Volin: Ryan Tannehill continues to impress | Page 2 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Volin: Ryan Tannehill continues to impress

Something I took notice of today again was that Marshall took reps for Vontae on the outside with the #1's on defense. CK and Hoops do you think this could be due to the fact that they want him to learn that position as well as Vontae learning to cover the slot receiver in nickle. If I recall last year Vontae covered Welker in the 2nd Pats game and pretty much shut him down in the first half. Then Vontae got hurt and Welker killed us in the 2nd half. Could Coyle be doing this to better prepare our DB's for tougher matchups in the slot ala Welker or even Hernandez? Just a thought.

Before I answer your question, I want to refer back to the tape you're talking about so that I can verify your impression of things in that game. I have some thoughts already but I want to make sure I've done my homework.

---------- Post added at 03:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:40 PM ----------

I can't wait to see us come out in a 3 TE set with 2 RB's. Then they could flex at least two TE's and a RB, Clay and probably Egnew as well as Bush. Those would be some serious mismatches against LB's no matter who you are playing.

It's a make or miss league though. Mismatches on paper don't always pay off the way you'd have thought. Have to finish the plays. We'll see.
 
Before I answer your question, I want to refer back to the tape you're talking about so that I can verify your impression of things in that game. I have some thoughts already but I want to make sure I've done my homework.

---------- Post added at 03:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:40 PM ----------



It's a make or miss league though. Mismatches on paper don't always pay off the way you'd have thought. Have to finish the plays. We'll see.

You definitely have to execute the play correctly to take advantage of mismatches. As of now, under Philben, I'm just happy to see that they are putting players in areas where they can create mismatches and giving them more of a chance to succeed. The offense dictating to what the defense has to do is something we haven't seen for quite awhile with this team. It gives you reason for hope, which is the exact opposite of seeing the Wildcat being run on 3rd and 8 from our opponents 25 yard line or play action pass on 3rd and 10+.
 
minnphin i think marshall is getting looks in vontaes place more to see what marshall has to offer as a starting boundary cb in the chance that sean smith is let go after this season...there may be some shifting vontae inside to the nickle aspects with that also against teams like the pats who have a legit slot wr...but i have heard that miami also signed richard marshall with the idea as a potential replacement to sean smith should he leave in free agency after this year...

it probably would make more sense if marshall was getting those reps in place of smith on the outside but maybe the dolphins don't want the media taking hold of anything with it by pulling vontae here and there...

whatever it is vontae is a must resign starting cb whenever his time comes up on his contract...he's the only legitimate guy who could shut down half the field on this team...he's commanding $10 mil per all day long in free agency if he gets there...miami can't afford to lose him
 
Re Fasano on the outside... it's all about match ups and how the d reacts.... do they keep a CB outside on Fasano therefore leaving a OLB on a Slot WR.. say Pruitt with all that alleged speed? which then potentially puts the number 3 on an Inside/Middle backer.. that could be the likes of Clay/Bush/Miller...

And if a Defense puts an OLB/SS outside on Fasano, then you know where the ball's going... 'outside'!

It's all about match-ups... and, one of my favourite things to do as a OC... 'Dictate to the defence' what's going on...

they're not gonna do that...you'll see a safety or a lb stepping out with fasano when he lines up that wide...most nfl teams aren't gonna fret covering fasano that wide with a safety or a lb...i wouldn't...i guess you could catch them in some bad package personnel and maybe get something like that once or twice but as soon as teams see it and have it on tape they'll adjust accordingly...if they feel they need to with fasano...which i doubt
 
when teams crap their pants is when you line up a jermichael finley that wide...lbs can't stay with him out there and safetys can't handle his size and athleticism...any one on one matchup with j finley like that is an auto attack...it's an easy man read and pitch and catch

thats what michael egnew is supposed to be here with all his great workout #'s and high draft status...your flexed out mismatch...not anthony fasano...i wish i could see it with egnew but i don't...
 
Last edited by a moderator:
minnphin i think marshall is getting looks in vontaes place more to see what marshall has to offer as a starting boundary cb in the chance that sean smith is let go after this season...there may be some shifting vontae inside to the nickle aspects with that also against teams like the pats who have a legit slot wr...but i have heard that miami also signed richard marshall with the idea as a potential replacement to sean smith should he leave in free agency after this year...

it probably would make more sense if marshall was getting those reps in place of smith on the outside but maybe the dolphins don't want the media taking hold of anything with it by pulling vontae here and there...

whatever it is vontae is a must resign starting cb whenever his time comes up on his contract...he's the only legitimate guy who could shut down half the field on this team...he's commanding $10 mil per all day long in free agency if he gets there...miami can't afford to lose him

Is Vontae's contract up after this season? He is one of the top players I do not want to lose AT ALL. Our secondary would be **** without him
 
You definitely have to execute the play correctly to take advantage of mismatches. As of now, under Philben, I'm just happy to see that they are putting players in areas where they can create mismatches and giving them more of a chance to succeed. The offense dictating to what the defense has to do is something we haven't seen for quite awhile with this team. It gives you reason for hope, which is the exact opposite of seeing the Wildcat being run on 3rd and 8 from our opponents 25 yard line or play action pass on 3rd and 10+.

Back to the issue of Vontae, I just wanted to make sure I remembered this right because it would be a disservice to disagree with you without being sure. I did not recall Vontae being used in the way that you describe. He was strictly right perimeter the entire half. He had right field and Smith had left field.

The "shutting down" of Wes Welker in the first half is a bit of a misrepresentation. He was targeted seven times so trust me when I say he was getting some opportunities against our defensive game plan. He has two catches for 20 yards which is bad for him. But if you look at it, three of the incompletions in that first half were just all Tom Brady's fault as he had what was really a terrible half for him. He was off all over the place. I remember that, it was very strange seeing him play so poorly. There were definitely three catches in there that could have been had for medium yardage, maybe more.

One attempt in Welker's direction was broken up by Vontae. This was not any special game planning or moving around of Davis though. Welker was lined up as the perimeter receiver to Vontae's side. He was a little tighter to the formation, but either way in the Dolphins' zone scheme that put Vontae on him. The formationing led to a secondary audible where Vontae played off, Tom Brady threw the ball a touch late on a curl pattern and Vontae closed on it, broke it up. Another play Sean Smith broke up with excellent coverage. Again, Welker lines up as the outermost receiver to Smith's side, he draws the coverage. What Smith did was just jam the ever loving **** out of Welker then used his long arms to go through him and break up the ball.

Other plays, Welker was covered pretty well by combinations of Will Allen (who was our slot corner) and Kevin Burnett. When Yeremiah Bell had to cover him, he really did a poor job, and those were some of the plays where you saw Welker either caught the ball or was open and Brady threw off target.

As for why sub out Vontae Davis for Richard Marshall, I think you've got to take this one at face value. Either Vontae Davis is a little nicked up and they have to regulate his reps, or they're a little unhappy with him and they want to see how Richard Marshall looks on the perimeter. Sean Smith has been a top performer during the OTAs and Mini Camp along with Training Camp thus far, and he supposedly did a really good job with the off season weight and conditioning program, so that could be why you don't necessarily see him subbed out for Marshall.
 
Is Vontae's contract up after this season? He is one of the top players I do not want to lose AT ALL. Our secondary would be **** without him

i wanna say thru this year and next...but you better not let this kid hit free agency...cause suitors will come a callin...and with big money
 
Something I took notice of today again was that Marshall took reps for Vontae on the outside with the #1's on defense. CK and Hoops do you think this could be due to the fact that they want him to learn that position as well as Vontae learning to cover the slot receiver in nickle. If I recall last year Vontae covered Welker in the 2nd Pats game and pretty much shut him down in the first half. Then Vontae got hurt and Welker killed us in the 2nd half. Could Coyle be doing this to better prepare our DB's for tougher matchups in the slot ala Welker or even Hernandez? Just a thought.
This very well could be the scenario that plays out over the course of the season. It seemed to work in that 2nd NE game. Given that Coyle has a reputation of DB development, this is a good sign IMO.
 
i read conflicting reports that sean smith put on muscle and then i heard that he lost 17 lbs...i'd be more a fan with his body type if it was the latter...help with some of his quickness and balance

i have to say that i thought jonathon martin would be getting destroyed by cam wake in camp but i'm pleasantly surprised to hear that he's been pretty solid...if you can keep cam wake at bay you can handle a lot of nfl edge rushers...maybe that strength or lack of isn't as big a deal as i thought...a part of me wonders though if cam wake might be going thru the motions a little in camp saving some spice for the games...
 
i read conflicting reports that sean smith put on muscle and then i heard that he lost 17 lbs...i'd be more a fan with his body type if it was the latter...help with some of his quickness and balance

You realize you can lean out and still put on muscle right?

For Smith, putting on muscle would be good for him. He was very soft prior to this offseason.
 
Vontae's contract expires next season.

Anyways he will be resigned before Smith if it came down to it.. but Smith is performing better than expected, and I think Marshall taking snaps from Vontae are from the fact Davis is limping a tad. Go watch Pouncey's interview on miamidolphins.com and you'll see him in the background limping.

---------- Post added at 05:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:03 PM ----------

i read conflicting reports that sean smith put on muscle and then i heard that he lost 17 lbs...i'd be more a fan with his body type if it was the latter...help with some of his quickness and balance

i have to say that i thought jonathon martin would be getting destroyed by cam wake in camp but i'm pleasantly surprised to hear that he's been pretty solid...if you can keep cam wake at bay you can handle a lot of nfl edge rushers...maybe that strength or lack of isn't as big a deal as i thought...a part of me wonders though if cam wake might be going thru the motions a little in camp saving some spice for the games...

Omar actually today said that about Wake, doesnt do what he does in games, but that is Omar. So who knows.
 
I have a tendency to doubt the idea that they're going to have Vontae be the slot guy instead of Marshall. The slot is known as something of a specialty for Marshall, and it's why he is here. The Dolphins needed a slot corner with the departure of Will Allen (who I thought did a great job in 2011, underrated).

The reports we've hard haven't (to my understanding) noted that Marshall is out on the perimeter while Vontae is moving inward to the slot. They've just been Marshall hawking reps from Vontae. And again I'd take that at face value, with Vontae either a little banged up and needing some breaks, or the Dolphins thinking about rotating the two a little especially based on individual game matchups.

At some point you could see Vontae start to get some work in the slot but I would consider that nothing more than preparation for eventualities. We should have more than one corner who is capable of playing the slot. If Nolan Carroll/Jonathan Wade/Quinten Lawrence/Vince Agnew can't do that then either Vontae or Sean better be able to and I'd rather Vontae than Sean, unless it's a tight end.
 
i read conflicting reports that sean smith put on muscle and then i heard that he lost 17 lbs...i'd be more a fan with his body type if it was the latter...help with some of his quickness and balance

i have to say that i thought jonathon martin would be getting destroyed by cam wake in camp but i'm pleasantly surprised to hear that he's been pretty solid...if you can keep cam wake at bay you can handle a lot of nfl edge rushers...maybe that strength or lack of isn't as big a deal as i thought...a part of me wonders though if cam wake might be going thru the motions a little in camp saving some spice for the games...

In a way I hear you, it's surprising, just because of how GOOD Cam Wake is...but at the same time, haven't we been sitting here saying since the day he was drafted that speed isn't his problem, strength is? Cam Wake may have strength but he doesn't have mass. There's a possibility that Martin is just matched individually well against Cam Wake.

---------- Post added at 05:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:07 PM ----------

Vontae's contract expires next season.

Anyways he will be resigned before Smith if it came down to it.. but Smith is performing better than expected, and I think Marshall taking snaps from Vontae are from the fact Davis is limping a tad. Go watch Pouncey's interview on miamidolphins.com and you'll see him in the background limping.

That kind of confirms my instincts on the matter...either injury or performance related.
 
I doubt its performace related. That would be huge if it was. And I haven't heard or read anything about him struggling at all.
 
Back
Top Bottom