Andre Reed Before Mark Clayton?

[djfresh47]

Neither are HOF players IMO. Reed would get in before Clayton, but neither is deserving of enshrinement. On the ballots I seen for next seasons list of eligible players, I think the most interesting is Thurman Thomas, he definately is a HOF player IMO, but I don't think he'll get in on the 1st ballot.

 

[buffalofanatic]

Both are deserving, but Reed will get in before Clayton for the simple fact that the Bills went to 4 Super Bowls. However, I believe both should eventually be there.

 

[Nicky Napoleon]

You know whats funny is that I just pulled up Mark Dupers stats and he and Clayton ended with almost identical stats. Clayton had 71 more catches, 105 more yards, and 25 more TD's......Mark Duper finished his career with a YPC average of 17.4. Thats a big number.

 

[Nicky Napoleon]

I didnt watch much of Monk so I cant say anything other that what the stats tell me, and the stats tell me that in almost every category Andre Reed had a better career. Save the fact that Monk has a couple of rings, please those of you that watched him why is Monk a better candidate for the HoF.

 

[Crisis]

I didnt watch much of Monk so I cant say anything other that what the stats tell me, and the stats tell me that in almost every category Andre Reed had a better career. Save the fact that Monk has a couple of rings, please those of you that watched him why is Monk a better candidate for the HoF.

Stats aren't everything. You're too hung up on them.

Stats never tell a full-story of someone's career.

 

[Nicky Napoleon]

Stats aren't everything. You're too hung up on them.

Stats never tell a full-story of someone's career.

Im not hung up on stats, but when you are comparing two players that were very good on the field like Reed and Clayton I will look at stats to see if there is anything that can help. Like I said, I didnt get to watch much of Monk so all I have to go on for him is the stats. Thats why I asked for someone that had a chance to watch him to tell me why he is more deserving. So thanks for your enlightening response..... :shakeno:

 

[Ozzy]

reed probably will get in before clayton because reed didnt play in a pass happy offense and reed also had amazing performances in the postseason as well. I think art monk should get in before any of the eligible recievers especially micheal irvin.

Sure Monk deserves it, but so does Clayton, who also had a few nice post season games.

Reed should not be a first, second, or third time selection, and that's not a knock on him. He deserves it, but Wr's are not Qb's.

Both of the Marks brothers should be in before him.

 

[zephon]

You know, since the enshrinement of Swann the voters have been harder on WRs. Right or Wrong the Swann vote has made the voters more conscious of who they are voting in. Swann got in solely on his SB wins...and the fact that most of those SB teams players were already in...it was just wrong to vote him in IMO.

The fact that the Football HOF had gotten watered down the last 10 years coulped with the fact that the writers are now being more selective..and maybe what happened was a good thing....That said...

.....I don't want the Football HOF to be quite as picky as the Baseball HOF but if the voters pick up just a little of that selectivity it will benefit the HOF in the long run.

 

[Ozzy]

Stats aren't everything. You're too hung up on them.

Stats never tell a full-story of someone's career.

Stats are everything!!

The stories are only cared about by the fan of team the player played for.

 

[Nicky Napoleon]

You know, since the enshrinement of Swann the voters have been harder on WRs. Right or Wrong the Swann vote has made the voters more conscious of who they are voting in. Swann got in solely on his SB wins...and the fact that most of those SB teams players were already in...it was just wrong to vote him in IMO.

The fact that the Football HOF had gotten watered down the last 10 years coulped with the fact that the writers are now being more selective..and maybe what happened was a good thing....That said...

.....I don't want the Football HOF to be quite as picky as the Baseball HOF but if the voters pick up just a little of that pickiness it will benefit the HOF in the long run.

Yeah the baseball HoF is ******ed they may not have anyone elected next year....or at least thats the rumor.

 

[zephon]

Yeah the baseball HoF is ******ed they may not have anyone elected next year....or at least thats the rumor.

They are overly picky and with the whole steriod era now seeming to be making a big mark on the voters (right or wrong...all though I think wrong based on the fact that it wasn't just a few but the majority were taking them on some level to me makes it an even playing field in those times..an argument for another time and another board)..they may not vote anyone new into the hall for a few years...

Back to football though...I think we need a bit of that selectivity. It'll make actually being selected that much of a bigger thing when players do make it. IMO

 

[Nicky Napoleon]

They are overly picky and with the whole steriod era now seeming to be making a big mark on the voters (right or wrong...all though I think wrong based on the fact that it wasn't just a few but the majority were taking them on some level to me makes it an even playing field in those times..an argument for another time and another board)..they may not vote anyone new into the hall for a few years...

Back to football though...I think we need a bit of that selectivity. It'll make actually being selected that much of a bigger thing when players do make it. IMO

I agree on the selectivity but they should not be allowed to punish guys now because they allowed Swann in(which is the worst HoF vote ever IMO)

 

[zephon]

I agree on the selectivity but they should not be allowed to punish guys now because they allowed Swann in(which is the worst HoF vote ever IMO)

no but I think that's what they've done with Monk.

I honestly think that when Monk finally gets in (and he should!) that it'll ease up on the WR spot. I'm also of the opinion that NO WR should get in before Monk..Irvin included (he can be argued for not getting in at all in some circles). Monk is the most qualified to be next at WR, IMO.

I still don't know what Monk did for voters to have issues with him but he's obviously done something as I've read too many articles that state the voters have an issue with him.

Basically though, the voters HAVE to be more selective from now on...it's for the betterment of the football HOF. They cannot take back the Swann vote (even though I bet they wish they could) because he's already there but because of Swann I'm hopeful that realize what the HOF has become and correct that.

 

[Jimmy James]

Monk is going to have to wait if he isn't in by the time Jerry Rice is eligible. The same might even be said about Carter given all those TDs.

 

[Nicky Napoleon]

OK this is for Crisis......

I pulled the stats on all of the HoF WR's, there are 19 total but I narrowed that down by eliminating players that played two positions like Hirsch and players that played pre 1960. That leaves 12 players....

Fred Biletnikoff
589 catches 8974 yards 76 TD's

Ray Berry
631 catches 9275 yards 68 TD's

Lance Alworth
542 catches 10266 yards 85 TD's

Charlie Joyner
750 catches 12146 yards 65 TD's

Steve Largent
819 catches 13089 yards 100 TD's

James Lofton
764 catches 14004 yards 75 TD's

Don Maynard
633 catches 11834 yards 88 TD's

Tommy McDonald
495 catches 8410 yards 84 TD's

Bobby Mitchell
521 catches 7954 yards 65 TD's

John Stallworth
537 catches 8723 yards 63 TD's

Lynn Swann
336 catches (Joke) 5462 yards(Joke) 51 TD's (Joke)

Paul Warfield
427 catches 8565 yards 85 TD's



OK so just as a reminder the three biggest names in this thread have been
Andre Reed
951 catches 13198 yards 87 TD's

Mark Clayton
582 catches 8974 yards 84 TD's

Art Monk
940 catches 12721 yards 68 TD's

Also remember that Monk and Reeds careers were 16 seasons while Claytons was 11 years. My arguement is for Clayton, he would rank 6th in both catches and yards among all of the HoFers, and tied for 5th in TD's. But looking at this the same arguement can be made for all 3 WR's. Andre Reed would rank 1st in catches, 2nd in yards and 3rd in TD's. Why arent these guys getting any love?