zach thomas better than ray lewis? | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

zach thomas better than ray lewis?

Rick Cartman

It is what it is
Joined
Apr 26, 2008
Messages
4,981
Reaction score
5,214
Location
South Park, Colorado
i know all this talk about ray lewis being the best linebacker of this generation, but why? besides sacks and int zach has ray lewis beat in every stat and they both came into the league in '96, maybe zach should of ran his mouth more so espn would talk about him more.
 
i know all this talk about ray lewis being the best linebacker of this generation, but why? besides sacks and int zach has ray lewis beat in every stat and they both came into the league in '96, maybe zach should of ran his mouth more so espn would talk about him more.


I do think that Zach was every bit as good as Ray Lewis and that he gets alot more attention because he is an attention whore.
 
If I'm the GM building a team and both are available, I'm taking Zach. As much because of class as talent.
 
If I'm the GM building a team and both are available, I'm taking Zach. As much because of class as talent.

Zach was a very good player for a long time and Miami built a D around him and never even made a AFC Title Game- never even came close. The Ravens built a D around Ray Lewis and won a Super Bowl.

I'm not taking a shot at Zach but Lewis has been the better player for most of their careers, Lewis is a lock HOfer while Zach is not making the HOF unless he has a really good year or 2 in dallas and Dallas wins it all.
 
Zach was a very good player for a long time and Miami built a D around him and never even made a AFC Title Game- never even came close. The Ravens built a D around Ray Lewis and won a Super Bowl.

I'm not taking a shot at Zach but Lewis has been the better player for most of their careers, Lewis is a lock HOfer while Zach is not making the HOF unless he has a really good year or 2 in dallas and Dallas wins it all.


Baltimore over an extended amount of time has been a more talent laden defense. The only reason Lewis is a lock is because of the one super bowl.
Both guys should be locks but someguys get overlooked due to rea, achievements.
 
Baltimore over an extended amount of time has been a more talent laden defense. The only reason Lewis is a lock is because of the one super bowl.
Both guys should be locks but someguys get overlooked due to rea, achievements.

The Dolphins were loaded talent wise on D but their 2 best players were not big game players. Ray Lewis and his D carried Baltimore to a SB Title and Ray won SB MVP while Zach was never close to an AFC Title Game.
 
The Dolphins were loaded talent wise on D but their 2 best players were not big game players. Ray Lewis and his D carried Baltimore to a SB Title and Ray won SB MVP while Zach was never close to an AFC Title Game.


The dolphins have not been good enough to be in many big games. That so called big game defense has only showed up one year for the Ravens for all thier hype. At least the Ravens have had some semblance of an offense at times. Miami always sent teams with big deficiencies to the playoffs. Usually mediocre qbing and a mediocre run games. The one year we had a good chance with Ricky , Wanny and our OC completely blew a game versus NE that would have got us in playoffs. Let me see, you have the best back in the league with the clock winding down and you throw it every down. Worst playcalling series in our history.
 
I've been to a few Ravens' games, and I'd have to say that he gets his team psyched up. On the field, I take Zach. Before games and on the sidelines, I take Ray.
 
I've been to a few Ravens' games, and I'd have to say that he gets his team psyched up. On the field, I take Zach. Before games and on the sidelines, I take Ray.


You can try and psyche up David Martin all you like and he will still suck lol.
 
The dolphins have not been good enough to be in many big games. That so called big game defense has only showed up one year for the Ravens for all thier hype. At least the Ravens have had some semblance of an offense at times. Miami always sent teams with big deficiencies to the playoffs. Usually mediocre qbing and a mediocre run games. The one year we had a good chance with Ricky , Wanny and our OC completely blew a game versus NE that would have got us in playoffs. Let me see, you have the best back in the league with the clock winding down and you throw it every down. Worst playcalling series in our history.


He played on many good teams in the late 90s-early '00s and his D's were usually very highly ranked then come big games down the stretch and playoff games they'd fold. Lewis only led Bal to one Super Bowl but that's 1 more than Zach ever played in and even after they tore down the SB D they rebuilt around Ray and won 2 more division titles.

In 2000 Baltimore was 14th in points scored scoring 333 points, in Miami in '99 their O scored 326- was it the extra 7 points that put Baltimore over the hump? In '00 Miami scored 323, in '01 344, '02 378 so they had O's as good as Baltimore's '00 offense yet never came close to an AFC Title Game. A week after Miami lost at oak 27-0 the Ravens went into Oakland and held the Raiders to 3 points. That's actually a common theme.

Playoff losses for Miami, points allowed by D and what their opponent di the following week:

1997: lost 17-3, the next week NE scored just 6 points. I cannot fault their D for this loss.

1998: lost 38-3 at Denver, the next week Den was held to 23 and that was w/ 6 turnovers they forced against the Jets.

1999: Lost to Jax 62-7, the next week Jax lost at home 33-14.

2000: Lost to oak 27-0, the next week Oak scores 3 in a 16-3 loss.

2001: Lost to Ray and the Ravens 20-3(Ray's D was facing an O that was 8th in the NFL scoring 344 points while Zach's D faced the 18th ranked O sthat scored 303 points), The Ravens lost the next week 27-10.


zach and his D's had multiple chances to make a mark in January but they very rarely played well while Ray led his team to a Super Bowl title and won a SB MVP.
 
The Dolphins were loaded talent wise on D but their 2 best players were not big game players. Ray Lewis and his D carried Baltimore to a SB Title and Ray won SB MVP while Zach was never close to an AFC Title Game.

Another thread about a current/former Phin's worth, another idiotic attempt from the always in denial Dolphins' Junky.

As far as the topic, both players were among the best at their positions and are deserving of the Hall.
 
He played on many good teams in the late 90s-early '00s and his D's were usually very highly ranked then come big games down the stretch and playoff games they'd fold. Lewis only led Bal to one Super Bowl but that's 1 more than Zach ever played in and even after they tore down the SB D they rebuilt around Ray and won 2 more division titles.

In 2000 Baltimore was 14th in points scored scoring 333 points, in Miami in '99 their O scored 326- was it the extra 7 points that put Baltimore over the hump? In '00 Miami scored 323, in '01 344, '02 378 so they had O's as good as Baltimore's '00 offense yet never came close to an AFC Title Game. A week after Miami lost at oak 27-0 the Ravens went into Oakland and held the Raiders to 3 points. That's actually a common theme.

Playoff losses for Miami, points allowed by D and what their opponent di the following week:

1997: lost 17-3, the next week NE scored just 6 points. I cannot fault their D for this loss.

1998: lost 38-3 at Denver, the next week Den was held to 23 and that was w/ 6 turnovers they forced against the Jets.

1999: Lost to Jax 62-7, the next week Jax lost at home 33-14.

2000: Lost to oak 27-0, the next week Oak scores 3 in a 16-3 loss.

2001: Lost to Ray and the Ravens 20-3(Ray's D was facing an O that was 8th in the NFL scoring 344 points while Zach's D faced the 18th ranked O sthat scored 303 points), The Ravens lost the next week 27-10.


zach and his D's had multiple chances to make a mark in January but they very rarely played well while Ray led his team to a Super Bowl title and won a SB MVP.


You do realize our offense only scored a total of 15 points in those games thats 5 points a game. If an offense is constantly going three and out no defense will win a game for anybody. Ray Lewis would have done no better in a dolphin uniform with offensive performances like that. If your offense does not move the ball after a while any defense will fold.


I will go over these games you mention


1997 versus NE

Our leading rusher had 22 yards and Marino had a dreadful day 17 of 43 2 int

Our defense held Bledose to 139 yards passing and under 4 yards a carry

We held to 7 points a half time

lost 17-3

1998 versus Denver

Ran into a very good Denver team and nobody stopped Terrel Davis in the playoffs

Offense was not good once again. Marino 2 int and our leading rusher had 14 yards. If offense had played better the score would have been very differant and defense would have been on field less.

1999 versus Jacksonville

Defense played very good previous week versus Seattle

We got beat bad and I think this performance was a combination of many things.

Our offense turned the ball over 7 times, established no running game 10 yards was our high. we gained 131 total yards. Dan marino did not have his first completion until the team was down 38-0.

Our defense was not good but the score is quite bloated due to how inept our offense was.

An alltime low.

2000
Beat a pretty good Indy team previous week
Held them to 17 points when they had been averaging much more

versus Oakland
First touchdown was a pick six by Jay Fielder for 90 yards

Defense held Gannon to 143 yards
and thier leading rusher only had 56 yards

On the other hand Fielder threw 3 picks no tds and our leading rusher
had 12 yards. Yea the defense is to blame for this one lol.

2001

versus Balt

we held Balt to 7 points in first half , unfortunately they held us to 3 for game.

We passed for 122 yards and fielder was our leading rusher with 16 yards
1 int.

Our defense was not great in this one, baltimore ran real well but no defense can win with that type of offensive performance.

Baltimore might not have been an offensive juggernaught when they won but they did not turn the ball over much and had a consistent run game.

We had arguably the worst offensive performances of any team that made the playoffs and our running game was horrid in all those losses.

There is always much more to a game than a box score and if you examine those games closer our offense never gave our defense a chance.
 
Who does Zach have to kill to get some damn respect ???
 
The Dolphins were loaded talent wise on D but their 2 best players were not big game players. Ray Lewis and his D carried Baltimore to a SB Title and Ray won SB MVP while Zach was never close to an AFC Title Game.

So, because Zach played on teams with less talent, but has the same stats are Ray, he's not as good? That doesn't make sense to me. If Ray Lewis goes into the Hall of Fame, Zach Thomas should go also.
 
1998 versus Denver

Ran into a very good Denver team and nobody stopped Terrel Davis in the playoffs

Offense was not good once again. Marino 2 int and our leading rusher had 14 yards. If offense had played better the score would have been very differant and defense would have been on field less.

Jason Taylor and Tim Bowens, our 2 best DL missed this game to injury. Not quite playing with a full deck.
 
Back
Top Bottom