Senior Bowl Day 3 tweets

[j-off-her-doll]

Good for Sammie. It would have been wild to see that talent fall out of the 1st. I have it Cooper/White/Coates/. . . Parker. I do think White shows more consistency than Coates, but as it's been mentioned, no one can touch Coates' upside. Close Cooper through Coates, looking like 10-20 picks, with Parker looking more like a 20-32 guy to me.

 

[datruth55]

Thanks to Belichick and Brady I got nothing for my recording of the North practice...another reason to not like those two.

Watching the South practice red zone routes...Tyler Lockett put such a sick move on a DB he was open by 10 yards in the corner of the end zone...ridiculous.

 

[Fin Thirteen]

My issue with Kevin White isn't his physical tools or his skillset or his appetite for the game. You can see those are at a high level for yourself.

He's raw. He reeks of a guy who, since he started, has been getting by on being bigger and stronger than the guy covering him. His route running isn't developed, he lets DBs get ballside of him all the time, he doesn't shield the ball with his body, he doesn't display a lot of smarts in tight man coverage. As it stands, an upper tier man coverage CB in the league should be able to nullify him quite a bit.

Like all basic skills, they can be learned and they probably will. The fact he lets DBs get into his face so much has probably helped his catching ability, which is pretty good. But he's every bit as raw as Coates or DGB - just in different departments. Would I bet against him being a successful No 1 receiver in the NFL? Hell no. But I'd expect it to take a while for him to learn how to negate the top CBs in the league.

 

[xXwarXx]

My issue with Kevin White isn't his physical tools or his skillset or his appetite for the game. You can see those are at a high level for yourself.

He's raw. He reeks of a guy who, since he started, has been getting by on being bigger and stronger than the guy covering him. His route running isn't developed, he lets DBs get ballside of him all the time, he doesn't shield the ball with his body, he doesn't display a lot of smarts in tight man coverage. As it stands, an upper tier man coverage CB in the league should be able to nullify him quite a bit.

Like all basic skills, they can be learned and they probably will. The fact he lets DBs get into his face so much has probably helped his catching ability, which is pretty good. But he's every bit as raw as Coates or DGB - just in different departments. Would I bet against him being a successful No 1 receiver in the NFL? Hell no. But I'd expect it to take a while for him to learn how to negate the top CBs in the league.

Weird comment from someone who loves Sammie Coates, Pretty much a one trick pony.

 

[MiamiDolphin618]

Besides Cooper I don't see the polish with the top WRs that we saw last year. I wouldn't expect White or Coates to be coming in putting up huge numbers their first year…but that potential is certainly there. Just based on what we have heard we seem to be looking at the speedy WRs a bit more…like Dorsett and Smith. I like both…but the more I watch Smith the more he is growing on me. He plays big with the ball in the air…deep threat…but I think he can work the underneath stuff. Body size, control, and explosiveness honestly reminds me of Odel Beckham coming out last year.

With that said I was down on Odell coming out last year and was obviously wrong so maybe Im just trying to convince myself Smith is going to be a very good player as well.

 

[datruth55]

Besides Cooper I don't see the polish with the top WRs that we saw last year. I wouldn't expect White or Coates to be coming in putting up huge numbers their first year…but that potential is certainly there. Just based on what we have heard we seem to be looking at the speedy WRs a bit more…like Dorsett and Smith. I like both…but the more I watch Smith the more he is growing on me. He plays big with the ball in the air…deep threat…but I think he can work the underneath stuff. Body size, control, and explosiveness honestly reminds me of Odel Beckham coming out last year.

With that said I was down on Odell coming out last year and was obviously wrong so maybe Im just trying to convince myself Smith is going to be a very good player as well.

The history of Ohio State WRs in the NFL is not good...more so the history of WRs who've played under Urban Meyer in the NFL is not good. Pearcy Harvin is his only success and if you watch Harvin play he still can't run a basic route tree in the NFL after all this time. I'm not willing to take that chance on Smith even with his speed.

I think White is better running his routes than DeVante Parker who has a habit of rounding of his routes. White, Parker and Coates need major work on route running but so did/does Kelvin Benjamin who, in the mean time, is an outstanding red zone threat just because of his size and they way he competes for jump balls. I think all three of those guys can do that much. Coates might be the most physical of the three, I can't see a CB keeping him out of the end zone one-on-one and I would imagine that most linebackers would also have a difficult time with the way that guy is built. Coates is also not afraid of competition...he could have skipped the Senior Bowl like Kevin White and just gone to the combine where I'm sure he'll be one of the stronger and faster WRs there. Instead he chose to compete, chose to get some NFL coaching on routes, play terminology and the rest. He got better as the week went on. Coates looks like a kid with a very high ceiling with the willingness to work for it.

 

[xXwarXx]

The history of Ohio State WRs in the NFL is not good...more so the history of WRs who've played under Urban Meyer in the NFL is not good. Pearcy Harvin is his only success and if you watch Harvin play he still can't run a basic route tree in the NFL after all this time. I'm not willing to take that chance on Smith even with his speed.

I think White is better running his routes than DeVante Parker who has a habit of rounding of his routes. White, Parker and Coates need major work on route running but so did/does Kelvin Benjamin who, in the mean time, is an outstanding red zone threat just because of his size and they way he competes for jump balls. I think all three of those guys can do that much. Coates might be the most physical of the three, I can't see a CB keeping him out of the end zone one-on-one and I would imagine that most linebackers would also have a difficult time with the way that guy is built. Coates is also not afraid of competition...he could have skipped the Senior Bowl like Kevin White and just gone to the combine where I'm sure he'll be one of the stronger and faster WRs there. Instead he chose to compete, chose to get some NFL coaching on routes, play terminology and the rest. He got better as the week went on. Coates looks like a kid with a very high ceiling with the willingness to work for it.

Except Coates is terrible at football right now.

Seriously, I hate to bash the guy everyone seems to be in love with, but the only thing Coates does well, is get behind DBs deep. He's absolutely horrendous at everything else. Another Justin Hunter IMO.

Putting him with Parker, White, Cooper, is insane, Coates is a late 2nd rnd pick at best, and that's being extremely generous based only on his physical ability. Coates was NOT a good player in college.

And lets not overrate anything he's done at the senior bowl practice, every speed WR has been talked up, I doubt it's A coincidence, there's no one here to cover them.

 

[Fin Thirteen]

Weird comment from someone who loves Sammie Coates, Pretty much a one trick pony.

Not sure I understand. I'm saying that both Coates and White are raw in their own ways. White is being projected considerably above Coates in just about every draft going. I'm questioning the rationale for that difference because I see plenty of work for White to do as well as Sammie.

If you believe Coates is a one-trick pony, I guess you won't like me putting White at a similar level of rawness. But that's your evaluation and not mine.

I'm not blind to Sammie Coates' question marks, by any means. His route tree is very basic and his routes are adequate at best. He had Williams opposite him to draw coverage. Without Williams he wasn't the same gamebreaker. But the competitiveness, the physicality, the speed, the hands and the huge upside with him are the building blocks for a top tier WR, in my view. I expect White to be there in the top tier when Sammie gets there. But White will have had to work on himself every bit as much as Coates.

 

[xXwarXx]

Not sure I understand. I'm saying that both Coates and White are raw in their own ways. White is being projected considerably above Coates in just about every draft going. I'm questioning the rationale for that difference because I see plenty of work for White to do as well as Sammie.

If you believe Coates is a one-trick pony, I guess you won't like me putting White at a similar level of rawness. But that's your evaluation and not mine.

I'm not blind to Sammie Coates' question marks, by any means. His route tree is very basic and his routes are adequate at best. He had Williams opposite him to draw coverage. Without Williams he wasn't the same gamebreaker. But the competitiveness, the physicality, the speed, the hands and the huge upside with him are the building blocks for a top tier WR, in my view. I expect White to be there in the top tier when Sammie gets there. But White will have had to work on himself every bit as much as Coates.

White is far from polished, but he did way more in college than what coates was asked to, and he was actually really good despite being raw.

Coates was raw, and sucked, in his 3 years at auburn. Puting coates in the same convo with the top wrs is nuts. He's not even near the best at the senior bowl let alone the entire draft.

 

[ChambersWI]

Rumors coming out of Mobile are that Carl Davis, while great on the field, did not impress in interviews. Shelton on the other hand was very impressive

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

The thing you have to keep in mind is that kids showing up and having a good week at the Senior Bowl isn't the end all be all. Last year the best receivers at the Senior Bowl were Josh Huff, Robert Herron, and Jared Abbrederis. Josh Huff caught 8 balls this year and scored 0 TD's. Herron caught 6 balls. Abbrederis is still yet to play in a game. He was the most polished route runner at the Senior Bowl.

The year before it was Tavarres King and Quinton Patton that stole the show at the Senior Bowl. King has 2 catches in 2 years. Patton has 6 catches in 2 years.

You can go back as far as you want to and keep finding the same thing. It's the raw specimen with freakish upside that the NFL covets and turns into a beast. Not the mediocre athletes that have great hands and polished routes.

Justin Hunter was a great player at Tennessee. He's been pretty good for the Titans the last 2 years also considering the musical chairs at QB. Certainly much, much better than any these Senior Bowl standouts I just mentioned. He was an underclassman with raw talent that these Seniors didn't have... otherwise, they wouldn't have been Seniors to begin with. They would've entered the draft early. Like Coates.

I've been watching Sammie Coates since he was in high school. I watched him and Dee Milliner have one of the most epic WR/CB battles that you'll ever see at the high school level their Junior year. I watched Coates win MVP of the 2-A State Championship Game and then go run a 4.31 on Auburn's campus as a Junior in high school during a recruiting visit. He was committed to Southern Miss at the time.

The notion that Coates wasn't a good player in college couldn't be further from the truth. He was the go-to-guy whenever Auburn needed a big play in the passing game. Even after Duke Williams came along. That's why 3/4 of Sammie Coates career touchdown receptions came when they were losing and down in football games. He actually had more explosive plays as a Sophomore.... when Duke Williams was still in JUCO.

Datruth couldn't have said it better when he pointed out his willingness to come to Mobile and compete. He didn't have to. Understand that Sammie Coates is the first underclassman in the history of the NFL Draft to go to the Senior Bowl in Mobile and assert himself as one of the top talents in the draft. He will always hold that distinction from now on... and for good reason. He always had a fierce competitiveness in him. The freakish physical talent and ability is just a bonus.

 

[Fin Thirteen]

He always had a fierce competitiveness in him. The freakish physical talent and ability is just a bonus.

This is what I'm talking about. What attracts me to Coates is the drive. Coates might not be the best blocker in the draft, but when he's called to block he goes at it 100%, he wants to destroy the other guy out of the picture. You see other receivers in this and other classes who feel like blocking is beneath them. I'm not trying to overemphasise blocking with receivers, but I think it tells you a lot about the guy you're taking if he's willing to do the dirty work for someone else - and do it with the same effort and pride as he would an ODB highlight reel one-hander in the endzone.

As Slimm says, if it's a do-or-die situation, Coates wants the ball and then he makes sure he damn well does something with it. He might be raw, but he understands leverage with his DB pretty well - something White drastically needs to improve on.

He needs to land in a good spot - needs to have a good QB throwing to him. But in the right environment, he is a stud in the making.

 

[datruth55]

White is far from polished, but he did way more in college than what coates was asked to, and he was actually really good despite being raw.

Coates was raw, and sucked, in his 3 years at auburn. Puting coates in the same convo with the top wrs is nuts. He's not even near the best at the senior bowl let alone the entire draft.

Not sure what you were watching but Sammie Coates didn't suck at Auburn...not even close. In 2013 he led the team in receptions, receiving yards and TDs and that's for a team that played in the National Championship. In 2014 he led the team in receiving yards, was 2nd in TDs and averaged 21.8 ypc. I'm not denying how raw he is but to deny he has any upside is ridiculous. White put up better number but White also played in a pass happy offense. You would think with the amount of passes they threw and the repetitions he would actually be farther along in his development.

 

[xXwarXx]

The thing you have to keep in mind is that kids showing up and having a good week at the Senior Bowl isn't the end all be all. Last year the best receivers at the Senior Bowl were Josh Huff, Robert Herron, and Jared Abbrederis. Josh Huff caught 8 balls this year and scored 0 TD's. Herron caught 6 balls. Abbrederis is still yet to play in a game. He was the most polished route runner at the Senior Bowl.

The year before it was Tavarres King and Quinton Patton that stole the show at the Senior Bowl. King has 2 catches in 2 years. Patton has 6 catches in 2 years.

You can go back as far as you want to and keep finding the same thing. It's the raw specimen with freakish upside that the NFL covets and turns into a beast. Not the mediocre athletes that have great hands and polished routes.

Justin Hunter was a great player at Tennessee. He's been pretty good for the Titans the last 2 years also considering the musical chairs at QB. Certainly much, much better than any these Senior Bowl standouts I just mentioned. He was an underclassman with raw talent that these Seniors didn't have... otherwise, they wouldn't have been Seniors to begin with. They would've entered the draft early. Like Coates.

I've been watching Sammie Coates since he was in high school. I watched him and Dee Milliner have one of the most epic WR/CB battles that you'll ever see at the high school level their Junior year. I watched Coates win MVP of the 2-A State Championship Game and then go run a 4.31 on Auburn's campus as a Junior in high school during a recruiting visit. He was committed to Southern Miss at the time.

The notion that Coates wasn't a good player in college couldn't be further from the truth. He was the go-to-guy whenever Auburn needed a big play in the passing game. Even after Duke Williams came along. That's why 3/4 of Sammie Coates career touchdown receptions came when they were losing and down in football games. He actually had more explosive plays as a Sophomore.... when Duke Williams was still in JUCO.

What's that, like an entire 2 TDs? He wasn't that good in college, wasn't that productive, was not asked to do much, while I enjoy your posts and perspective you are greatly overrating Coates college career. It was a successful day for him if he secured more than 2 receptions on 5-6 targets.

Yeah, he's crazy athletic, cool, that makes him a 2nd rnd pick at best IMO. He was at Auburn for 3 years and still can't do anything but a "go" route, sometimes being raw should serve as more of a warning than a strength.

 

[xXwarXx]

Not sure what you were watching but Sammie Coates didn't suck at Auburn...not even close. In 2013 he led the team in receptions, receiving yards and TDs and that's for a team that played in the National Championship. In 2014 he led the team in receiving yards, was 2nd in TDs and averaged 21.8 ypc. I'm not denying how raw he is but to deny he has any upside is ridiculous. White put up better number but White also played in a pass happy offense. You would think with the amount of passes they threw and the repetitions he would actually be farther along in his development.

No offense, but a players stats and where they ranked on there team mean very little to me. None of those stats are impressive anyway.

I'm not even a White Fan, but he was a better player week in and week out, attacked all levels of the field, and had the offense run through him. Coates can't say any of those things.