Shawn Andrews vs. Vernon Carey

[The Ghost]

I remember sitting there as the picks went by thinking Andrews was going to fall to us at 19 but low and behold the Eagles traded up 3 spots ahead of us and grabbed him. And ofcourse we got Vernon who's turned into a fine player and earner his selection so far.

The reason I bring it up is because Shawn Andrews is currently holding out of Eagles camp for an undisclosed personal reason. There were many theories floated about as to why he's not there, and its been made clear its personal and money related as he's signed through the next 7 seasons anyway.

The one rumor that has stuck is that he's gay, and that he's been outed by one of his teammates and thats cause him embarrassment I guess and doesn't want to return.

I am only bringing this up because I am starting to think we dodged a bullet. Andrews was the higher rated prospect, I don't think anyone will argue that, but Carey's ability to play Tackle has pretty much even things up with Andrews anyway, IMO. Now this holdout and potential disaster to the Eagles has me RELIEVED we have Vernon Carey.

Let me conclude by saying I don't care if anyone is gay or not but I wouldn't want a gay player especially not one I have to invest in heavily knowing NFL players will never accept him as a teammate.

None of this is fact, but conclusion's have been drawn based on assortment of facts.

 

[Smoke]

Link doesn't work. I don't think a players sexual preference should overshawdow his abilities on the field. Andrews has been one of the best guards in the league since his rookie season. If we had a chance to go back and Andrews was there, I'd definately take him. I like Vernon carey but when you get a chance to get an elite player, you do it.

 

[Wildbill3]

Link doesn't work. I don't think a players sexual preference should overshawdow his abilities on the field. Andrews has been one of the best guards in the league since his rookie season. If we had a chance to go back and Andrews was there, I'd definately take him. I like Vernon carey but when you get a chance to get an elite player, you do it.

Can Andrews play both tackle positions? If not looking back, carey was our best choice where we selected. Now as to the rest of the stuff about Gay etc, I don't really care what a man does off the field in his personal life. with all the *** smacking in football I don't know why any player would have a problem with an openly gay teammate.

 

[Smoke]

Can Andrews play both tackle positions? If not looking back, carey was our best choice where we selected. Now as to the rest of the stuff about Gay etc, I don't really care what a man does off the field in his personal life. with all the *** smacking in football I don't know why any player would have a problem with an openly gay teammate.

I look at it like we almost had an all-pro guard for 10+ years and thats hard to get over. Don't forget that guard has been a glaring weakness as well and still is. Carey's value is high based on his versatility although he doesn't play at the level Andrews does. People seem to think Carey was really good at LT when in reality he was downright awful at times while pass blocking. He should be a very nice fit though at RT where he can maul people. Hopefully they will quit shuffling him around and let him stay there. Overall, Carey was still a very good selection for us. He has a lot of potential, especially now that they're getting some better players on the line with him.

 

[ckparrothead]

I knew the Eagles would come to regret signing a bunch of players to these super-long, prospecting type deals. They did it with Shawn Andrews and they did it with Reggie Brown also I believe, and I think Mike Patterson. The Bears did it with Brian Urlacher.

It seems smart, you see a player do well for you early in his career and so you come at them flashing a nice long seven year deal with up front money that makes those young, hungry eyes all wide...and all the while you know that the deal will end up looking cheap as sin compared with where that player could ascend to and what the salary cap could inflate to by the time you get mid-way through the deal, let alone all the way to the end of it.

A coup for the front office? Or a way to ensure that you overpay players that don't pan out, and that the players that do play above the value of the contract hold out once they realize they should have never signed the thing?

A player with only one or two years left on his contract will often decide that holding out just isn't worth it. But when a player sees that he's underpaid, and his contract calls for him to be underpaid for the next four years? THAT player is desperate. That player will do what it takes to get out from under the burden of that contract which stretches on seemingly forever.

 

[The Ghost]

Mike Patterson and Reggie Brown are both playing on rookie contracts and not likely to recieve second one's from the Eagles.

The Eagles handle the cap better than anyone else, and this isn't even a money issue. There not exactly screwed because the worst thing that can happen is that Andrews writes them a check bigger and fatter than even he is and walks away from the game. He's also got some mental issues, which some believe are the cause of this hold out, while I'd say the majority of Eagles fans in the know are starting to think the rumor I posted above is the actual case.

To that first poster, I took the link out cause its not right to post a link from one message board to another, even if everyone already knows KFFL.com.

I hate fueling a rumor, especially one like this, but nice scarf Shawn....http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h7/vinrock23/Parties015.jpg

 

[ckparrothead]

That is incorrect. Reggie Brown signed a contract extension in November of 2006 that extended his contract through 2014. Also in November of 2006, the Eagles signed Mike Patterson to a contract extension that runs through 2016. Earlier that year (June of 2006), the Eagles extended Shawn Andrews' rookie contract through 2015.

Reggie Brown:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2655803

Mike Patterson:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2647220

Shawn Andrews:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2480638

The Eagles did this all within the span of a few months. I was very critical of the lengthy nature of the contracts back then and I'm just as critical, if not more so, now that the Eagles are starting to suffer headaches from it now. Wait until Mike Patterson or Reggie Brown ascend even further than they are. It's only a matter of time before they see the sheer amount of time they have left on the contract and realize they need to do something drastic to get out of it.

 

[Valandui]

I look at it like we almost had an all-pro guard for 10+ years and thats hard to get over. Don't forget that guard has been a glaring weakness as well and still is. Carey's value is high based on his versatility although he doesn't play at the level Andrews does. People seem to think Carey was really good at LT when in reality he was downright awful at times while pass blocking. He should be a very nice fit though at RT where he can maul people. Hopefully they will quit shuffling him around and let him stay there. Overall, Carey was still a very good selection for us. He has a lot of potential, especially now that they're getting some better players on the line with him.

I think that Carey is a lot like Jason Allen in that if we would quit switching him around every year he may have been an all-pro already as well. On top of that, I have heard that the Pats were trying to trade up for him, so we may have dodged a big bullet by picking Carey.

 

[XXXSURTAINXXX]

I would love to have his "possibly gay" butt right on our offensive line. That man shouldbe judged by his performance on the field and his behaviours off the field....excluding who he may or maynot sleep with.

Probowler...Man that would be an instant upgrade and maybe our QB's would look a little better.

 

[SpaceMountain16]

I disagree that things have evened up, i was a big fan of Andrews out of college and was very disappointed that the Eagles traded ahead of us to get him as it looked like he was going to drop. As good a player as Vernon Carey has been, it's hard to argue that Shawn Andrews when healthy and in shape isn't one of the best guards in football, Carey's not quite there yet.

The Eagles aren't regretting anything. By locking up players while they're young long term, guys like Brown, Sheppard, Andrews they assure themselves great dollar value when these players turn out to be solid. Like Sheppard and Andrews have. Thats their strategy and it works very well for them. What they might regret is not paying Brian Westbrook, who is going to walk out of camp any day now when he doesn't get his new contract.

 

[Vertical Limit]

That is incorrect. Reggie Brown signed a contract extension in November of 2006 that extended his contract through 2014. Also in November of 2006, the Eagles signed Mike Patterson to a contract extension that runs through 2016. Earlier that year (June of 2006), the Eagles extended Shawn Andrews' rookie contract through 2015.

Reggie Brown:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2655803

Mike Patterson:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2647220

Shawn Andrews:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2480638

The Eagles did this all within the span of a few months. I was very critical of the lengthy nature of the contracts back then and I'm just as critical, if not more so, now that the Eagles are starting to suffer headaches from it now. Wait until Mike Patterson or Reggie Brown ascend even further than they are. It's only a matter of time before they see the sheer amount of time they have left on the contract and realize they need to do something drastic to get out of it.

Wow, I actually find any deals longer than 4-5 years a little on the ridiculous side unless the contract is offered to a franchise quarterback.

 

[gofins]

The one rumor that has stuck is that he's gay, and that he's been outed by one of his teammates and thats cause him embarrassment I guess and doesn't want to return.



Let me conclude by saying I don't care if anyone is gay or not but I wouldn't want a gay player especially not one I have to invest in heavily knowing NFL players will never accept him as a teammate.

Looks like some people need to grow the #@%& up!!!!

 

[SpaceMountain16]

Wow, I actually find any deals longer than 4-5 years a little on the ridiculous side unless the contract is offered to a franchise quarterback.

Not if the Eagles avoid signing Andrews to an even bigger deal, a deal worthy of one of the best linemen in the league now that he's a multi-time pro bowl player. They basically give themselves pro-bowl players at a bargain that way, but because those guys DID sign the contract there's nothing they can really do. Except get angry and threaten hold outs like Lito Sheppard has done.

 

[ckparrothead]

Not if the Eagles avoid signing Andrews to an even bigger deal, a deal worthy of one of the best linemen in the league now that he's a multi-time pro bowl player. They basically give themselves pro-bowl players at a bargain that way, but because those guys DID sign the contract there's nothing they can really do. Except get angry and threaten hold outs like Lito Sheppard has done.

And like Shawn Andrews is currently doing.

You know, it's like going out there and prospecting poor neighborhoods with high interest thrift loans. You make the interest really high, the people you give the loan to get wide-eyed at all the cash sitting in front of them, they sign on the bottom line because they don't know any better, things get bad and then the person defaults on the loan despite the negative ramifications, and in the end NOBODY is happy. The person defaulting the loan is facing all kinds of ramifications from it, the lender is looking at a write-off. Not a smart way to do business.

It's like how the gambling industry has been slowly killing the game of blackjack by increasing their efforts and efficiency at snuffing out card counters. For decades through the early 90's, blackjack was an extraordinarily popular game because people considered it a game that could be beaten. Now, how many of those people were actually good enough to beat it, versus how many of them thought they could beat it and lost their shirt instead? When it was a game of give-and-take, cat-and-mouse, blackjack remained popular. Then the casinos started justifying more hard core efforts to snuff out counting, going with continuous shuffling machines, even electronically tracking bet amounts relative to the card counts to identify betting patterns. The end result? A lot harder to go into a casino and count some cards, but also profit margins on the game itself are down, and the game is a LOT less popular. Now, everyone's obsessed with Poker and Hold'em, because that's the game that can be beaten...because you're playing against a bunch of other people that can be beaten.

It's just not smart to get so aggressive with the players and work out these seven year deals that you know will be severely undervalued for the last four years of them. You'll see some negative effects from it.

 

[popularwar]

I would have taken Andrews over Carey in the 2004 draft and I would take him over Carey today. I don't care if he's gay, as long as he's not a distraction to the team and stays out of trouble I'd take him because he's the superior player. That's not a shot at Carey either, I'm very happy to have Vernon on the team but a good lineman with versatility still grades lower to me than a pro-bowl quality player at a single position.