If not... well, it'll be fun to watch Chop's growth.

Let's go down the list

1) Bradley Chubb: 13 sacks, a league-leading 6 forced fumbles, and a PFF score of 88.8. ...and as a bonus, his new money is only 20m/year. If he returns to form, he's underpaid in this market.

2) Jaelen Phillips: 7 sacks and a 79.8 PFF score. His injury is a major worry however. When your Achilles blows up in a non-contact situation. It usually means two things. 1, it is a career threatening injury and 2, that your particular body is probably wound too tight.
Phillips is an amazing athlete, but now he has to be viewed as an even bigger injury risk than he was before... and sadly, if he works himself back into peak shape, he'll ask for 30m/year. Yes, Jaelen might be great some day, but he isn't now, and paying him on projection... Grier doesn't usually do that.
So... hope for the best, but don't get attached.

3) Shaquill Barrett: He'll be 32 this year and has slipped a bit since he was putting up double digit sack totals. Still, he's a solid player here on a one year contract. As a bridge player, we really couldn't have done better (6.75m). He'll start for a few weeks, then hopefully become a rotational pass rusher.

4) Chop: Chop just dominated some of the games he played in. No, he didnt put up huge sack numbers, but he disrupted play after play, usually while being doubled. He is a special talent at 21 years old. Again, we stole this guy, stole him.
If Chop has a hole in his game, it'll be setting the Edge on a running play. For now, he should be a rotational pass rusher, but due to the injuries, he'll probably start... and yes, I expect other teams to run right at him for awhile.

5) Mo Kamara: The polar opposite of Chop statistically. He's not a plus athlete, but he did put up a lot of sacks in college. Sadly, he's a little small, overaged, and played much weaker competition than Chop did... and that's why he slid in the draft. Don't get caught up in his college sack totals, he is three and a half years older than Robinson, and if Chubb and Phillips surprise and are actually ready for the season, Mo may not make the team.

Last year, we cut to three Edges on cut-down day, releasing Goode and describing Ogbah as a lineman... so, this year we'll carry... maybe 4?

Goode is also rehabbing an injury, and in reality, Goode is not. He's a better bet for the PUP list than he is for the 53.

Zeke Vandenburgh is still around and I hear you saying, "who?". Well, he was an UDFA last year and when he was injured, we didn't release him with an injury settlement like we normally do when an undrafted guy is injured. He must have impressed someone... I don't know who or when, but the team kept him via Injured Reserve. I think he's a playable longshot based upon that.

Quinton Bell is 28 and has only a couple of games played in his career. He'll be cut early.

Grayson Murphy is a 5 year college player who lacks the size, athleticism, and arm length of a NFL player. He was pretty good in college, but he's probably maxed out now. He's fighting for a PS gig.

So it comes down to this; are either of our top two anywhere near ready to play? I have no idea, dear brothers... and no one else does either... so my pessimistic prognosis for week 1 is this. Both players on the PUP list and we won't see them til week #5.

We only keep Barrett, Robinson, and Kamara on day one and then we make further moves from the PS as the year goes forward. Because of this, we may carry an extra ILB or DT... perhaps Tindall as a designated pass rusher job... maybe we hit the waiver wire? Either way, if Phillips and Chubb are not ready, we don't have enough here.

So... fire away. I know that a few brothers are going to hate this one.
I read your novel and only have to say one thing.

I concur.

(PS, still waiting for the punter topic)
 
Chubb had 11 sacks, not 13. PFF has that number wrong. And as we all know, 3 of them came in one game against the worst LT/QB in the NFL as well as another one coming against the Cowboys in which he was completely unblocked and got a sack and FF on Prescott. While it was a big play at that juncture in the game, I don't view is a "talent" play made by Chubb as much as it was just a mistake by Dallas. He had another against the Eagles in which Jaelen Phillips funneled Jalen Hurts right to Chubb by beating Lane Johnson badly. He had another sack against KC on a stunt where the OG fell down and Mahomes just refused to get rid of the ball. He's nowhere near elite as a pass rusher so repeating his stats over and over again falls on these deaf ears.

His biggest moment of the 2023 season was arguably the most selfish play I've ever seen from a Miami Dolphins player, against the Titans. His almost sack and subsequent 15 yard penalty should not be forgotten just because he had a big day against Mekhi Becton in a 30-0 game we would've won even Chubb hadn't played. And the only reason he was anywhere near Levis on that play is because it was a TE screen and the TE released immediately after engaging Chubb and Levis missed dumping the ball off right away.

What he does have is a strong motor that leads to a lot of effort plays. He doesn't give up on a play so I've always given him that but to suggest he was an elite player is doing a disservice to actual elite pass rushers. Jaelen Phillips has/had a lot more ability than Chubb.

I am absolutely thrilled Chop Robinson was selected because that natural talent was really lacking on the edge. Guys who can beat OT's are rare and before his injury, Phillips was the only guy we had that had that kind of talent. Now I am really concerned about JP's future.

Stats don't tell you the whole story with Chubb or Chop.
 
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I think the the OP meat to say Phillips in the third paragraph as the first edge that went down, but I also think (Ray) that the whole reason we drafted 2 edges and signed Shaq Barrett was to not only cover the position if our starters were not ready for the regular season but to add depth in a rotational sense. I don't think we have the $$$ to go FA and besides most of the good ones have a contract somewhere. Nice piece OP...

I totally agree and would add that we probably have the money to go FA, assuming we don't go crazy with Tua's contract, or even offer him one.

We will be in better shape to offer him more money next year and he is likely to be in a better position to command more money here or elsewhere next year.

I am in no way suggesting that we get rid of Tua, I want him here as our QB.

On the other hand, I won't blind myself to the realities that come with Cap limitations and the amazing performance the FO has demonstrated so far this year (I don't think they are done), both in the draft and Free Agency, considering our initial Cap situation.

There is only so much money available for salaries and this year they used most of it on other players to add depth and improve the team on both sides of the ball.

If I were Tua and was not fully satisfied with what the Dolphins are offering this year, I wouldn't accept their offer.

I'd wait until next year. He would be betting both on the team and his own playing ability that they will have a very good year this year and he would be in a position to possibly double the amount over what he is being offered this year.

I also believe he would be able to enter FA and possibly make even more money, but a change in teams and coaching can always be problematic. I believe he would stay here, and I believe we would have to pay his price.

I am a believer. - LOL
 
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