Calling Boomer and CK! | Page 5 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Calling Boomer and CK!

You've taken the time to write 10,000+ posts for sheep whose opinion doesn't count? :ponder:

Why?

I take all opinions in with respect...but like you and everyone else...I don't have to agree with them....thats why we're individuals...not a collective.
 
We see that now with Carey...don't we? Every Tackle has flaws...none are perfect. That why they have the term "a sack"! As long as the Dolphins will be a running team with the new offense...having a finese pass blocker isn't need as much. Look at F. Adams...no one will mistake him for a great pass blocker...but he's not there to be one...he's there to be a decent pass blocker and a great run blocker.

Adams went in the second round and was not considered a top prospect for that reason.

Why doesn't the same logic apply for Jake Long?
 
We see that now with Carey...don't we? Every Tackle has flaws...none are perfect. That why they have the term "a sack"! As long as the Dolphins will be a running team with the new offense...having a finese pass blocker isn't need as much. Look at F. Adams...no one will mistake him for a great pass blocker...but he's not there to be one...he's there to be a decent pass blocker and a great run blocker.

True.

If you don't mind a discussion with a sheep I have a question and some opinions.

So is that who you want with the number one overall? I think Jake will be a serviceable LT and a great RT, in time he could be a F Adams. I think he is the top tackle in the draft. I don't think he should be #1 overall.

I think Chris Long will be a game changer. I think Glen Dorsey will be a game changer, but doesn't fit with the Phins system now.
 
2 things; left tackles get 'beat' all the time. Doesn't mean to say they give up sacks. And secondly Jumbo Elliott played for Parcells 20 years ago.

I think it's fair to say that the speed and skill set of your average right rush end has changed just a little.

This is part of something I wrote in VIP yesterday.
I'm just finishing up my tape watching. I have 9 Bowl games to go. This morning, I watched the Florida-Michigan Bowl Game. I watched and re-watched every snap that Long took. He's a really good player, there's no doubt about that. His head is always on a swivel, he's often downfield trying to make blocks for Mike Hart. As a run blocker he's aggressive, he sinks his hips and re-directs. When he gets his hands on you it's over. He has excellent directional skills in that he can re-direct an end or a LB and clear them 4/5 yards out of the hole. But two things I noticed as a run blocker that I've noticed before in the numerous games of his that I've seen the past four years. It's just small stuff, but it's being repeated.

First, he has a tendency to let players back into plays by not finishing blocks properly. On the play where Mario Manningham took a reverse early in the 2nd half, ran to the nearside and then reversed his field and picked up about 20 yards, Long takes his defender to the ground and then instead of staying on him, he allows his man back into the play even before Manningham has turned back the other way. In fact, when Mario stops and turns back, the first player he encounters is Jake's man. Again in the 3rd quarter, on consecutive Mike Hart runs, he blocks Derrick Harvey out of the way, only for him to 'give up' on the block or to not finish and Harvey's back in the play and is in on the tackle from behind. I've seen this over and again with Jake. Not a lot, but enough for some concern.

Secondly, he has a tendency on running plays to get to the 2nd level almost TOO quickly. Again, it's not a ridiculous amount but I've seen it before. He blasts out and then is almost caught unawares and turns back to get a hand on the linebacker or the safety who have gone past him. In part, he's saved by his awareness and his long arms. But I don't want to see that from a potential #1 pick, especially in his area of expertise.

In pass pro he can be a wall. That's a big human being. I was actually a little disappointed with Derrick Harvey that he didn't offer him more moves. A number of times Harvey would try and bullrush Long; not going to happen. But there were three or four instances where Derrick's speed off the edge had Long worried. And it's the kickslide. And it's hands up and kick back and Harvey got under the pad level and got around Long. In fact, Harvey had to have been frustrated because on any given day that's a 3/4 sack game. Again, the arms just managed to reach back and re-direct. But he was flat out beat to the corner. Jake gets low in his stance when it's a pass, lower than normal. Low down, spring up and he gets tight in his hips with outside pressure and when Harvey got off the ball quicker, Jake's fighting with his arms and he's out of control.

I have a lot of questions about Jake. Is he really that much better? Is his value that good that means you can't get an Anthony Collins or a Sam Baker or a Carl Nicks and see a minimal drop off? The answer is no.
 
I take all opinions in with respect...but like you and everyone else...I don't have to agree with them....thats why we're individuals...not a collective.

Ok, fair enough.

Some people might consider being called a sheep beacuse of their opinion (however they came by it) disrespectfull. That's just my opinion though.
 
Ok, fair enough.

Some people might consider being called a sheep beacuse of their opinion (however they came by it) disrespectfull. That's just my opinion though.

If they as fans think on their own...and base their opinion on that...I appreciate it all. If they don't think on their own and only listen to a few...and base their opinion on that..they are no better than sheep. There's numerous ways to base ones opinion...and many different opinions out there for Draft fans...I like to listen to all points of view...I don't have to agree with them all..or even some..but I find it's the best way of coming up with a better choice.
 
Thanks Boomer, I appreciate the post. Where do you watch all this film??
 
2 things; left tackles get 'beat' all the time. Doesn't mean to say they give up sacks. And secondly Jumbo Elliott played for Parcells 20 years ago.

I think it's fair to say that the speed and skill set of your average right rush end has changed just a little.

This is part of something I wrote in VIP yesterday.

Boomer all nice...but, I guarantee this...you won't find a perfect LT. They all have good sides and bad sides to them.
The most important issue are these...is J. Long the most ready Tackle in this draft...when you look at all the film...and you look at the stats...the simple answer is yes.
Could there be a better tackle down the road...yes of course...but how many times have you thought that...only to be disapointed? May I remind you of Alabi...great movement, Size...hope for the future...now where is he? Can we afford to hope and pray a few more years...just to be cheap again? The problem with the past Dolphins are the same with fans...we look for the prospects instead of the players that can play now. I hope that will change.
 
None are perfect. That is true. But the art of the draft is evaluating each prospect's strengths and weaknesses and projecting how they may impact their ability to be successful at the next level.

I would argue that Jake Long's weaknesses will hinder him from being successful on the left side more than those weaknesses possessed by Jeff Otah and Ryan Clady.
 
None are perfect. That is true. But the art of the draft is evaluating each prospect's strengths and weaknesses and projecting how they may impact their ability to be successful at the next level.

I would argue that Jake Long's weaknesses will hinder him from being successful on the left side more than those weaknesses possessed by Jeff Otah and Ryan Clady.

The problem you have is this...you can't say that either will some day be a great LT. Your hoping again and as long as your hoping...why not hope for the guy who can play right now. If we still had Marino...I'd probably think like you...but we don't have Marino...we won't be throwing 60% of the time...if you know Parcells...he will have a running offense...and thats why it's more important to have a great LT that can clear the running lanes...than one that can always pass block.
 
Both Otah and Clady can play right now. I also believe both will be better than Long both right now and five years from now and ten years from now. Both have the tools to become great left tackles. I don't believe Long possesses those tools.

Also, you don't draft a left tackle who struggles as a pass blocker even if you are going to run the ball 60% of the time. It does not make sense. SHould we give up on the passing plays that make up the other 40%?
 
Both Otah and Clady can play right now. I also believe both will be better than Long both right now and five years from now and ten years from now. Both have the tools to become great left tackles. I don't believe Long possesses those tools.

Also, you don't draft a left tackle who struggles as a pass blocker even if you are going to run the ball 60% of the time. It does not make sense. SHould we give up on the passing plays that make up the other 40%?

This is getting silly now...it's not important what I, You or Boomer thinks...it's important what the Dolphins think and what they do.
 
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