16-year-old Scout Evaluates Dion Jordan | Page 41 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

16-year-old Scout Evaluates Dion Jordan

Like Awsi Dooger said, you already punched the ticket. 3 sacks, 2 sacks, 0 sacks, whatever- that winning ticket was cashed, you already nailed it. I saw potential in DJ as an OLB not DE, but even at OLB he was not doing well and was a one trick pony and weak against the run. His shining moments were a few nice pass rushes and some good coverage, Gronk down the sidelines comes to mind. We could have had Star Lotulelei and one of my favorites, RT Menelik Watson, with that forfeited 2nd rd pick. Opportunity cost galore, even though Watson popped his Achilles.

Btw last year the Dolphins could most likely have traded down and still taken Ja'Wuan James while picking up a 2nd, stayed pat in rd 3 and drafted Trai Turner at OG instead of Billy Turner and trying to make a Guard out of a darned good LT prospect. Could have drafted Martavis Bryant in the 4th, he was begging to be taken, and took instead the immortal Walt Aikens. Ouch. Billy Turner has some of the best LT feet I've ever seen and now he's an inactive Guard on the team with the worst Guards in the NFL, by far. Typical Dolphins.

Lotulelei is great when he's on the field but that heart issue explained his mysterious lack of stamina he showed at the college level. There were two guys though available in the second round that I had in my top 20, Kawann Short and Jaime Collins, that could have been great picks.
 
Mackenzie - Congrats on your excellent call re Dion Jordan. I was hoping for the best but you were correct. Two questions:
(a) What was it about Dion that made you so certain that he was a likely bust? You seemed certain right from the start.
(b) Jeff Ireland was actually quite conservative in his drafting for Miami over the years - he rarely moved up, he avoided playmaking divas, etc, but he bet big on Dion. Does this mean that Jeff was too enamoured with his metrics and wasn't looking at the actually college performances?

(a) If a guy who is picked in the top 10 is "raw" he needs a pretty good excuse for his lack of polish. Any of the following will suffice:
1. Born in a foreign country and has had limited exposure to football, <4 years (Ezekiel Ansah, Margus Hunt)
2. Played some JUCO, had one year or less of FBS football caliber coaching prior to being drafted (JPP, Cordarrelle Patterson)
3. Must have taken time off to play some other sport only to come back to football 5 years since he had last played football in high school (Jimmy Graham)
4. Maybe a position change, but it better be later on in your college career (Ryan Tannehill, Braxton Miller).
If you're a redshirt sophomore, i.e., Greg Robinson, that kinda counts, although I'm still nervous. In any case, if you've been playing football since you were a kid and your fundamentals are still crap, you either work really hard and never make any improvement (Manuel, E.J.), or you don't work hard (Gholston, Vernon). Jordan fell into one of these categories, in some ways category 1 is worse than category 2, I didn't know him personally and couldn't evaluate his work ethic, but it didn't even matter, he's been playing football for far too long to have such poor fundamentals. I've only heard of one guy who had great physical tools but was bad in college because he was really raw and didn't have a legitimate excuse for being raw who turned into a good NFL player. I think his name was Cameron Wake.
(b) I don't know what was going through Jeff's head. But part of me suspects Jordan was kinda a product of the media. I remember, prior to his senior season, no one had him as a first round pick. NFLDraftScout, ESPN, Bleacher Report, you name it, all had him in the mid 2nd to early 4th round. And he made no discernible improvement and somehow rocketed into the top 5. I think what happened is that some scout, probably one who works for the Patriots, who had Dion Jordan in the 3rd round, called Todd McShay on the phone and said "Dion Jordan is in the top 5 of my draft board." And he called a few other outlets. Maybe it wasn't just one scout, maybe it was a GM (my money is on Ozzie Newsome), maybe it was multiple scouts or a combination of scouts and GMs working for different, smarter teams who all started hyping up Jordan to anyone who works in the media whose job title features the word "analyst" somewhere. And the media bought the hype. So did Jeff Ireland. Jordan was the perfect type of prospect to fool the media because he legitimately had an incredible physical skill set that he did not know how to use. And the media drueled when looking at his 40 yard dash time and his height, blah blah blah. Meanwhile, you've got Jaime Collins, who is 2lbs heavier than Jordan, runs a 4.64 40 compared to Jordan's 4.60, has arms as long as Jordan's, and set an NFL record for best vertical jump at the combine for linebackers (a 41.5 inch vertical at 250lbs. Absolutely ridiculous), and, oh, wait, he was actually really productive at the college level. Granted, he played for Southern Miss, but still, he was awesome. Ireland bought the hype. Belicheck bought Collins, and wow, he's a good player.
 
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Sounds like a 16-year old in the mind and body of a 35-year old! Smart and intelligent! Wise beyond his years.
 
The most important thing is for Miami to learn from bad picks.

In Jordan's case it was many things including injuries, bad system fit, and character issues (drugs, work ethic). Injuries are hard to predict, but the Dolphins have drafted too many players coming off injuries in their college careers. The 2013 draft showed that in the first three rounds with Jordan, Taylor and Thomas. All were busts.

I hope the team really avoids those injury prone players. Plus, the team should put an emphasis on players with a great work ethic. Let Javis Landry be the example of what the team is looking for from players.
 
This kid was just about 100% spot on about Jordan. :bobdole:
 
Great thread great incite as eval. Curious to see if he'd follow up on some of his reviews from the 2013 draft class. A lot of failure in that class.


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Great thread great incite as eval. Curious to see if he'd follow up on some of his reviews from the 2013 draft class. A lot of failure in that class.

Compared Manziel to Michael Vick and gave him a 93 overall grade worthy of a first rd pick. :chuckle:
 
Ultimately, I like Gilbert. He’s really shown a lot of improvement in man coverage over the years, and he has a lot of potential at the NFL level. I still don’t think he’s the best corner in this draft class, but I don’t think he’s overrated. This is just an awesome cornerback class.

NFL Comparison: Byron Maxwell. You probably don’t know who that is, but, in case you didn’t know, Seattle is amazing. After Brandon Browner got hurt and Walter Thurmond III got suspended, Maxwell started opposite Richard Sherman. Like all cornerbacks who put on a Seattle uniform, he was outstanding last season. He wasn’t a product of the defense. Seattle just has an infinite supply of Pro Bowl caliber corners. I understand that Maxwell isn’t a recognizable name, so if you want someone you’ve heard of, I’ll go with Aqib Talib, except Gilbert isn’t as strong against the run but doesn’t have as many character questions.

Grade: 97 (worthy of a top 10 pick)

Projection: 97 (will be a top 10 pick)

Interesting.
 
Picks and money, baby. We would have done better with a kid picking his nose and eating his boogers for extra lunch money.
 
Does the post mention that he has a drug problem? If not then I fail to see the relevance as this (combined with bad coaching decisions and being played in the wrong position) brought Jordan down.
 
The most important thing is for Miami to learn from bad picks.

In Jordan's case it was many things including injuries, bad system fit, and character issues (drugs, work ethic). Injuries are hard to predict, but the Dolphins have drafted too many players coming off injuries in their college careers. The 2013 draft showed that in the first three rounds with Jordan, Taylor and Thomas. All were busts.

I hope the team really avoids those injury prone players. Plus, the team should put an emphasis on players with a great work ethic. Let Javis Landry be the example of what the team is looking for from players.

Never draft a guy that high that plays such a small percentage of plays for a colege
 
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