Reality Check JETS fans....

[The New Guy]

Well, I do agree with you there, but I'll also say this ... More times than not, by the time all the games have been played, the teams with the most talent will win the most games, and the teams without much talent fade away ... despite what thier records might be after 5 or 6 games.

After only 5 games were played, plenty of people were already writing off the Jets (2-3), Cowboys (2-3) and Eagles (1-4) based on some early season losses. They can't do this ... they cant stop that, so-and-so sucks, etc ... I thought that was ridiculous, and I'll bet they all finish with winning records and are in the playoffs.

On the flip side I'll bet that the Bills (4-1 after 5) Bengals (4-2 after 6) and Raiders (4-2 after 6) all finish no better than 7-9 or 8-8 and dont even come close to the playoffs.

I'm basing that on talent. Let's see if it doesn't turn out that way.

I pretty much agree with that. However, I don't think it is ridiculous to question teams based on how they are currently playing rather than give them a playoff spot based on the talent that they have on the team. The Jets will probably make the playoffs, but with the way they have been playing, I don't think it is ridiculous to say that they might not. You automatically assume that since the Jets have talent and have been to the playoffs the last couple of years that they will right the ship. It doesn't always work out that way.

I think you are probably right about the AFC teams, but I don't base that on talent alone. I base it on who they have played on how they played them. I don't know what to make of Buff yet. If you were to guess Buff record before the season, you would probably have them winning 4 to 6 games based on the known talent they had. Buff could easily be a 10-6 team this year. I think losing Campbell was a big loss for the Raiders. You think the Raiders are a 7-9 to 8-8 team based on talent, but with the way they were playing before Campbell got injured, I could see 9 to 10 wins. KC was not as talented as SD last year, but it was KC who won the division because SD didn't play well. It is not uncommon for less talented teams to finish with better records becasue they played better in the regular season. That is why I don't base my opinion on talent alone.

I really doubt that both the Cowboys and Eagles make the playoffs unless they play significantly better. Both very talented teams, but they are not playing well. Talent alone won't get you in the playoffs. You need to play good football, and that is something the Jets have not been doing. That is all I have been saying all along.

 

[The New Guy]

Both passes were off target. /discussion.

Both off target, but very different when judging how bad the pass really was.

I agree. Even though they sucked, Ravens 'should' get the first WC.

If they keep playing like they did on Monday night, I will disagree.

Agreed...That is why I used 'should'. Out of Giants, Pats, Was, Philly and Mia, the only team I see defeating the Jets are the Patriots. Giants have struggled mightily against bad teams. Washington doesn't even know who their QB will be. They had a good start to the season, that should be finished by the time they play Jets. Philly has its good days and bad days. I still think they are the 2nd best in the NFC based on talent alone, but they need to show that in the games. If they can control their turnovers, they will win a lot of games. Miami? Why mention the matchup though? I know thats a game that the Jets should win and that it doesn't mean they WILL win, but still. Kinda like the Cleveland Patriots game last year. How many times would Cleveland have to play Patriots again to pull of such a whooping again?

I could have given you a bunch of reasons why the Jets should have beaten the Raiders, but they didn't because they didn't play very good. If the Jets don't play better, all of those teams will have a decent shot at winning.

Simply looking at the scorecard is very deceiving. Jets had the lead against Oakland in the 4th I believe until they scored, and Cromartie muffed the kickoff and Oakland scored again. Lucky bounce anyone? Pats had a 6 point lead with 6 mins left and at their 20. Game on as far as Im concerned. The Baltimore game was ugly for both offenses. Baltimore just made couple more impact plays on D than Jets did.

I didn't just look at the score board. I saw all of those games, and saw how poorly the Jets played in them. It was 24-17 at the start of the 4th when Cro muffed the punt. Lucky bounce? After Cro muffed it, he picked it back up and the defender knocked it out of his hands. The ball didn't bounce of his chest 10 yards and land in the hands of the defender.

It is good that the Jets can cut double digit leads in the 4th to single digits, but if you can't get another stop and another score, it doesn't mean anything.

Because most of his catches resulted in the play being dead, aka TD. Again, the outside fake on the third TD was great. Very hard to defend that once you've sold it. He did it twice. Give him the credit he deserves. Only at finheaven does a WR with three TDs not get the credit. Antoine Cason was the CB and he's not a no-name CB. Chargers let Cromartie go because Cason had out performed him

.

I don't care if it was the best corner in the league. His coverage in the redzone was terrible. I saw it myself. Plax had 1 reception for 16 yards against the Dolphins the week before. I don't think Plax all of the sudden became this 3 td a game receiver because he ran great routes.

MNF was great. Hope you still stay true to your words of basing it off of how you see them play.

If Bal keeps playing like that, I will absolutely change my opinion about how good I think they are.

Most defensive plays occur because they are at the right place at the right time. Ive actually never heard of a defensive play occuring because a player was at the wrong place at the wrong time. If he made the play, he was at the right place....end of story.

Revis was not covering VJ on that play. He had nothing to do with the coverage on VJ. The pass was to VJ. The pass hit VJ in the arms and bounced off of him right to Revis. Totally different than Butler covering the guy, and then ripping the ball out of the guys hands.

Too bad Rivers threw a pick on the next drive too. Oh, as for the Jets not doing too good, here are their drives in 2nd half

1st drive: 31 yards, 2 FD, punt
2nd drive: 55 yards, 4 FD, TD
3rd drive: 15 penalty yards, 3 and out
4th drive: 19 yards, TD
5th drive: 35 yards, FG

Not bad, just one three and out. In the first half, Jets had drives of 77 yards, 80 yards, and 42 yards. So yeah, they weren't doing much.

BTW, love the lucky bounce argument :up:

I know you are used to seeing the Jets have a bunch of 3 and outs, but those drives are not very impressive. Especially when you consider that SD was coming off a game where they gave up 14 points in the 4th quarter to Den, and is WC team playing an early game on the EC.

All of the Jets scoring drives came off of great field position and the last FG took a bogus PI call. When they didn't have excellent field position, they couldn't do anything. They even started that 3rd drive near the 50, and still had to punt. SD never had good field position and it took a lucky bounce to keep them from scoring.

Yes, it was a lucky bounce. It is not even an argument. It is a fact. :up:

 

[JETSJETSJETS]

Both off target, but very different when judging how bad the pass really was.

Both were picked cuz they were off target. Stop it.

If they keep playing like they did on Monday night, I will disagree.

They played like sh*t on Monday. Why reserve the judgement till next game? I thought u judge the team by the way they play and not the talent? Or do you judge them by the way they played some of the previous games, and give them a pass if they sucked in their last game? I judge them by their talent level AND how the performed.

I could have given you a bunch of reasons why the Jets should have beaten the Raiders, but they didn't because they didn't play very good. If the Jets don't play better, all of those teams will have a decent shot at winning.

Couldn't agree with you more...You are a champ at giving reasons, reasonable or not.

An if ANY team doesn't play good, they are not going to have a good shot at winning. Why would you single out Jets? Your hatred for the team? Most likely, and I don't blame you. The feeling is mutual.

I didn't just look at the score board. I saw all of those games, and saw how poorly the Jets played in them. It was 24-17 at the start of the 4th when Cro muffed the punt. Lucky bounce? After Cro muffed it, he picked it back up and the defender knocked it out of his hands. The ball didn't bounce of his chest 10 yards and land in the hands of the defender.

Yes you did. Cuz Raiders scored on the last play of the 3rd I believe. So yeah, you did look at the scoreboard and based it off of that. And Cro never gained possession of the ball on the second attempt else it would have been down by contact. He was on his knees. I guess it was a great STs play from the Raiders that Cromartie muffed it. Cromartie muffing is not a lucky bounce, but VJ dropping the pass is a lucky bounce? How come? Please be consistent if u wanna debate.

It is good that the Jets can cut double digit leads in the 4th to single digits, but if you can't get another stop and another score, it doesn't mean anything.

4th quarter, 6 point game, 6 mins left....Game is far from being over.

I don't care if it was the best corner in the league. His coverage in the redzone was terrible. I saw it myself. Plax had 1 reception for 16 yards against the Dolphins the week before. I don't think Plax all of the sudden became this 3 td a game receiver because he ran great routes.

I agree, but give him credit for the TDs. In fact, leave it. Why am I asking u anyways?

If Bal keeps playing like that, I will absolutely change my opinion about how good I think they are.

How many such games before you change ur opinion? Do you have a set agenda?

Revis was not covering VJ on that play. He had nothing to do with the coverage on VJ. The pass was to VJ. The pass hit VJ in the arms and bounced off of him right to Revis. Totally different than Butler covering the guy, and then ripping the ball out of the guys hands.

Revis faked the man coverage on VJ, something that fooled the QB cuz he thought he had a shot on the 5 yard in since Revis was on his back shoulder. Revis dropped back and was fortunate that Rivers pass was off target.

I know you are used to seeing the Jets have a bunch of 3 and outs, but those drives are not very impressive. Especially when you consider that SD was coming off a game where they gave up 14 points in the 4th quarter to Den, and is WC team playing an early game on the EC.

U said Jets weren't doing anything with the ball. I showed you they were moving the ball.

All of the Jets scoring drives came off of great field position and the last FG took a bogus PI call. When they didn't have excellent field position, they couldn't do anything. They even started that 3rd drive near the 50, and still had to punt. SD never had good field position and it took a lucky bounce to keep them from scoring.

Wrong again. I'll let u check the scoreboard this time though. And SD not having a good field position should tell you where the Jets had been punting from. Again, you have no idea what you are talking about.

Yes, it was a lucky bounce. It is not even an argument. It is a fact. :up:

Didn't say it wasn't. Revis still had to adjust his and get the pick. Maybe Revis was lucky he even caught the pass?

 

[The New Guy]

Both were picked cuz they were off target. Stop it.

Stop acting like both were equally bad. One was a far worse pass than the other.

They played like sh*t on Monday. Why reserve the judgement till next game? I thought u judge the team by the way they play and not the talent? Or do you judge them by the way they played some of the previous games, and give them a pass if they sucked in their last game? I judge them by their talent level AND how the performed.

How they played in previous games has a lot to do with it. It will take more than 1 game for me to change my opinion.

Couldn't agree with you more...You are a champ at giving reasons, reasonable or not.

An if ANY team doesn't play good, they are not going to have a good shot at winning. Why would you single out Jets? Your hatred for the team? Most likely, and I don't blame you. The feeling is mutual.

I single out the Jets becasue that is who we are talking about in this thread. You told me the Jets would beat Oak, Bal, and NE and I'm sure you had your reasons.

Yes you did. Cuz Raiders scored on the last play of the 3rd I believe. So yeah, you did look at the scoreboard and based it off of that. And Cro never gained possession of the ball on the second attempt else it would have been down by contact. He was on his knees. I guess it was a great STs play from the Raiders that Cromartie muffed it. Cromartie muffing is not a lucky bounce, but VJ dropping the pass is a lucky bounce? How come? Please be consistent if u wanna debate.

What do you want me to do? Give the Jets credit for leading early, or tied in the 3rd? The Jets lost by 10 to Oak, a team who you think is not very good.

The two plays are very different. Cro did muff it, but he picked it back up, and then the defender knocked it out of his hands. He was not on his knees when it happened. The defender had everything to do with the ball coming out.

He has possession at this point and his knee is not on the ground.

This is when the ball is being knocked out by the defender, and you can see his knee is still not on the ground.

The ball is already out when his knee is on the ground.

I am very consistent. I actually see what happens and don't just chalk up a turnover as being a lucky break and consider them all the same. They are not. Those two plays are very different. Revis sitting 10 yards away from VJ had nothing to do with the ball bouncing right to him. # 58 had everything to do with the ball coming out.

4th quarter, 6 point game, 6 mins left....Game is far from being over.

It is when the D can't get a stop. Again, kudos to the Jets for 1 scoring drive in the 4th when they were down 27-14. They still let NE march down the field right after that chewing up over 6:00 and putting it back to 2 scores. Cutting it to 6 early in the 4th doesn't mean anything if you can't finish.

I agree, but give him credit for the TDs. In fact, leave it. Why am I asking u anyways?

He caught the passes. He gets credit for that. I'm not going to say it was from great route running when it was not. Plax didn't play much different than he has the first 6 weeks.

How many such games before you change ur opinion? Do you have a set agenda?

More than 1.

Revis faked the man coverage on VJ, something that fooled the QB cuz he thought he had a shot on the 5 yard in since Revis was on his back shoulder. Revis dropped back and was fortunate that Rivers pass was off target.

Rivers was looking at VJ and VJ was looking at him the whole play. No fake coverage forced him to go to VJ. It hit him in the arms and it bounced right to Revis.

Wrong again. I'll let u check the scoreboard this time though. And SD not having a good field position should tell you where the Jets had been punting from. Again, you have no idea what you are talking about.

I'm never wrong. :D We were talking about the second half. Please show me which scoring drives the Jets had in the 2nd half without excellent field position. Good luck.

Didn't say it wasn't. Revis still had to adjust his and get the pick. Maybe Revis was lucky he even caught the pass?

Actually, you did:

Lucky bounce is a funny argument.

BTW, love the lucky bounce argument :up:

At least you agree now, and that makes two things that we agree on. :up: We are definitely heading in the right direction.

 

[nyjunc]

The ball moves before he is touched, it was a bad call. It didn't cost us the game but it was a bad call.

 

[The New Guy]

The ball moves before he is touched, it was a bad call. It didn't cost us the game but it was a bad call.

Are you talking about the Cromartie fumble? Are you trying to say that the ball never moves before he was touched? It doesn't matter if he was touched or not as the ball is coming out before his knees ever touch the ground.

 

[nyjunc]

which cromartie fumble?

 

[The New Guy]

which cromartie fumble?

You tell me. You posted right after my post:

The ball moves before he is touched, it was a bad call. It didn't cost us the game but it was a bad call.

The only fumble I talked about and posted pictures of in that post was the fumble against the Raiders, but what you said doesn't make sense to me.

 

[nyjunc]

You tell me. You posted right after my post:



The only fumble I talked about and posted pictures of in that post was the fumble against the Raiders, but what you said doesn't make sense to me.

The pictues didn't show up, I assumed you were talking about the Deion Branch fumble again- what is the controversy about the Cro fumle?

 

[The New Guy]

The pictues didn't show up, I assumed you were talking about the Deion Branch fumble again- what is the controversy about the Cro fumle?

JetsJets said:

Cro never gained possession of the ball on the second attempt else it would have been down by contact. He was on his knees.

I was showing that he did have possession, and that he was not on his knees when the Oak defender knocked the ball out.

 

[JETSJETSJETS]

I single out the Jets becasue that is who we are talking about in this thread. You told me the Jets would beat Oak, Bal, and NE and I'm sure you had your reasons.

No I didn't.

What do you want me to do? Give the Jets credit for leading early, or tied in the 3rd? The Jets lost by 10 to Oak, a team who you think is not very good.

I want you to stop looking at the scoreboard when making your conclusions.

The two plays are very different. Cro did muff it, but he picked it back up, and then the defender knocked it out of his hands. He was not on his knees when it happened. The defender had everything to do with the ball coming out.

He never had possession. Yes, his knee wasn't down as I watch it again, but he never gained possession of the ball. It was always moving in his hands.

I am very consistent. I actually see what happens and don't just chalk up a turnover as being a lucky break and consider them all the same. They are not. Those two plays are very different. Revis sitting 10 yards away from VJ had nothing to do with the ball bouncing right to him. # 58 had everything to do with the ball coming out.

#24 had nothing to do with catching the pass? Just like how #58 had to touch Cros hand to cause the fumble, #24 had to catch the pass. They were both lucky plays, whether u agree or not.

It is when the D can't get a stop. Again, kudos to the Jets for 1 scoring drive in the 4th when they were down 27-14. They still let NE march down the field right after that chewing up over 6:00 and putting it back to 2 scores. Cutting it to 6 early in the 4th doesn't mean anything if you can't finish.

Of course it doesn't. But you are judging the game looking at the scoreboard again. The game was MUCH closer than your scoreboard indicates and thats what you don't understand.

He caught the passes. He gets credit for that. I'm not going to say it was from great route running when it was not. Plax didn't play much different than he has the first 6 weeks.

Maybe he didn't play football for almost two years and was a little rusty to begin the season with? When he ran great routes, he scored TDs. We'll just agree to disagree here.

Rivers was looking at VJ and VJ was looking at him the whole play. No fake coverage forced him to go to VJ. It hit him in the arms and it bounced right to Revis.

Kind of opposite actually. Rivers passed it to VJ when he saw Revis back off. Regardless, it was a bad pass that got what it deserved.

I'm never wrong. :D We were talking about the second half. Please show me which scoring drives the Jets had in the 2nd half without excellent field position. Good luck.

No, you said Jets didn't do anything until they had great field position. Jets had 5 drives. Two resulted in TDs (doesn't matter where they start from cuz TD ends the drive even if its 1 yard long or 99 yard long). One resulted in a FG. Another would have resulted in a 20 yard drive with another first down had it not been for a holding penalty and a false start. Two punts. Five possessions, 17 points. Not bad at all for one half, but ur dictionary says something else.

Talking about excellent field position, you prove my point. Jets offense either punted from near midfields and the D forced 3 and out, or the D forced a turnover. Domination should be the word if one team consistently wins the field position battle and shuts the other team out.

Actually, you did:

I argued it was a bad pass, and the play was much likely to happen than the strip fumble of Keller for a TD. Never said, or meant Revis turned in to a beast and forced the tipped pass. Did I?

At least you agree now, and that makes two things that we agree on. :up: We are definitely heading in the right direction.

Here's a deal. Stop replying to things that we agree upon and we'll cut this debate short...agreed?

 

[The New Guy]

I want you to stop looking at the scoreboard when making your conclusions.

I never have. I saw all of the games that I commented on. You keep reaching for the silver lining in those games, but there is none. The Jets haven't played good football.

He never had possession. Yes, his knee wasn't down as I watch it again, but he never gained possession of the ball. It was always moving in his hands.

Just like you were wrong about his knee being down, you are also wrong about him not having possession. I could show you with more pictures and videos, but I'm not going to waste my time. Who really cares anyway? The point is he didn't fumble it on his own. The defender knocked it out.

#24 had nothing to do with catching the pass? Just like how #58 had to touch Cros hand to cause the fumble, #24 had to catch the pass. They were both lucky plays, whether u agree or not.

Are you serious? You think both plays are the same? Yes, Revis had to catch a pass that was heading right towards him, but he had nothing to do with the ball coming his way. #58 had everything to do with the ball coming out. One play was caused by a great defensive play, and the other was from the ball bouncing off of a receiver. The defense never had a hand on the ball, it was a lucky bounce.

Of course it doesn't. But you are judging the game looking at the scoreboard again. The game was MUCH closer than your scoreboard indicates and thats what you don't understand.

Again, I didn't just look at the final score, I watched the games.

You call cutting a 14 point lead to 7 with 5:00 left in the game, while the defense allows the other team to drive and kick a FG bringing the lead back to 10 with a little over 2:00 min left, a close game?

You call cutting a 13 point lead to 6 points with 7:00 left in the game, while the defense allows a 6:12 drive ending with a FG to bring the lead back to 9 with only 1:00 left in the game, a close game? I don't. I watched the defense get dominated in those games.

Kind of opposite actually. Rivers passed it to VJ when he saw Revis back off. Regardless, it was a bad pass that got what it deserved.

Yes, it was a bad pass, but it was still a catchable ball. It's not fair to say that it deserved to be intercepted. It took a good bounce for the Jets. It could have just as easily been an incomplete pass with a different bounce.

No, you said Jets didn't do anything until they had great field position. Jets had 5 drives. Two resulted in TDs (doesn't matter where they start from cuz TD ends the drive even if its 1 yard long or 99 yard long). One resulted in a FG. Another would have resulted in a 20 yard drive with another first down had it not been for a holding penalty and a false start. Two punts. Five possessions, 17 points. Not bad at all for one half, but ur dictionary says something else.

Again, we were talking about the second half:

Oh, as for the Jets not doing too good, here are their drives in 2nd half

1st drive: 31 yards, 2 FD, punt
2nd drive: 55 yards, 4 FD, TD
3rd drive: 15 penalty yards, 3 and out
4th drive: 19 yards, TD
5th drive: 35 yards, FG

Not bad, just one three and out. In the first half, Jets had drives of 77 yards, 80 yards, and 42 yards. So yeah, they weren't doing much.

It doesn't matter where drives start from? :crazy: If not for penalties, one drive would have resulted in 20 yards? :confused: What are you talking about? Penalties don't count against the Jets? There is a reason they call back plays after penalties.

The Jets first scoring drive (in the second half) came when they were down 21-10, and started near midfield. The Jets have never had problems this year cutting a 2 score lead back to one. They have just been unable to do anything after that without some big play by the defense or ST. See Cowboys and Chargers. The other TD drive came off that lucky bounce when they got the ball on the SD 19. The last drive resulted in a FG because of a bogus PI call. 17 second half points is very good, but considering they all came off of great FP, and that SD was coming off a game against the Broncos where they allowed 14, 4th quarter points, it is not very good.

Here's a deal. Stop replying to things that we agree upon and we'll cut this debate short...agreed?

Am I not supposed to reply to this if I agree?

We are not going to agree on anything that we have been discussing, and are just starting to repeat the same stuff over and over again. You see things very different than I do, and that is fine. You are wrong, but that is fine. I agree to agree to disagree.

 

[JETSJETSJETS]

I never have. I saw all of the games that I commented on. You keep reaching for the silver lining in those games, but there is none. The Jets haven't played good football.

Jets played good football against a good team last weekend. Thats what I saw.

Just like you were wrong about his knee being down, you are also wrong about him not having possession. I could show you with more pictures and videos, but I'm not going to waste my time. Who really cares anyway? The point is he didn't fumble it on his own. The defender knocked it out.

No, the ball was moving in his hand. You seriously are delusional.

Are you serious? You think both plays are the same? Yes, Revis had to catch a pass that was heading right towards him, but he had nothing to do with the ball coming his way. #58 had everything to do with the ball coming out. One play was caused by a great defensive play, and the other was from the ball bouncing off of a receiver. The defense never had a hand on the ball, it was a lucky bounce.

No, ones an int, the other is a fumble. Revis int didn't have much to do with the defender, just like the Cromartie fumble. The ball was moving in Cromartie's hand, and it needed was a tap on the hand from defender. Great play by the defender? No, just a bad play from Cromartie. Im not gonna run around the bush on this one with you again.

Again, I didn't just look at the final score, I watched the games.

Maybe you did. I don't doubt it. Dolphin games were horrible to watch so I don't blame you. But you happen to see all the "lucky bounces" going in Jets favors and ignore the ones that don't. A bit too picky I guess.

You call cutting a 14 point lead to 7 with 5:00 left in the game, while the defense allows the other team to drive and kick a FG bringing the lead back to 10 with a little over 2:00 min left, a close game?

Again, you keep referring to cutting leads. I keep referring to the 7 mins left and one possession game. Game was eventually won the Pats, but it wasn't like the Jets layed down and let them win. STOP looking at the scorecard. I repeat, stop looking at the scorecard. If you saw the game, you'd know Tom Brady had to be at his best to avoid a comeback. Im not gonna comment on this again either. Move on.

Yes, it was a bad pass, but it was still a catchable ball. It's not fair to say that it deserved to be intercepted. It took a good bounce for the Jets. It could have just as easily been an incomplete pass with a different bounce.

Could have been an incompletion, yeah. Then Chargers could have missed the FG attempt on the next play. Sanchez could have thrown a 60 yarder to Holmes on the next play. Jets could have recovered a surprise on side kick. Sanchez could have hit Holmes again for another 60 yarder....

See what I did there? It didn't happen, so it doesn't matter.

It doesn't matter where drives start from? :crazy: If not for penalties, one drive would have resulted in 20 yards? :confused: What are you talking about? Penalties don't count against the Jets? There is a reason they call back plays after penalties.

If you score a TD, it doesn't matter where the drive started from. The D couldn't stop them from 55 yards, they probably wont stop them from 75 yards out. Penalties count, but it doesn't change the fact the secondary couldn't cover Jets.

The Jets first scoring drive (in the second half) came when they were down 21-10, and started near midfield. The Jets have never had problems this year cutting a 2 score lead back to one. They have just been unable to do anything after that without some big play by the defense or ST. See Cowboys and Chargers. The other TD drive came off that lucky bounce when they got the ball on the SD 19. The last drive resulted in a FG because of a bogus PI call. 17 second half points is very good, but considering they all came off of great FP, and that SD was coming off a game against the Broncos where they allowed 14, 4th quarter points, it is not very good.

My bad. I thought teams only played offense. Totally forget Defense and ST take up more than half the game. You are so lost...Scoring on three drives out of 5 is not bad at all. Just the other day you were complaining about how Jets offense couldn't score TD when were in FG range. Now you are complaining with Jets offense scoring TD only when they get good field position.

Am I not supposed to reply to this if I agree?

We are not going to agree on anything that we have been discussing, and are just starting to repeat the same stuff over and over again. You see things very different than I do, and that is fine. You are wrong, but that is fine. I agree to agree to disagree.

lol, you need a beer.

 

[The New Guy]

Jets played good football against a good team last weekend. Thats what I saw.

Like I said, you see things much different than I do. The Jets played better football, not good football.

No, the ball was moving in his hand. You seriously are delusional.

You see what you want to see, not what actually happened. His knee was down. The ball was moving ect... I've proven that you have been wrong before. You are losing your credibility.

No, ones an int, the other is a fumble. Revis int didn't have much to do with the defender, just like the Cromartie fumble. The ball was moving in Cromartie's hand, and it needed was a tap on the hand from defender. Great play by the defender? No, just a bad play from Cromartie. Im not gonna run around the bush on this one with you again.

I expect nothing less from you. You have shown time and again that you clearly don't know how to judge plays. They are not all the same. One the defender knocked out, and one the defender never touched until it bounced right to him.

Again, you keep referring to cutting leads. I keep referring to the 7 mins left and one possession game. Game was eventually won the Pats, but it wasn't like the Jets layed down and let them win. STOP looking at the scorecard. I repeat, stop looking at the scorecard. If you saw the game, you'd know Tom Brady had to be at his best to avoid a comeback. Im not gonna comment on this again either. Move on.

You are the one who is only looking at the scoreboard when you see a 1 possession game with 7 min left. You forget about the 2 score hole the Jets put themselves in before that. It would have been an even bigger hole had the TE not dropped a TD pass (another lucky break) right before the half that got intercepted. I guess that was just another bad pass that got what it deserved. If you really watched the games, you wouldn't be arguing with me when I say that the Jets didn't play good football.

If you score a TD, it doesn't matter where the drive started from. The D couldn't stop them from 55 yards, they probably wont stop them from 75 yards out. Penalties count, but it doesn't change the fact the secondary couldn't cover Jets.

That is ridiculous. The Jets scored on that 55 yard drive when they were down 21-10. They took the lead on a 19 yard drive. Your argument is that if SD could not stop them from going 19 yards, they were not going to stop them from going 70 or 80? :crazy:

20 more yards is a huge difference. Let alone 60 more yards like it would have most likely been without the turnover. The only long drive the Jets scored on in the first half was when they were down by 2 scores. They have been able to do that all year. What they have not been able to do is score (without a turnover or big ST play) when they could tie, or take the lead.

My bad. I thought teams only played offense. Totally forget Defense and ST take up more than half the game. You are so lost...Scoring on three drives out of 5 is not bad at all. Just the other day you were complaining about how Jets offense couldn't score TD when were in FG range. Now you are complaining with Jets offense scoring TD only when they get good field position.

Obviously! You like to point out that the Jets cut a 2 score lead to one against NE (which in your mind made it a close game) but you don't see the Jets defense getting walked on for 6:12 making it a 2 score game again.

Good defense and special teams play count, but the Jets offense is consistently relying on big plays from those units to tie, or take the lead in games. You are not going to get a punt block for a TD every game, or get an Int or a fumble when the other team is about to bring it back to a 2 score game. The Jets have been down by 2 scores after the half in 5 out of 7 games. That is because they have not been playing good football.

I said that the Jets improved some things in the game against SD, but I'm not overreacting considering the type of team I think SD is, and them playing on the EC.

lol, you need a beer.

No thanks, I don't drink. Going by some of the things you say, you probably shouldn't either.

 

[Kinzua]

The point is what I've been saying all along ... you can tell a good team by who they have on the field. what you and so many others do is ridiculous to me. Do the Ravens suck now because they got humiliated by the Jags? no they don't ... they're still a good team. all you need to do is look at who plays for them. in your world the definition of a good team changes like the wind blows depending on who beat who, and by how many points and what somebody's record is on whatever date you want to pick.

when i look at our schedule and see the Giants, I think of Eli, Tuck, Jacobs, Nicks, Osi, Pierre-Paul etc. and I know we'll have our hands full that day. When i see the Eagles i think about guys like Vick, Jackson and Asamough(spelling?) I don't need to know what their record is, or how many points they beat xyz team by in week 7, or who they lost to in week 5. I know those teams are good because I can see who they have on their team.

... And that's what I've been saying all along about the Jets. so it just makes me laugh when we lose a couple of games and people act like we don't have a roster full of talent.

On the other hand, when I see the Dolphins or Broncos or Bills coming up, I'm not very concerned because they don't have enough good players to worry me, and we should beat those teams without much trouble.

Just because the Bills are 4-2 (and most likely 5-2 after Sunday) it doesn't make them a good team to me. It just makes them a team with a good record. If they ever stop giving up 420 yards to every team they play I'll look at them differently.

ROTFLMAO! You can tell a good team by how they play, not by the reputations of their players or where they were drafted or not drafted ... and as the infamous and oh-not-so-popular-in-South-Florida-these-days Tuna said, "You are what your record says you are."

Moreover, as for talent, how is the Jests' talent all that much greater than other teams? They've got Mangold and Ferguson on the OL who are Pro Bowlers, but the remainder of the OL is, at best, mediocre. Sorry, LT is a shell of his former self. Green isn't anything special. Sanchez is barely in the Top Twenty among starting QBs. Holmes is a decent WR but Burress has been overrated his entire career, and he's crap now. Kerley is a nice rookie WR but he's not very special right now. Keller is okay at TE.

The Jests D is also meh. Nobody on the DL or among LBers is anything special. The Jests' big star on the front seven is Bills' bust Aaron Maybin as designated pass rusher who gets a few snaps in guaranteed passing situations because he's such a liability against the run. Revis and Cromartie are bonafide talents at CB but the safeties are, again, mediocre. The Jets D plays better as a unit than its individual players' "talent" says they should, which means that its the coaching that's superior not the players' "talent". The coaches, however, are not on the field. Ooops!

Of course, the Jests ST are good. The punter and FG kicker are good because they get so much practice because the Jests "talented" offense scores TDs so often! Kick returner McKnight is pretty decent, but when some of your team's best players are STers, your team really doesn't have much talent, Skippy.