Schein: Ross is clueless and Miami has the worst quarterback corps in the league

[insomnia411]

Dude, the mere fact that he put up numbers and played well against teams we should beat puts him above many QBs in this league. Theres at least 10 starting QBs that cant even do that.

---------- Post added at 04:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:54 PM ----------



yea you right. Henne used to put us on his back and carry us to many a win against good teams.

Im not saying moore is the future, just saying its insanity to think he isnt better than Henne.

He carried us to a win in his very first NFL start against the Jets. The coaching staff NEVER used him properly and they completely screwed him up with the wildcat nonsense. I can't even tell you how many times Ronnie Brown would pound the ball up the middle for no gain on first and second down, only for Henne to have to come into an impossible 3rd and long situation. Is that any way to treat a young and talented QB? Tony Sporano RUINED Chad Henne. Again, I wouldn't be surprised at all if he goes and has a good career in JAX.

---------- Post added at 05:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:02 PM ----------

Yea you right. I forgot how Moore never had a pass dropped and never caught a bad break. You right.

I seem to remember Marshall absolutely destroying the Cowboys only to have Moore fumble the ball twice and lose the game for us. It was almost the same exact situation in the 2nd Pats game, except instead of a fumble it was a god awful interception. Moore definitely never suffered drops as egregious as what Marshall did to Henne against the Browns or Texans.

 

[tylerdolphin]

He carried us to a win in his very first NFL start against the Jets. The coaching staff NEVER used him properly and they completely screwed him up with the wildcat nonsense. I can't even tell you how many times Ronnie Brown would pound the ball up the middle for no gain on first and second down, only for Henne to have to come into an impossible 3rd and long situation. Is that any way to treat a young and talented QB? Tony Sporano RUINED Chad Henne. Again, I wouldn't be surprised at all if he goes and has a good career in JAX.

Typical Henne fluffer. Everything is someone else's fault.

He played well his first start for multiple reasons. First of all nobody had film on him. Second of all, henne always played pretty well against teams running a lot of man coverage for some reason. The dude had a cannon. He really couldnt make all the throws though. You can count on one hand the amont of touch passes he ever made (corner routes, fades, ect.) and probably have fingers left.

 

[nyjunc]

Gabbert was awful last year. Not awful in the "oh I made a bad throw after my 2 or 3 good ones but Ill learn" sense. He was awful in the "I hope MFD runs for 150 because I damn sure aint throwing for 150 and breaking 50% on my passes". Be real man. Youre just being completely ridiculous.

And no, henne is not better than Moore. You continue to be 100% completely incapable of applying any logic in separating a QBs performance from the team. Just because Henne had the Fins in contention doesnt make him better. The whole team **** the bed for half a season last year. You cant put that all on Moore. Matter of fact, Moore played MUCH better with the same team last year than Henne did.

****ing logic, how does it work?

He was, how you know tannehill won't be this year? this happens w/ young QBs more often than not.

Henne is better than Moore, Henne has at least helped his team get in playoff contention, Moore has never done that. The excuse for Moore I keep readin is that "he didn't have 1st team reps in practice"- neither did Henne in '09 and he helped you back in the race. he ultimately failed but he had you in contention. last year you guys credit Moore but he came in at 0-3(/w the game tied 0-0) and help Miami get to 0-7 before he "played well". How do you know the team doesn't improve if henne stays helathy? maybe it wouldn't have takent until 0-7 to win? we'll never know.

You guys are too caught up in meaningless QB ratings for a guy who was awful when Miami needed him most and played well when the team was out of it. Matt Moore is a quality backup, tannehill may or may not become a quality starter but he has to prove it. Much like many teams the dolphins have a young prospect and I put them all in the same boat. Other teams have some better established QBs, again if I thought Garrard was healthy I'd have Miami higher but I think he's done.

 

[ckparrothead]

Personally, I don't think that the Fins have the WORST QB situation in football, and I wouldn't make that argument. My point is that I can see how it's possible how somebody could make that argument, because the QBs we have are pretty lacking in the talent department.
Matt Moore's numbers weren't bad if you just accept them wholesale without watching the games, but if you saw him play, you would know that he totally blew the games against Dallas (fumbling) and the 2nd New England game (terrible interception in the 2nd half). He put up huge numbers against the likes of Kansas City and Buffalo, color me underwhelmed. What did Moore do against the good defenses? The Jets, the Giants, the Broncos? Oh yeah, he was remarkably awful.
Much like everybody else on the roster, Moore turned it on and started playing reasonably well when we were 0-7 and the team was playing pressure free and playing inferior competition. Carolina drank the Matt Moore kool aid in 2009 when he came in for mop up work at the end of the season and played well, and they quickly learned how big of a mistake that was in 2010. I don't want to see us make the same mistake!
Is Matt Moore terrible? No, but he is clearly never going to be able to compete against good defenses, and with the receiver corps we have now, I think it'll be a **** show.
Realistically though, the only teams in the leauge with an inferior QB corps to us are the Cardinals, Seahawks, and Browns. Chad Henne is better than Matt Moore and I have a lot of faith in RG3. Maybe I'm wrong, but time will tell. I haven't been wrong very often thus far about Dolphins related issues.

You're holding a candle for Chad Henne, and claiming you're hardly ever wrong about the Dolphins? M'kay.

Regardless, the argument was that Miami has the worst QB situation in football. That argument is impossible to make. My point stands.

---------- Post added at 05:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:15 PM ----------

He was, how you know tannehill won't be this year? this happens w/ young QBs more often than not.

Henne is better than Moore, Henne has at least helped his team get in playoff contention, Moore has never done that. The excuse for Moore I keep readin is that "he didn't have 1st team reps in practice"- neither did Henne in '09 and he helped you back in the race. he ultimately failed but he had you in contention. last year you guys credit Moore but he came in at 0-3(/w the game tied 0-0) and help Miami get to 0-7 before he "played well". How do you know the team doesn't improve if henne stays helathy? maybe it wouldn't have takent until 0-7 to win? we'll never know.

You guys are too caught up in meaningless QB ratings for a guy who was awful when Miami needed him most and played well when the team was out of it. Matt Moore is a quality backup, tannehill may or may not become a quality starter but he has to prove it. Much like many teams the dolphins have a young prospect and I put them all in the same boat. Other teams have some better established QBs, again if I thought Garrard was healthy I'd have Miami higher but I think he's done.

Ummm, what? Playoff contention = 7-9?

 

[tylerdolphin]

Ummm, what? Playoff contention = 7-9?

Dont bother man. Anyone who has watched Dolphins games and needs to be told Moore is better than Henne is a lost cause.

 

[Nublar7]

Matt Moore isn't good and Ryan Tannehill sucked against every good team he played last year.

Matt Moore is not elite, but he isn't a bum either, in fact he was the ranked as the 12th passer in 2011.

Tannehill sucked against every good team he played last year? Let's take a look at Tannehill's stats against opponents who were in the top 15 of the AP poll, aka the "good teams":

Attempts: 165
Completions: 105
Completion Pct.: 64%
Yards: 1,181
TDs: 11
INTs: 5

That is an average of 296 yards, 3 touchdowns and and 1 interception per game against the "good teams".

 

[tylerdolphin]

He was, how you know tannehill won't be this year? this happens w/ young QBs more often than not.

No, they at least show a glimmer of hope. Gabbert was totally awful with no breaks of unawfulness in between.

 

[The New Guy]

You're holding a candle for Chad Henne, and claiming you're hardly ever wrong about the Dolphins? M'kay.

Regardless, the argument was that Miami has the worst QB situation in football. That argument is impossible to make. My point stands.

---------- Post added at 05:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:15 PM ----------



Ummm, what? Playoff contention = 7-9?

In 2009 the Dolphins were 7-7 (same as the Jets) with 2 games to go. I'm not sure how that proves Henne is a better QB though. The QB is the most important one, but there are many other factors involved which results in wins and losses.

Anyone that watched Henne play for 2 years, and then saw Moore last year could tell you that Moore is the better QB.

 

[ckparrothead]

In 2009 the Dolphins were 7-7 (same as the Jets) with 2 games to go. I'm not sure how that proves Henne is a better QB though. The QB is the most important one, but there are many other factors involved which results in wins and losses.

Anyone that watched Henne play for 2 years, and then saw Moore last year could tell you that Moore is the better QB.

Yes I realize that but unless Chad Henne subbed himself out for some other quarterback in those final two games them no he really did not lead the Dolphins into playoff contention.

 

[ckparrothead]

My advice on Tannehill and the "stats versus good/bad teams/defenses etc" argument is...just stay out of it.

No matter how you slice it his stats were not inspiring against good teams, good defenses, however you want to put it. In fact I'd have to question Nublar7's stat splits there, because I'm not aware of a stat split like that (good passer rating versus top 15 opponents). I'd love to know which games are counted into that split and which are not.

But like I said, don't get into it. It's not as informative as people make it out to be. You really need to watch the games. You need to watch his receivers drop 8 balls in the Texas game, including multiple touchdowns, and then also have like 2 or 3 more other balls that should have been complete but weren't because of other various receiver errors. You really need to watch him throw a perfect anticipation strike in the second half against Oklahoma State and see Jeff Fuller fall down on his break and essentially hand the ball to the defensive back for a pick-off. You need to see him go for two to win the game against K-State and see the ball hit the receiver in the numbers and go caroming away uncaught.

Stat splits are really not going to tell you anything. You have to watch the games and actually see these things.

Edit: Ok, I see what Nublar7 did there. He went by teams that finished in the top 15, which were Oklahoma State, Arkansas, Baylor and Kansas State. Conveniently of course, Oklahoma finished 16, and didn't quite make the "top 15". I find this kind of gerrmandering to be more intended to obscure the truth than illuminate it. For instance, if you were to sub in the USA Today Coaches Poll in place of the AP poll, you'd knock K-State out of that "top 15" and sub back in Oklahoma, and suddenly your stat split looks like **** and no Tannehill backer would quote it.

 

[DolfanDuBbZ~]

Off the top of my head, the following teams have worse QB situations than the Dolphins:

Jaguars
Cardinals
Jets
Browns
Titans
Chiefs
Vikings
49ers
Seahawks
Rams

Is this Schein guy a Jets fan? Sounds like a New Yorka.

Also, he makes it seem like agreeing to Hard Knocks will destroy the season. How so? Not ready for prime time? Since when is Hard Knocks about "prime time" teams? Most of the time they have had teams coming off of losing seasons, like the Bengals.

"Shame on you"

What a tool.

Your list has a few that shouldn't be there. Homerism at its finest.

 

[insomnia411]

You're holding a candle for Chad Henne, and claiming you're hardly ever wrong about the Dolphins? M'kay.

Regardless, the argument was that Miami has the worst QB situation in football. That argument is impossible to make. My point stands.

---------- Post added at 05:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:15 PM ----------



Ummm, what? Playoff contention = 7-9?

Again, I didn't say that the Dolphins had the worst QB situation, in fact I said that I wouldn't make that argument at all. All I said was that I can see how somebody could possibly make that argument being that our QB corps is obviously not very good. You're putting words in my mouth and I don't even know what your point is.
More importantly, I'm not holding a candle for Chad Henne, I'm stating facts. If our coaching staff over the last 3 years knew how to treat a young QB, Henne's career would look a hell of a lot different. You know what's a great idea? Take a talented young quarterback who is starting to get into a rythym out of the game and replace him with some bull**** single wing formation, then ask him to bail us out on 3rd and 14 after the aforementioned wildcat totally sucks. Great idea guys.
Henne was mishandled and his career was ruined by a bunch of schmucks who had no clue how to run an offense. Good news about Tony Sparano now is that he's with the Jets, so I'm not expecting them to score any points this year either.

 

[The New Guy]

Yes I realize that but unless Chad Henne subbed himself out for some other quarterback in those final two games them no he really did not lead the Dolphins into playoff contention.

The point is they had a shot at the playoffs with 2 games to go. Just because they didn't make it doesn't take away the fact that they had the opportunity. Regardless, it is a bad argument. It like trying to prove that Sanchez is better than Peyton because Sanchez won 4 playoff games in his first 2 seasons while Manning didn't win any.

 

[tylerdolphin]

Again, I didn't say that the Dolphins had the worst QB situation, in fact I said that I wouldn't make that argument at all. All I said was that I can see how somebody could possibly make that argument being that our QB corps is obviously not very good. You're putting words in my mouth and I don't even know what your point is.
More importantly, I'm not holding a candle for Chad Henne, I'm stating facts. If our coaching staff over the last 3 years knew how to treat a young QB, Henne's career would look a hell of a lot different. You know what's a great idea? Take a talented young quarterback who is starting to get into a rythym out of the game and replace him with some bull**** single wing formation, then ask him to bail us out on 3rd and 14 after the aforementioned wildcat totally sucks. Great idea guys.
Henne was mishandled and his career was ruined by a bunch of schmucks who had no clue how to run an offense. Good news about Tony Sparano now is that he's with the Jets, so I'm not expecting them to score any points this year either.

Yea, the WC totally ruined him.

Look, if stuff like that has an effect on your development as a QB, you lack the mental toughness to be good anyway.

 

[tylerdolphin]

The point is they had a shot at the playoffs with 2 games to go. Just because they didn't make it doesn't take away the fact that they had the opportunity. Regardless, it is a bad argument. It like trying to prove that Sanchez is better than Peyton becasue Sanchez won 4 playoff games in his first 2 seasons while Manning didn't win any.

But just taking 7-7 as is with no context does nothing to say whether the QB was good or not. Maybe the team was terrible and Henne willed them to 7 wins miraculously. Maybe the team was pretty good and Henne blew. Maybe it was something in between. Junc loves throwing around team wins stats in QB debates with no context at all. So point is, that playoff contention point, along with being false, is irrelevant.