Saban Building the D

[HysterikiLL]

The '85 Bears were the greatest defense I've ever seen.

That being said, here are some numbers on the Steel Curtain. After you read this tell me if you still think our defense will ever be comparable to this...

They have 4 Hall of Famers (Mel Blount, Joe Greene, Jack Ham and Jack Lambert) along with All Pro players (Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Dwight White).

In a seven year span (1973-1979) the Steeler defense led them to seven consecutive division titles, averaged 11 wins a year and won 4 World Championships.

In that same span of time (7 years) they were NEVER out of the top 5 in total defense.

In 1976 the Steeler defense had 5 shutouts. In a season ending 9 game winning streak they allowed 28 TOTAL points. 28 POINTS ALLOWED IN 9 GAMES! They sent 8 defensive players to the Pro Bowl in 1976.

I'm sorry but that is a pretty high standard to compare our defense or ANY defense to. Lets see this team hit the field before comparing them to the rediculous standards that the great defenses of the past have set.

P.S....28 points allowed in 9 games....that is just freaking sick.

I was about to say that that was the most dominant defense of all time.

And on the issue of us giving Saban too much credit -- Since the day this guy gave his "acceptance speech", he's seemingly been flawless. From the early days when we had a frenzy of RBs -- Rudi, Travis Henry, Shaun Alexander, Edge James all finding interest in a bum team from the year before, to the signings of guys for less money than winning franchises in 04 just because of the system of control Saban evoked.

He's carried out all events with acts of veteranism, although a rookie HC in the NFL. Free agency, the draft, personnel selection, discipline.

There are very few Don Shulas, there are very very few Michael Jordans but they do exist. No one is the greatest until they are. There is always going to be a greatest, whether it's defense or coach, without it happening, it won't.

Looking at the greatests defenses of all time, it is unfathomable to envision us matching that but under Saban's influence, I do think it is possible. I'll just hang that out there.

BTW -- I'll ink it in writing that I think we'll go 10-6 this season.

 

[Surferosa]

I dont see why people need to talk in absolutes. Best ever? Come on.

 

[Superself]

What was so great about the Ravens. They had Ray Lewis, Boulware, 2 good CB's (McAllister, Starks) which were not as good as Madison/ Surtain. Their DT's were 2 big fat guys who were just pluggers (Adams and Siragusa). They didn't have any elite D-linemen. I wouldn't exactly compare them to the 85 Bears or the Steel Curtain, or for that matter the Dallas Doomsday defense of the 70's

Wow, you answered your own question....they had Ray Lewis, Boulware and 2 good CBs!

They didn't foldover like a $2 pup tent when the pressure was on. They actually struck fear in other teams. Our defense was vanilla and had the foldover role down pat.

 

[saves]

What was so great about the Ravens. They had Ray Lewis, Boulware, 2 good CB's (McAllister, Starks) which were not as good as Madison/ Surtain. Their DT's were 2 big fat guys who were just pluggers (Adams and Siragusa). They didn't have any elite D-linemen. I wouldn't exactly compare them to the 85 Bears or the Steel Curtain, or for that matter the Dallas Doomsday defense of the 70's

Are you kidding me, they were an absolute dominate defense. Not only did they have the 2 top level linebackers you mentioned, they had Jamie Sharper who is still a stud LB. Any you seem to be forgetting that Lewis had a 5 year span where he was the most dominate player in the game. McAllister is a top 3 or 4 cornerback, and Starks could have been the main cb on almost any other team in the leauge, better than Sammy and Pat? It's arguable. Those 2 fat guys may have been just pluggers, but whats wrong with that? It leaves those talented LB's even more potent. They had McCrary at D-end who was playing great at the time, and future hall of famer Rod Woodson hanging out in the secondary just waiting for a ball to pick. Don't forget Marvin Lewis was calling the shots, and he is one of the best defensive minds in the leauge. This team definatly deserves to be considered one of the best of all times, theres no logic in arguing against it.

 

[Finland]

under Wannestedt, the Dolphins defense was "close" to the Ravens. Certainly not as dominant, but not really that far off either especially when you consider Miami defense was so vanilla.

Come on...comments like that are getting old. The fact that they ran a simple defense means nothing. Perhaps that is why they were successful. Perhaps that is the personal they had build...either way it in NO WAY means they might have been even more successful with a complicated one. If anything, with the guys we had and their talents, likely less successful. Notice how we are changing people to gear up for a different plan this year.

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

The '85 Bears were the greatest defense I've ever seen.

That being said, here are some numbers on the Steel Curtain. After you read this tell me if you still think our defense will ever be comparable to this...

They have 4 Hall of Famers (Mel Blount, Joe Greene, Jack Ham and Jack Lambert) along with All Pro players (Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Dwight White).

In a seven year span (1973-1979) the Steeler defense led them to seven consecutive division titles, averaged 11 wins a year and won 4 World Championships.

In that same span of time (7 years) they were NEVER out of the top 5 in total defense.

In 1976 the Steeler defense had 5 shutouts. In a season ending 9 game winning streak they allowed 28 TOTAL points. 28 POINTS ALLOWED IN 9 GAMES! They sent 8 defensive players to the Pro Bowl in 1976.

I'm sorry but that is a pretty high standard to compare our defense or ANY defense to. Lets see this team hit the field before comparing them to the rediculous standards that the great defenses of the past have set.

P.S....28 points allowed in 9 games....that is just freaking sick.

I agree the Bears had the best single season defense I can ever remember. The 1972 Dolphins were close. But, for a period of time I don't think any team has been as dominating as the Steelers defense. The '85 Bears kind of fizzled out pretty quickly, although there were some great teams that emerged to take over like San Francisco and the New York Giants. Those Steelers numbers are amazing.

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

Come on...comments like that are getting old. The fact that they ran a simple defense means nothing. Perhaps that is why they were successful. Perhaps that is the personal they had build...either way it in NO WAY means they might have been even more successful with a complicated one. If anything, with the guys we had and their talents, likely less successful. Notice how we are changing people to gear up for a different plan this year.

I think it does hold weight. Because the Dolphins ran a simple defense, teams knew what to expect which especially became evident at crucial moments. How many times with the game on the line did New England come up with the exact right play against our defense? Seems like virtually every time they needed it. I agree the personnel is changing, but a lot of that is due to age and the fact that Saban likes more physical players.

 

[BlueFin]

I agree the Bears had the best single season defense I can ever remember. The 1972 Dolphins were close. But, for a period of time I don't think any team has been as dominating as the Steelers defense. The '85 Bears kind of fizzled out pretty quickly, although there were some great teams that emerged to take over like San Francisco and the New York Giants. Those Steelers numbers are amazing.

Only one defense ever shut out the opponents offense in a Superbowl, and that was the No-Names.:evil:

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

Only one defense ever shut out the opponents offense in a Superbowl, and that was the No-Names.:evil:

So true. I really think that was an underrated unit. Not only did Miami lead the league in least points given up, and rank 1st in defense, but I believe the opponents qb rating was 45.

 

[adamprez2003]

Should be interesting in Baltimore this year. Rex Ryan's son, is the defensive coordinator and they are going to be running a 4-6 defense. The Ravens in their Super Bowl year ran it occasionally but then went to the 3-4. They no longer have the personnel to run a 3-4 so they are going to switch to a base 4-3 but plan to play the 4-6 approximately 50% of the time. I would love for Saban to introduce a few 4-6 packages against any team that doesnt run the WCO. I still think it's one of the toughest defenses to play against if you play a traditional offense

 

[Dolphin North]

really....there are so many people on here that give Saban so much more credit than he deserves at this point.

I think in the end he will end up being a great coach for this team, but to expect instant success is crazy.

I think this year, Saban will be outcoached a bunch of times, just for the simple fact that he doesn't have the experience in a top level as a HC.

the 12-4 predictions are crazy. there are completely different circumstances with the Dolphins and 2004 Chargers.

I expect this team to obviously be better than last year. I think the chemistry will improve (depending on Ricky and Randy), but the success will take time.

I wouldn't be the least bit suprised if the D gives up a lot of points this season (well, more than usual), because I see a lot of the players way out of position from time to time. Once everybody has a full year in the system, I think they'll be GREATLY improved in 2006.

I can't see this D getting 5 shutouts in any season though (2000 Ravens).

More realistic. We'll still have a great D in a year. I never began to think of all time, just great..

 

[HelloMotto]

...........Greatest of all-time? Nearing the 85 Bears and 2000 Ravens? Yeeeeeeesh. Optimism is nice, trust me........but some of you guys need to be a little bit more patient and constructive in your predictions. It's beyond me how you can come to that conclusion, optimism or not.

i have been watching the fins religiously since 72 and this past off season has been remarkable. without a doubt this team will be 8 and 8 or better. I have loved every move saban has done. This is actually unusual for me. I think we are the brink of something special. I understand your a pessimist (i'm sure you will call it a realist ) but i think you will be surprised this year. Those that have been around and see this developing should know what i mean. i can't wait....

 

[Dudeman]

Only one defense ever shut out the opponents offense in a Superbowl, and that was the No-Names.:evil:

huh? the Ravens shut-out the Giants. The Giants TD was a kick return, followed by a Ravens kick return TD. The final that game was 34-7

The Ravens' defense completed a dominating season by permitting just 152 yards, forcing 5 turnovers, recording 4 sacks, and not allowing an offensive touchdown en route to the franchise’s first Super Bowl victory.

http://www.superbowl.com/history/recaps/game/sbxxxv

 

[BlueFin]

huh? the Ravens shut-out the Giants. The Giants TD was a kick return, followed by a Ravens kick return TD. The final that game was 34-7



http://www.superbowl.com/history/recaps/game/sbxxxv

Touche..........let me restate:

The Dolphins defense and special teams defense were the only team to shut out an opponents Offense and special teams in a Superbowl.

However, being one of two teams whose defense shut out the opponents offense in a Superbowl is something to be proud of as well.

 

[inFINSible]

Touche..........let me restate:

The Dolphins defense and special teams defense were the only team to shut out an opponents Offense and special teams in a Superbowl.

However, being one of two teams whose defense shut out the opponents offense in a Superbowl is something to be proud of as well.

Or.....

The Dolphins are the only Super Bowl team whose team defense has held their opponents scoreless in the big game.