Star or System Guy?

[Pandarilla]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...guy-judging-ezekiel-elliott-dak-prescott-more

Bucky just put up major bulletin board material for Jarvis and Jay. Calls them both system guys. Sorry, Mr. Brooks but you failed to mention that both were tops in yards after contact. If that s screams system guy, I want to know which system schemes for broken tackles.

Not to harsh Bucky so badly, I can almost see it as a compliment for Gase. However, he called Jarvis an unpolished route runner unworthy of double teams. He completely disavowed Jay's 3 200 yd. Performances. Saying he wasn't in the same league as the other three to do it.

Oh well, it's a good starting point to get them in the discussion, I guess. I also think Parker will be the only one viewed as a Star under Bucky's criteria. Everyone else will be viewed as a product of Gase.

 

[gregorygrant83]

I disagree about Landry's route running. I think he's pretty good in that area and is far from unpolished. However, I agree that Ajayi isn't in the same class as Ricky, OJ or Earl Campbell. I think it way to early and very unrealistic to put him in that class of backs. OJ and Earl are All-Time elite level backs and Ricky had his moments where he looked liked he belonged in that group as well. Ajayi has had 3 or 4 great games. I need to see 3 or 4 great seasons to put at RIcky level... and that's still not near Earl Campbell and OJ.

 

[Pandarilla]

I disagree about Landry's route running. I think he's pretty good in that area and is far from unpolished. However, I agree that Ajayi isn't in the same class as Ricky, OJ or Earl Campbell. I think it way to early and very unrealistic to put him in that class of backs. OJ and Earl are All-Time elite level backs and Ricky had his moments where he looked liked he belonged in that group as well. Ajayi has had 3 or 4 great games. I need to see 3 or 4 great seasons to put at RIcky level... and that's still not near Earl Campbell and OJ.

Yup, Landry prides himself on precise route running.

I'm not betting against Ajayi, no way. It's the criteria that I have beef with. It's a new era in football and workhorse backs tend not to get fed enough carries with any consistency. With Landry, he'll never be big or fast enough to be viewed as a Star.

Last year made me a believer in Ajayi, but his college production is undeniably ridiculous.

 

[Sons Of Shula]

That was a poor article all the way around but I guess when you're struggling for clicks in the offseason that's the kind of crap that you've got to throw at the wall to so what sticks and what slides off. Most of that content is lying in a muddled puddle on the floor.

The knocks on Landry are out of pure ignorance. I'm not even going to bother addressing his assessment on Landry's route running; it's foolish. And the claims that he doesn't garner double teams are garbage takes from someone who's never bothered to watch. There are two defensive calls that I know off in particular which the Patriots used to double Landry out of our 11 personnel packages. Cover 1 Duece is a double team call on the slot WR b/w the nickel CB and the SS, and Cover 1 Switch is another where the nickel CB aligns over the slot but takes the near back and the "money" LB and the SS are in bracket coverage over the slot WR.

Landry might not be a fantasy football star in the sense that Brooks is touting but there's nothing "system" about him. Landry would excel in any current NFL offense.

Just looking elsewhere after a quick scroll, Winston isn't going to be a star either. You are either an accurate QB or you are not. Like Newton, Winston is an erratic and inconsistent passer who's accuracy will not improve which is why he throws many frustrating passes and INT's.

 

[gregorygrant83]

Just looking elsewhere after a quick scroll, Winston isn't going to be a star either. You are either an accurate QB or you are not. Like Newton, Winston is an erratic and inconsistent passer who's accuracy will not improve which is why he throws many frustrating passes and INT's.

I would argue Newton is a star. He might not be one of the top qbs in the league, but when he takes the field all eyes are on him and people do gravitate toward him. He's one of the bigger names in the game, even if his play isn't always deserving. And he makes enough plays through the air or with his feet that defenses have to be geared toward keeping him in check. Winston is solid but I'm not sure he reaches Cam level. I actually have Winston and a pre-injury Teddy Bridgewater as being pretty equal. Cam can look average for 57 minutes and then beat you in the final three, sort of like Andrew Luck.

 

[multistage]

Ajayi and Juice are simply system guys.

Yeah, this writer can go **** himself for being a dumbass.

 

[Sons Of Shula]

I would argue Newton is a star. He might not be one of the top qbs in the league, but when he takes the field all eyes are on him and people do gravitate toward him. He's one of the bigger names in the game, even if his play isn't always deserving. And he makes enough plays through the air or with his feet that defenses have to be geared toward keeping him in check. Winston is solid but I'm not sure he reaches Cam level. I actually have Winston and a pre-injury Teddy Bridgewater as being pretty equal.

I was just stating that Newton is an inaccurate and erratic passer not that he isn't a star in the league or a good QB.

Bridgewater is a much more accurate passer than Winston. The accuracy point sticks out to me b/c it's not something that can be coached. There are other factors that can offset that skill, but you either are - like Tannehill - or are not.

 

[gregorygrant83]

Just looking elsewhere after a quick scroll, Winston isn't going to be a star either. You are either an accurate QB or you are not. Like Newton, Winston is an erratic and inconsistent passer who's accuracy will not improve which is why he throws many frustrating passes and INT's.

I agree Newton and Winston can be very inaccurate. Any thoughts on why Andrew Luck % numbers are usually low considering he's a fairly accurate passed? Is it just a case of him trying to fit passes into small windows too often? Luck had a good year pasing in 2016 and had one of his best years comp % wise, but he's still sub .60% for his career. It's not like he makes a living stretching the field with deep passes.

 

[Sons Of Shula]

That was a poor article all the way around but I guess when you're struggling for clicks in the offseason that's the kind of crap that you've got to throw at the wall to so what sticks and what slides off. Most of that content is lying in a muddled puddle on the floor.

The knocks on Landry are out of pure ignorance. I'm not even going to bother addressing his assessment on Landry's route running; it's foolish. And the claims that he doesn't garner double teams are garbage takes from someone who's never bothered to watch. There are two defensive calls that I know off in particular which the Patriots used to double Landry out of our 11 personnel packages. Cover 1 Duece is a double team call on the slot WR b/w the nickel CB and the SS, and Cover 1 Switch is another where the nickel CB aligns over the slot but takes the near back and the "money" LB and the SS are in bracket coverage over the slot WR.

Landry might not be a fantasy football star in the sense that Brooks is touting but there's nothing "system" about him. Landry would excel in any current NFL offense.

Just looking elsewhere after a quick scroll, Winston isn't going to be a star either. You are either an accurate QB or you are not. Like Newton, Winston is an erratic and inconsistent passer who's accuracy will not improve which is why he throws many frustrating passes and INT's.

Photobucket now seems completely useless so excuse the Instagram video, but here are the two plays mentioned above that the Patriots use.

 

[Pandarilla]

That was a poor article all the way around but I guess when you're struggling for clicks in the offseason that's the kind of crap that you've got to throw at the wall to so what sticks and what slides off. Most of that content is lying in a muddled puddle on the floor.

The knocks on Landry are out of pure ignorance. I'm not even going to bother addressing his assessment on Landry's route running; it's foolish. And the claims that he doesn't garner double teams are garbage takes from someone who's never bothered to watch. There are two defensive calls that I know off in particular which the Patriots used to double Landry out of our 11 personnel packages. Cover 1 Duece is a double team call on the slot WR b/w the nickel CB and the SS, and Cover 1 Switch is another where the nickel CB aligns over the slot but takes the near back and the "money" LB and the SS are in bracket coverage over the slot WR.

Landry might not be a fantasy football star in the sense that Brooks is touting but there's nothing "system" about him. Landry would excel in any current NFL offense.

Just looking elsewhere after a quick scroll, Winston isn't going to be a star either. You are either an accurate QB or you are not. Like Newton, Winston is an erratic and inconsistent passer who's accuracy will not improve which is why he throws many frustrating passes and INT's.

I almost went off on Jameis, pointing to our week1 matchup.

But, dude, thank you for sounding off on this article. I needed to hear that...

 

[Sons Of Shula]

This is also a false explanation for Pattern Match coverage as well in his breakdown of CB Casey Hayward.

Instead of blanketing WR1s with a suffocating bump-and-run technique, he specializes in delivering splash plays as a "see ball, get ball" cornerback in a zone scheme that allows him to "pattern read" (recognize route combinations) from a distance.

Utilizing a traditional backpedal or a "bail" technique (side-shuffle), Hayward keeps enough distance between himself and the receiver to see the big picture and react accordingly based on the route combination. This makes him a perfect fit for a team that employs a lot of zone coverage because this allows a corner to play with vision on the quarterback instead of locking in on his man.

Zone is zone and Man is man, but Pattern Match is a both zone and man. It begins as zone until the recievers declare their routes, then once they do the defenders pick up their man. DB's are not watching the QB in this instance they are watching the receivers and more specifically for the routes to unfold and then locking onto a specific receiver in man coverage depending on the keys.

Here's an example of Pattern Match coverage called Red Raider by Michigan DC Don Brown.



Here's an even better example of Pattern Match. It's called Karate coverage and is used vs Empty formations where a "Kathy" technique is played to the 2 receiver side and a "Triangle" or "Box" technique is played to the trips side. Notice the amount of keys for each position and mainly the note at the bottom that calls for man coverage after routes are declared beyond 5 yards and the defender determines his reciever.

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

Wasn't Joe Montana considered a "systems" quarterback? Same could be said for Tom Brady.

Not sure what to think of that. If you run the "system" you are in to perfection aren't you a star player?

 

[finmann]

Wasn't Joe Montana considered a "systems" quarterback? Same could be said for Tom Brady.

Not sure what to think of that. If you run the "system" you are in to perfection aren't you a star player?

You stole my thunder...isn't Tom Brady the biggest system guy on the planet

 

[Sons Of Shula]

You stole my thunder...isn't Tom Brady the biggest system guy on the planet

Nah. Brady plays in a mutiple scheme offense. You really can't label him like Montana who played strictly in the the original West Coast offense.

 

[A500]

I really don't understand his thinking. He's saying Ajayi is a product of the zone blocking scheme. Zone blocking by the same oline that was rated in the bottom half of the league in run blocking and allowed less than a yard before contact.

But who knows, maybe he is right and the only reason Ajayi did so well is because the zone blocking scheme made it easier to lead the league in broken tackles and run after contact