I apologize, this is something I had been working on a couple of weeks ago and it is unfinished, but another post (the one about the Ravens receivers) sparked my memory about this, so decided to just post the rough, incomplete draft I have on my desktop.
Unfortunately, I have gotten busy at work, so can't really put alot of time into finishing it. Please feel free to make any additions or whatever you guys like. Y'all may wanna add some things such as possible trade partners and such. :)
---------------------
I've been thinking alot lately about the value of some of our players that are on the "bubble" so to speak.
You know, the guys that arent shoe-ins for a starting job or a fairly safe bet to make the 53-man roster, but maybe a bit too good or have too much potential to risk sticking them on the practice squad.
Unlike recent years, we find ourselves in a tough position to be in. Our talent levels are getting high enough in certain positions that we must face the prospect of losing some quality players.
Granted, putting guys on the IR, PUP list, or even the practice squad is one way to go, but each of those faces risks, particularly the PS, as teams can poach our guys off the PS.
A team that might be hot on a certain player, or need depth at a certain position, may not want to risk playing the waiver wire game and getting beat to the punch by a team with a higher waiver priority, enabling us to trade some of these guys for value (either picks or players), rather than just losing their rights outright.
This way we can use those players or picks to bolster some of our weaker areas depthwise, such as O-line, Front 3 (particularly NT), etc..
As much as I would like to evaluate every position and player, I just don't have the time to discuss them all right now, but please, feel free to make additions if anyone would like. For now though, I would jus tlike to focus on some of the more contested positions such as WR, CB, S, TE, etc..
So this thread is more to get a guage of the value some of our "bubble" guys may have as we get closer to September.
To start us off, lets look at the WR position. We are blessed and cursed (or so it seems) to have a number of solid prospects at WR, but unsure if we have that "True #1" guy.
In bold will be the guys that are clearly starters and unlikely to be cut or moved to the PS (at least in my opinion.)
Ted Ginn - He's a lock.
Devon Bess - Ditto, they seem really high on him this year.
Pat Turner - I'd also label him a lock barring disaster. BP and Co. isnt in the business of wasting 3rd round draft picks, BUT stranger things have happend. Experts felt he was a reach in the draft, so on that alone I'd rate him at 4th round pick value if we had to deal him away.
Greg Camarillo - Part of me says he starts, the other part is worried as he is coming off an injury and am unsure whether he gives us anything more than what Hartline and/or Armstrong bring to the table. I'd estimate his trade value would be a low 4th to 5th round pick to a team in need of a slot WR.
----------------------------------------
Brian Hartline - Less of a sure thing than Turner, but a strong showing by him at TC could make Camarillo expendable. He might not slide to the PS without being claimed, so I'd put a 5th-6th round pick value on him.
Brandon London - Didnt show much at WR last year, but played alot of special teams. They are high on him, and know a few teams that are also keeping an eye on him. Similar to how we stole him from the Giants, he may be swiped from us. His height seperates him from many of our other receivers (witht he exception of Turner and Wilford). Might be worth anywhere from a 5th round pick to a 7th rounder, keep in mind, he was an UDFA.
Ernest Wilford - Big contract, apparently a poor work ethic, possibly being transitioned to TE. I'm not sure Wilford has any trade value atm. However, prepping Wilford at TE may be an indicator we are going to make a move at TE and need him as a stop-gap. (Who knows? Martin and Fasano are in the last year of their contracts)
Anthony Armstrong - Great speed and getting rave reviews at OTAs. Not sure he will maintain that speed in pads, but a strong showing by armstrong at TC would put the crunch on guys like Camarillo, Hartline, and London for sure. Another UDFA, might be a guy we can stash on the PS without much worry, but if we had to move him, I'd think he would be worth a 6th or 7th rounder pick.
-----------------------------------------
Brennan Marion - I think he is injured, I'm sure someone could clear that up. If not, and we can't stick him on the PUP, he should make the PS, I'm not sure teams have gotten a good chance to look at him much this season. Probably 7th round pick value.
Chris Williams - I havent heard enough about him frankly. Likely no trade value at all, please correct me if I'm wrong though.
-----------------------------------------
Of all the listed WRs, Wilford has the most NFL experience at 6 years. Camarillo is next at 4, with Ginn right behind him at 3.
Amazing how young we really are at WR, and these guys all have room to grow.
If we are going with 5 WRs on the final roster, we will be losing some quality young talent. Even if we go to 6, we have tough decisions to make. Hopefully we can get some kind of value for a few of these kids, rather than just cutting them loose.
Tying into the WR position, thanks to Ernest “goes to camp” Wilford, we should also look at the TE position.
Anthony Fasano – Lock. There are certain guys that BP becomes attached to (Curtis Martin, Drew Bledsoe, etc…) Fasano is one of those guys. Despite being in a contract year I would have to believe he is staying put. (Assuming BP doesn’t leave us after this year)
David Martin - Not a lock. Granted, he had a fantastic year last year, but he is injured for one, for two – he is also in a contract year. It is much more likely than not that he stays, but if we are looking to bring along Nalbone and Haynos, we will need room. Not to mention, Wilford may be working out at TE as a stop-gap until those guys are ready as starters. Might be worth as high as a 4th round pick.
Joey Haynos – Will be in competition with Nalbone for a roster spot. They love his size (6’7” – 6’8”). Not much of a track record, but I’d imagine he might be worth at least a 7th round pick if we had to move him.
John Nalbone – Havent heard all that much about him in rookie camp and OTAs. Might be able to slide to the PS unnoticed, trade value can’t be more than the late 5th we used to draft him at this point.
Next lets look at the Defensive Backs, starting at Safety. Safety doesn’t seem as clogged up as some of the other positions, unless we are looking to move a CB to S.
Yeremiah Bell - Lock, but…he is getting older. 31 now and had an Achilles injury 2 years ago, might slow him down. If we were to trade him I could see maybe a late 3rd or 4th for him.
Gibril Wilson – Lock as well. Tough to see us cutting him or trading him this soon, but his name is marketable and a lot of teams need secondary help. I’d value him at a solid 3rd round pick. (he also has a very favorable contract)
Chris Clemons – Lock. Drafted rookie that I can’t recall reading a bad thing about in OTAs. Team seems high on this kid. Can’t imagine them taking the risk of putting him on the PS.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tyrone Culver – Considering he just got a 2 year contract extension, I have a hard time thinking he will be cut. Not sure he has much trade value, 7th at best, certainly worth more to the team than that though.
Courtney Bryan – Not sure where we are going with him. I’d imagine he is on the bubble if we are looking to move a CB to safety. Not sure there is any trade value here, 7th rounder at best.
Ethan Kilmer – I don’t see any trade value here, and from what I have seen and heard, there is a wide margin between Kilmer and Culver. I don’t see any trade value, again, 7th at best.
--------------------------------------------------------
At corner we are going to have some decisions to make.
Will Allen – Lock. Signed a contract extension and by far, our best and most experienced corner. (For now.)
Vontae Davis – Lock. No way we risk sending our 1st pick to the PS. Not to mention, we have been hearing good reports about him.
Sean Smith – Lock. Ditto.
-----------------------------------
Eric Green – Likely our starter opposite Will Allen for the first half of the season. That said, if Davis and Smith progress faster than expected, Green may become expendable. Trade value may be as high as a 5th, or none whatsoever. He seems to be making Anthony Armstrong look unstoppable at times.
------------------------------------
Jason Allen – This thread is dedicated to him. 1st round pick, unlikely to be one of the top 4 corners on this team, unlikely to be one of the top 3 safeties on this team. Can his fragile mind handle another position switch if needed? Doubtful. He also commands a 1st round pick salary. (Not that encouraging considering we have UDFAs that bring a similar skill set to the table) That said, he has shown flashes. His name probably carries some trade value, I’d be happy if we could get a 4th rounder for him, cause wasting a first round pick makes the baby Jesus cry.
Nate Jones – Another guy that showed flashes last year but nothing we can rely on in a starting role. He does have the added bonus of a cheaper contract than Allen. Might be worth a 6th or 7th at best.
---------------------------------------------
Joey Thomas and Will Billingsley - Big drop-off from the Green/Allen/Jones battle. Unlikely to have any trade value.
---------------------------------------------
Unfortunately, I have gotten busy at work, so can't really put alot of time into finishing it. Please feel free to make any additions or whatever you guys like. Y'all may wanna add some things such as possible trade partners and such. :)
---------------------
I've been thinking alot lately about the value of some of our players that are on the "bubble" so to speak.
You know, the guys that arent shoe-ins for a starting job or a fairly safe bet to make the 53-man roster, but maybe a bit too good or have too much potential to risk sticking them on the practice squad.
Unlike recent years, we find ourselves in a tough position to be in. Our talent levels are getting high enough in certain positions that we must face the prospect of losing some quality players.
Granted, putting guys on the IR, PUP list, or even the practice squad is one way to go, but each of those faces risks, particularly the PS, as teams can poach our guys off the PS.
A team that might be hot on a certain player, or need depth at a certain position, may not want to risk playing the waiver wire game and getting beat to the punch by a team with a higher waiver priority, enabling us to trade some of these guys for value (either picks or players), rather than just losing their rights outright.
This way we can use those players or picks to bolster some of our weaker areas depthwise, such as O-line, Front 3 (particularly NT), etc..
As much as I would like to evaluate every position and player, I just don't have the time to discuss them all right now, but please, feel free to make additions if anyone would like. For now though, I would jus tlike to focus on some of the more contested positions such as WR, CB, S, TE, etc..
So this thread is more to get a guage of the value some of our "bubble" guys may have as we get closer to September.
To start us off, lets look at the WR position. We are blessed and cursed (or so it seems) to have a number of solid prospects at WR, but unsure if we have that "True #1" guy.
In bold will be the guys that are clearly starters and unlikely to be cut or moved to the PS (at least in my opinion.)
Ted Ginn - He's a lock.
Devon Bess - Ditto, they seem really high on him this year.
Pat Turner - I'd also label him a lock barring disaster. BP and Co. isnt in the business of wasting 3rd round draft picks, BUT stranger things have happend. Experts felt he was a reach in the draft, so on that alone I'd rate him at 4th round pick value if we had to deal him away.
Greg Camarillo - Part of me says he starts, the other part is worried as he is coming off an injury and am unsure whether he gives us anything more than what Hartline and/or Armstrong bring to the table. I'd estimate his trade value would be a low 4th to 5th round pick to a team in need of a slot WR.
----------------------------------------
Brian Hartline - Less of a sure thing than Turner, but a strong showing by him at TC could make Camarillo expendable. He might not slide to the PS without being claimed, so I'd put a 5th-6th round pick value on him.
Brandon London - Didnt show much at WR last year, but played alot of special teams. They are high on him, and know a few teams that are also keeping an eye on him. Similar to how we stole him from the Giants, he may be swiped from us. His height seperates him from many of our other receivers (witht he exception of Turner and Wilford). Might be worth anywhere from a 5th round pick to a 7th rounder, keep in mind, he was an UDFA.
Ernest Wilford - Big contract, apparently a poor work ethic, possibly being transitioned to TE. I'm not sure Wilford has any trade value atm. However, prepping Wilford at TE may be an indicator we are going to make a move at TE and need him as a stop-gap. (Who knows? Martin and Fasano are in the last year of their contracts)
Anthony Armstrong - Great speed and getting rave reviews at OTAs. Not sure he will maintain that speed in pads, but a strong showing by armstrong at TC would put the crunch on guys like Camarillo, Hartline, and London for sure. Another UDFA, might be a guy we can stash on the PS without much worry, but if we had to move him, I'd think he would be worth a 6th or 7th rounder pick.
-----------------------------------------
Brennan Marion - I think he is injured, I'm sure someone could clear that up. If not, and we can't stick him on the PUP, he should make the PS, I'm not sure teams have gotten a good chance to look at him much this season. Probably 7th round pick value.
Chris Williams - I havent heard enough about him frankly. Likely no trade value at all, please correct me if I'm wrong though.
-----------------------------------------
Of all the listed WRs, Wilford has the most NFL experience at 6 years. Camarillo is next at 4, with Ginn right behind him at 3.
Amazing how young we really are at WR, and these guys all have room to grow.
If we are going with 5 WRs on the final roster, we will be losing some quality young talent. Even if we go to 6, we have tough decisions to make. Hopefully we can get some kind of value for a few of these kids, rather than just cutting them loose.
Tying into the WR position, thanks to Ernest “goes to camp” Wilford, we should also look at the TE position.
Anthony Fasano – Lock. There are certain guys that BP becomes attached to (Curtis Martin, Drew Bledsoe, etc…) Fasano is one of those guys. Despite being in a contract year I would have to believe he is staying put. (Assuming BP doesn’t leave us after this year)
David Martin - Not a lock. Granted, he had a fantastic year last year, but he is injured for one, for two – he is also in a contract year. It is much more likely than not that he stays, but if we are looking to bring along Nalbone and Haynos, we will need room. Not to mention, Wilford may be working out at TE as a stop-gap until those guys are ready as starters. Might be worth as high as a 4th round pick.
Joey Haynos – Will be in competition with Nalbone for a roster spot. They love his size (6’7” – 6’8”). Not much of a track record, but I’d imagine he might be worth at least a 7th round pick if we had to move him.
John Nalbone – Havent heard all that much about him in rookie camp and OTAs. Might be able to slide to the PS unnoticed, trade value can’t be more than the late 5th we used to draft him at this point.
Next lets look at the Defensive Backs, starting at Safety. Safety doesn’t seem as clogged up as some of the other positions, unless we are looking to move a CB to S.
Yeremiah Bell - Lock, but…he is getting older. 31 now and had an Achilles injury 2 years ago, might slow him down. If we were to trade him I could see maybe a late 3rd or 4th for him.
Gibril Wilson – Lock as well. Tough to see us cutting him or trading him this soon, but his name is marketable and a lot of teams need secondary help. I’d value him at a solid 3rd round pick. (he also has a very favorable contract)
Chris Clemons – Lock. Drafted rookie that I can’t recall reading a bad thing about in OTAs. Team seems high on this kid. Can’t imagine them taking the risk of putting him on the PS.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tyrone Culver – Considering he just got a 2 year contract extension, I have a hard time thinking he will be cut. Not sure he has much trade value, 7th at best, certainly worth more to the team than that though.
Courtney Bryan – Not sure where we are going with him. I’d imagine he is on the bubble if we are looking to move a CB to safety. Not sure there is any trade value here, 7th rounder at best.
Ethan Kilmer – I don’t see any trade value here, and from what I have seen and heard, there is a wide margin between Kilmer and Culver. I don’t see any trade value, again, 7th at best.
--------------------------------------------------------
At corner we are going to have some decisions to make.
Will Allen – Lock. Signed a contract extension and by far, our best and most experienced corner. (For now.)
Vontae Davis – Lock. No way we risk sending our 1st pick to the PS. Not to mention, we have been hearing good reports about him.
Sean Smith – Lock. Ditto.
-----------------------------------
Eric Green – Likely our starter opposite Will Allen for the first half of the season. That said, if Davis and Smith progress faster than expected, Green may become expendable. Trade value may be as high as a 5th, or none whatsoever. He seems to be making Anthony Armstrong look unstoppable at times.
------------------------------------
Jason Allen – This thread is dedicated to him. 1st round pick, unlikely to be one of the top 4 corners on this team, unlikely to be one of the top 3 safeties on this team. Can his fragile mind handle another position switch if needed? Doubtful. He also commands a 1st round pick salary. (Not that encouraging considering we have UDFAs that bring a similar skill set to the table) That said, he has shown flashes. His name probably carries some trade value, I’d be happy if we could get a 4th rounder for him, cause wasting a first round pick makes the baby Jesus cry.
Nate Jones – Another guy that showed flashes last year but nothing we can rely on in a starting role. He does have the added bonus of a cheaper contract than Allen. Might be worth a 6th or 7th at best.
---------------------------------------------
Joey Thomas and Will Billingsley - Big drop-off from the Green/Allen/Jones battle. Unlikely to have any trade value.
---------------------------------------------
.