QB Controversy Already Starting

[Noland]

Marino just kidding. I know most people would not agree but Garcia I know he is not young but he would have 3 to 4 years left. I don't care what anybody says west coast offense or not Garcia has proved himself to be a good qb.

 

[Jimmy James]

We already have a Jeff Garcia named Jay Fiedler. What is the logic in making that move?

 

[eltos_lightfoot]

Garcia is a brown. The point is moot.

 

[jetssuckSr]

We already have a Jeff Garcia named Jay Fiedler. What is the logic in making that move?

While I'm not a huge Garcia fan, that's not true......

Garcia ran a "pass first" offense, Fiedler would probably set an INT record in an offense like that.

The Fiedler fanatics once thought the same about Brady (Brady=Fiedler).

Ya don't hear that anymore do ya?

 

[Danikus]

I blame the team. They need to name a stater and stand by him unitl he gets beat out. This "open competition" crap has everyone unsure.

All they are doing is babying Fiedler.

Wow fin, I agree with you here!! I supported Fiedler in the past, but he has shown us his max. Name Feeley the starter and let Fiedler beat him out.

 

[Phinzone]

who would you suggest?

I said it a million times, and it rings true, if AJ flops, we're SOL for the next few seasons. It was a dumbass move to put all of our eggs in the basket of a QB that has a whole 5 QB starts. If he flops, we're out next year looking for a new QB, either over paying an over the hill vet, drafting a QB, and waiting for him to get groomed in, or taking another friggin long shot.

 

[Jimmy James]

While I'm not a huge Garcia fan, that's not true......

Garcia ran a "pass first" offense, Fiedler would probably set an INT record in an offense like that.

The Fiedler fanatics once thought the same about Brady (Brady=Fiedler).

Ya don't hear that anymore do ya?

He ran a pass first offense that is very dissimilar to any offense Jay has run while here. Look at Jay's stats from Jacksonville, and you'll see what I mean about us having a Garcia. Jeff wouldn't be successful in this system any more than Jay is, and we apparently can't change the system because we couldn't run Ricky as much otherwise according to the folks who didn't like the WCO suggestion.

 

[NathanHunt]

A few critical points that shouldn't be overlooked....

1) Matt Hasselbeck - annointed as a PreSeason GOD when he was in Green Bay. Holmgren took a big chance on a kid he knew. Brought him into a system he already knew. Paid him a bunch of money up front. Then groomed him with Trent Dilfer. Even after his first year of full starts, he didn't take. Now look where he is.

2) JF has A LOT of ALLIES on this team. Bringing in AJF and annoiting him the Starter, WITHOUT a competition and JF still on the roster, would have almost created a mutiny.
The competition is not just for the coaches' and FO's sake, it's for the team as well. The FO and coaches want AJF to PROVE himself worthy to the team. They want the team to embrace him. This is not an easy or quick process.

Remember, just as there are JF fans and AJF fans on this board and in FinLand, there are the same loyalists on the team. You can't afford alienating your team for no reason. I honestly think IF they thought AJF WAS THE GUY, they would have shipped JF out the door and NOT allowed him to come back. By keeping Jay, they are admitting they have their doubts and NEED a security blanket, JIC.

Look at the NYG situation. Collins' has his loyalist, BUT he's no longer there. So, no matter how angry the players get with the situation, they HAVE to move on. He's not there to support.

We don't have that luxury. Jay is still here and the situation could get a lot worse if things are not done delicately.

 

[philyphin]

I Love the fact they are having open competition, it makes sure the best guy gets the Job, whether it is Fiedler or Feeley, I want who ever can do the best Job for us and win us the most games. And that goes for all positions, I don't Care if your name is Jason Taylor, Patrick Surtain, Zach Thomas or Sage Rossenfels whoever can do the best Job put him in.

 

[nyrican]

:shakeno:

 

[jbond]

Fiedler
Brady

Year Team G GS Att Comp Pct Yards YPA Lg TD Int Tkld 20+ 40+ Rate
2003 Miami Dolphins 12 11 314 179 57.0 2138 6.81 59 11 13 19/126 35 2 72.4
2003 New England 16 16 527 317 60.2 3620 6.87 82 23 12 32/219 44 8 85.9

biggest differences I see are 1,500 less total yards, 9 less 20+ passes, 3.2% lower completion, and 12 less TDs. This after Jay missed 4 games (injured) in a run-oriented system with a crappy Oline and only 1 WR that could break free occasionally from double-coverage, and a defense that couldn't figure out if they were practicing, selling girl-scout cookies, or actually playing a game of football from one week to the next.

How big of a difference between Jay and Brady is there really? Does he 'marshall' his offense better? Is he more of a 'competitor'? Did the Pats defense do a better job more consistently keeping the O on the field? I have challenged for months anyone to prove to me that Jay lost more games for us then either 1) our Defense or 2) Davey boy / Turner's playcalling.......and no one has even attempted to and quite frankly 1) I don't think it can be done and 2) even if it could....i still like the tag '30 million to the starting defense, $13 million for the starting offense....you get what you pay for'....or whatever the figures actually were (#'s don't matter, the concept does).

My point? Do we need to upgrade our QB spot....heck yeah and I've always said that. Is that (or was it in FA/draft) my biggest concern or worry? Nope....

As for QB controversies......we have had that every year for 4 years now....We don't need anymore QBs. We have 3 of them now that are good enough to do what needs to be done if the Oline gets their act together and WRs can actually break free often enough for some of the passes thrown their way to be caught to help open up the running game in addition to the passing game.

 

[DolphinzD]

jbond, one crucial stat you could add would be 4th quarter QB rating in describing the difference between Brady and Fiedler. Brady almost always gets it done in crunch time.

NathanHunt, love the Hasselbeck comparison. We can only hope that Feeley will be somewhere near as good as Hasselbeck is now. I think that Trent Dilfer and Jay Fiedler are very similar quarterbacks. Both just win, but not necessarily win enough (with the exception of Baltimore's SB victory, but we all know that was because of Baltimore's D), and neither is spectacular in doing so. You have to cut the cord sometime.

 

[FinfanInBuffalo]

Look at the NYG situation. Collins' has his loyalist, BUT he's no longer there. So, no matter how angry the players get with the situation, they HAVE to move on. He's not there to support.

The Giants were only able to do this because they are in total rebuilding mode. If Manning doesn't pan out, they are more screwed than the Fins if Feeley doesn't pan out.

Hey, we could be the Chargers and be working on Franchise QB #3.....ouch

 

[jbond]

DolphinzD, yeah I know :) lol. DW's idea of 4th qtr. was run....run..run....either to try to keep the lead or to make us go to OT if we're lucky enough to tie it. The same could be said of our defense losing games in the last minutes or qtr. of the game. I've never said Jay's the greatest or all that nonsense. And although I think is one of the causes for our poor performance, I don't think he has been the biggest cause is all.

 

[jetssuckSr]

He ran a pass first offense that is very dissimilar to any offense Jay has run while here.

That's basically the gist of what I said, isn't it? If that's the case, then your comparison doesn't make any sense.

Look at Jay's stats from Jacksonville, and you'll see what I mean about us having a Garcia

JF started ONE game for Jville, there's no way you can use his stats from that year as a comparison sample.

Jeff wouldn't be successful in this system any more than Jay is,

Garcia is a better passer, period. JF could NEVER run a "pass first" offense. The results would be horrendous. What do you base your speculation of Garcia in this offense on? Arm strength? That's probably the only basis I can see.

and we apparently can't change the system because we couldn't run Ricky as much otherwise according to the folks who didn't like the WCO suggestion

I agree with those folks, however from recent articles it appears that the coaches are giving up on finding a QB to fit the system that best suits our "STAR" RB, instead opting to bastardize the offense to suit our QB. The problem being that a short passing game will do nothing to alleviate the congestion at the LOS. Been there, done that, home in January.

The only similarity between JF and Garcia is that both lack arm strength.