Anyone besides me sick of losing within the division? | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Anyone besides me sick of losing within the division?

WVDolphan

☠️ Banned ☠️
Joined
Aug 16, 2005
Messages
15,867
Reaction score
161
Everyone seems to get so touchy about so called leaders that have been on this team like Jason Taylor. Has it occurred to anyone besides me that we simply cant beat the Jets and Bills lately? Does losing to the Bills and Jets completely piss you off? It does me.

Since the beginning of the decade(the last 8 seasons) our beloved phins are a PATHETIC 17-31 within the division. Worse than that is if you didnt factor in that we were 12-12 and owned the Bills in the first four years of that stretch(6-2 vs the bills), it leaves a mark of 5-19 in the last 4 seasons vs. the division. And even worse(if it could get worse) is the fact that we have gone 3-5 vs the patsies in the last 4 seasons.

So its not as if the division record has been that bad due to the dominance of the patriots. No, our so called leaders like JT and Zach have bolstered a disgraceful 2-14 mark vs. the Jets and Bills in the last 4 seasons, including being swept in 3 of those 4 by each team. :(

Yea, it looks as though to me that the sooner we get rid of the players who have lead us to this point the better. And Im not talking about young guys like Ronnie, who arent wearing "C"'s on their uni's.(And Im sure Ronnie missed about half of those games anyway.:rolleyes:) Im talking about the men who are disingenuionously wearing "C"'s while finding other things to do besides be at "voluntary" workouts when their team needs leaders most.

Reality is simply JT continues to come up short against the Jets. Always has. Never makes the big play on a crucial 3rd down. Chad Pennington over the years has seemed to always find a way to make the play needed in these spots and wind up beating us by 4 points. Where was JT and his little heartbreaker celebration dance when we needed it?

And Zach? Hell he didnt even bother to show up to the first Jets game last season. What was stopping him from taking the flight with the team? A headache? Get real. Maybe he didnt go because Mawae left the Jets for Tennessee and he wasnt there to own him like he always had. Maybe Zach was afraid that being Mawae's personal beyotch on the gridiron wouldnt be there for his built in excuse by the fans to not make plays against the Jets. Fans couldnt say, "well the interior DL couldnt keep Mawae off Zach at all. What do you expect him to do against a C like that? Its the DLs fault." Yea right.

Yea I got a Zach jersey. And you guys can say whatever you want about the fact Im bashing the two former leaders of our D. But, when I look back at what they have done for us over a career, it kinda pisses me off. Basically they have been owned by the Jets and Bills and there is really nothing worse than that. Granted they never had a good QB(which IMHO has been the biggest problem of this franchise for the last 10 years), and that in turn lead to coaching changes every other week and alot of other problems. But, it seems like in every big spot over the last 10 years, even when the defense was highly ranked, they always came up short when they needed a crucial stop with the game on the line.

And for JT personally. I always thought a true "Captain" goes down with his ship. Not whines the whole seasons when the ship is finally hitting rock bottom, then start the process of spawning a hollywood career, and cap it off by requesting specifically to go to a big market or contender/both. Basically he wants to gravy train it and ride someones coat tails to a title, collect his 16 million he is due on the last two years of his contract, and ride off onto Rodeo Dr. with a little boost from either being in a big market or gravy training that title or a combination of both.

All this PREMATURELY I might add. Theres no reason JT cant play 4 more seasons if he wanted. No reason he cant stay here and be a TRUE CAPTAIN and be the foundation for Parcells' 4 YEAR PLAN to winning a world title.

But, somehow you guys are all for JT going somewhere else, and rooting hard for that team just for his sake, as if he gives a **** about you, me, or our team. I say whatever.

You guys can be ready to paste these guys all over the ring of honor if you want. I say JT is leaving with unfinished business that he wants no part of. I say they both got owned by the Jets and Bills and in my eyes that counts for ALOT. Theres nothing I hate worse than losing to the Jets and Bills. Am I bitter about it? You bet your *** I am.

I just cant tolerate it much more. And Im certainly glad the new man in charge wont tolerate it either. Im glad he feels like I do about the situation.

Zach had no choice about leaving so Im not upset with him personally about how he departed. He still got owned by Mawae and the Jets though. And for that reason I dont rate him as highly as other great players we have had. But, JT has lost all credibility with me. Im sorry. Thats just how I feel about it. Stop telling us the Jets "aint coming back on us" and actually make a play that keeps a 300 year old QB from doing just that.

So, heres to BILL PARCELLS and getting this franchise back where it should be. Its rightfull place. ATOP THE AFC EAST. Dominating the Jets and Bills. :hi5:
 
I bet you if we have a ****ty season you start ripping the new players on this team like your ripping Zach Thomas and Jason Taylor now. Football is a team sport and you can't hold two guys accountable for losing games against the division. That being said i agree that i hate losing to division rivals and it needs to stop. The sooner we start winning games period the sooner we can beat those in the division as well.
 
wow.wow.wow.
i agree to the fact i hate losing to the bills and jets... more than any other loses from the season.. however bashing the 2 players that have played here for so long is uncalled for..
i would not blame ANY loss or a DE or a ILB
 
You know what I would really like to have here is some classic, rock solid, DLockz research. I did my part for this subject that I was steaming over while getting my daughter to sleep earlier. I wondered exactly what this team has accomplished vs. teams in the division lately, so I checked it out. It basically started from being heated at losing to the Jets and Bills and the whole JT thing and how he has failed to make crucial plays vs. these teams. The actual records were a little worse than what I expected to find.

Anyways, those records were pretty simple to track down. What I need is a pro like Dlockz with his research(or anyone else who thinks they could help) for this next problem.............

I was wondering exactly how many of these gravy training coat tail riders have gotten their ring in the manner they choose. That is how many veteran players age 32 or more have requested a trade to a contender, had that request granted, and turned out to be the missing link for a team to win a title? Id love to know the answer to that over say the last 10-20 years or so. This is trade only, no FA. Guys who have requested a trade to a contender, and went on to get their ring before retirement. I couldnt think of any off the top of my head. Probably one obvious one that Im just not thinking of. Anyways, if any of you can think of any, or would bother with the research, it would be interesting to know.

Also, I would be interested to know how many DE's(and I know, I know, they say JT would be an OLB in a 3-4) stuck around to age 36 or older and won a ring where they were like Strahan just did this last season. How old is Strahan? Like 38? Just an example of a true captain who stuck with his ship and lead them to a world title. And I know, I know, youre gonna tell me he held out purposely for the sake of missing Coughlins camp.....True. However, he stuck it out. And he wasnt interested in leaving when he could still play in order to go hollywood. Plus this is a new regime here in Miami and I feel like everyone should be here right now. But, I dont care so much about DWTS, as much as JT dosent want to put in the work here in Miami to win a title when he has 4 years left in him if he wanted them.
 
I bet you if we have a ****ty season you start ripping the new players on this team like your ripping Zach Thomas and Jason Taylor now. Football is a team sport and you can't hold two guys accountable for losing games against the division. That being said i agree that i hate losing to division rivals and it needs to stop. The sooner we start winning games period the sooner we can beat those in the division as well.

Agreed. And youre right. If we keep losing to the Jets and Bills, Im gonna keep ripping guys. And you know who its gonna be???? THE LEADERS OF THE TEAM!!! Thats who gets the blame. Dont you realize that? Someone has to be accountable dont they? Who do you suggest we blame? The fans?

If you want to wear the "C", and you want to be looked at as a leader, and you want to receive the accolades that come with victory, you better damn well be ready to take the heat when the losing comes. Especially whats been going on here lately. 1-15. Is that a joke?????

Seriously, I thought Chad Johnson was the only person that didnt understand the concept that when you want the spoils of victory, want to show up when the winning is going on, want to be the leader, want to be "the man", youre gonna have to expect and accept blame like a true leader does when the job dosent get done. Especially if its pathetic like it has been here lately. Its not like we have been mediocre and almost held our own vs. the jets and bills.

The HC, The QB, and anyone wearing a "C" on their uni have to earn that "C" by stepping up and taking blame when it goes bad. Not whine all year about the defensive system and start setting up offseason hollywood plans. Its garbage.

Thats why the HC, QB, and anyone wearing a "C" gets all the accolades when the team succeeds. You cant have your cake and eat it too. But, JT runs and hides when the **** goes down. He dosent go down with the ship. He wants to flee the scene and go ride Tom Brady's coat tails. Get real with this clown. You guys can praise him all you want. I say he's soft and has NO HEART.
 
I really loved the orginal post in this thread. I have been feeling the same way recently. All the hand-wringing over Zach Thomas being released made me sick. Similarly, all of the Jason Taylor nonsense is making me sick.

Facts are facts, and in this case the fact is that Jason Taylor and Zach Thomas, for all of their press clippings, never won anything. Do they bear any responsibility for that? OF COURSE THEY DO.

They were the supposed leaders of a defense that consistently let this team down when it counted. Granted, they had a tough task, supporting what was usually a subpar offense, but last I checked, the Chicago Bears made it to the Super Bowl with a terrible offense and the Baltimore Ravens WON the Super Bowl with an abysmal offense. These were exceptions obviously, but the Jason Taylor/Zach Thomas-led Dolphins were never that exception.

Now we are supposed to hope that they can go play for a contender so that they get a shot at a ring? Please.
 
I really loved the orginal post in this thread. I have been feeling the same way recently. All the hand-wringing over Zach Thomas being released made me sick. Similarly, all of the Jason Taylor nonsense is making me sick.

Facts are facts, and in this case the fact is that Jason Taylor and Zach Thomas, for all of their press clippings, never won anything. Do they bear any responsibility for that? OF COURSE THEY DO.

They were the supposed leaders of a defense that consistently let this team down when it counted. Granted, they had a tough task, supporting what was usually a subpar offense, but last I checked, the Chicago Bears made it to the Super Bowl with a terrible offense and the Baltimore Ravens WON the Super Bowl with an abysmal offense. These were exceptions obviously, but the Jason Taylor/Zach Thomas-led Dolphins were never that exception.

Now we are supposed to hope that they can go play for a contender so that they get a shot at a ring? Please.

Exactly. I dont understand. Shouldnt we as fin fans all be hoping that WE win a title over anyone else?

Reality is JT is only 32. He isnt 40 years old.

Reality is there is no reason JT couldnt sign up here for 4 more years, and bust his *** like everyone who will be here, trying to do all they can to make THIS TEAM a WORLD CHAMPION. The only reason stopping him is HE DOSENT WANT TO DO THAT. So basically, he is saying piss on the phins. He has other wants. He just dosent want to play for 4 more seasons.

Hey, theres nothing wrong with that, its a free country. But, dont expect me to sweat the guys nuts the way everyone else is, when basically he wants no part of putting in the work and time it would take to turn this thing around and make our team the best he can help make it. The guy has other plans that just dont include the phins for 4 more years. Its not on his priority list. Its that simple.

Yet, most of the people on this board want to root for whoever he suits up for this year if it isnt the phins. I dont get it. Why do you think BP just looked at him when he came to the team facility? Cause BP feels like I do about the situation.

Nothing stopping JT from committing to THIS TEAM other than the fact he just dosent want to.

You guys dont think we wouldve actually shopped JT had he not requested it do you? NO way in hell. First of all you cant get the appropriate value out of him. And secondly he isnt so old that he cant be effective by the time we are ready to strike. In fact he should still be good enough in 2-4 years that he would still be one of the best players we have. If he CHOSE to be here and put in the work for the next few years to turn this thing around and committ to Parcells' plan.....then he would be a true captain and leader.

So I say lets back the players who are here, want to be here, and are busting it to make this team the best they can.....even John Beck. Am I pissed at Beck because of how he played last year(especially against the Jets and Bills)........yes. But, at least the guy is putting in work, dosent whine about how things went down last year, and is doing all he can do to turn it around. As far as I know he would take full responsability for his own play last year. Remember he's a QB, and like HC and anyone wearing a "C" on their uni, those are the guys who must accept this responsibility.

And youre right about the D having had a tough task with how the offense has been. But, Im not suggesting that they needed to be the Bears, Ravens, or Bucs teams that made or won the SB. No that isnt fair to ask.

But, these guys havent even come close to that. In fact I think they only won 1 division title. They only made the playoffs what......2 times. And they did have a nice running game that one season Ricky ran wild and still came up short.

No, the sad truth is this defense that was lead by JT and Zach CONSISTANTLY came up short in big games. Especially vs. the Jets. Everytime they needed a crucial 3rd down stop late in a game to seal it they almost certainly failed.

I say the sooner we turn the page, the better off we will all be.
 
Well WV, I do agree that these divisional losses are too much to bear and a feel your pain, but as usual you go off the deep end. I'm not saying you're wrong...You're just kind of....I don't know......Scary. :unsure:
 
Everyone seems to get so touchy about so called leaders that have been on this team like Jason Taylor. Has it occurred to anyone besides me that we simply cant beat the Jets and Bills lately? Does losing to the Bills and Jets completely piss you off? It does me.

Since the beginning of the decade(the last 8 seasons) our beloved phins are a PATHETIC 17-31 within the division. Worse than that is if you didnt factor in that we were 12-12 and owned the Bills in the first four years of that stretch(6-2 vs the bills), it leaves a mark of 5-19 in the last 4 seasons vs. the division. And even worse(if it could get worse) is the fact that we have gone 3-5 vs the patsies in the last 4 seasons.

So its not as if the division record has been that bad due to the dominance of the patriots. No, our so called leaders like JT and Zach have bolstered a disgraceful 2-14 mark vs. the Jets and Bills in the last 4 seasons, including being swept in 3 of those 4 by each team. :(

Yea, it looks as though to me that the sooner we get rid of the players who have lead us to this point the better. And Im not talking about young guys like Ronnie, who arent wearing "C"'s on their uni's.(And Im sure Ronnie missed about half of those games anyway.:rolleyes:) Im talking about the men who are disingenuionously wearing "C"'s while finding other things to do besides be at "voluntary" workouts when their team needs leaders most.

Reality is simply JT continues to come up short against the Jets. Always has. Never makes the big play on a crucial 3rd down. Chad Pennington over the years has seemed to always find a way to make the play needed in these spots and wind up beating us by 4 points. Where was JT and his little heartbreaker celebration dance when we needed it?

And Zach? Hell he didnt even bother to show up to the first Jets game last season. What was stopping him from taking the flight with the team? A headache? Get real. Maybe he didnt go because Mawae left the Jets for Tennessee and he wasnt there to own him like he always had. Maybe Zach was afraid that being Mawae's personal beyotch on the gridiron wouldnt be there for his built in excuse by the fans to not make plays against the Jets. Fans couldnt say, "well the interior DL couldnt keep Mawae off Zach at all. What do you expect him to do against a C like that? Its the DLs fault." Yea right.

Yea I got a Zach jersey. And you guys can say whatever you want about the fact Im bashing the two former leaders of our D. But, when I look back at what they have done for us over a career, it kinda pisses me off. Basically they have been owned by the Jets and Bills and there is really nothing worse than that. Granted they never had a good QB(which IMHO has been the biggest problem of this franchise for the last 10 years), and that in turn lead to coaching changes every other week and alot of other problems. But, it seems like in every big spot over the last 10 years, even when the defense was highly ranked, they always came up short when they needed a crucial stop with the game on the line.

And for JT personally. I always thought a true "Captain" goes down with his ship. Not whines the whole seasons when the ship is finally hitting rock bottom, then start the process of spawning a hollywood career, and cap it off by requesting specifically to go to a big market or contender/both. Basically he wants to gravy train it and ride someones coat tails to a title, collect his 16 million he is due on the last two years of his contract, and ride off onto Rodeo Dr. with a little boost from either being in a big market or gravy training that title or a combination of both.

All this PREMATURELY I might add. Theres no reason JT cant play 4 more seasons if he wanted. No reason he cant stay here and be a TRUE CAPTAIN and be the foundation for Parcells' 4 YEAR PLAN to winning a world title.

But, somehow you guys are all for JT going somewhere else, and rooting hard for that team just for his sake, as if he gives a **** about you, me, or our team. I say whatever.

You guys can be ready to paste these guys all over the ring of honor if you want. I say JT is leaving with unfinished business that he wants no part of. I say they both got owned by the Jets and Bills and in my eyes that counts for ALOT. Theres nothing I hate worse than losing to the Jets and Bills. Am I bitter about it? You bet your *** I am.

I just cant tolerate it much more. And Im certainly glad the new man in charge wont tolerate it either. Im glad he feels like I do about the situation.

Zach had no choice about leaving so Im not upset with him personally about how he departed. He still got owned by Mawae and the Jets though. And for that reason I dont rate him as highly as other great players we have had. But, JT has lost all credibility with me. Im sorry. Thats just how I feel about it. Stop telling us the Jets "aint coming back on us" and actually make a play that keeps a 300 year old QB from doing just that.

So, heres to BILL PARCELLS and getting this franchise back where it should be. Its rightfull place. ATOP THE AFC EAST. Dominating the Jets and Bills. :hi5:

Yeah! On NFLN, they just repeated AGAIN,:shakeno: for the 2nd time this weekend, "The miracle in the meadowlands" BS!!!!:shakeno: It makes me freakin' nauseous! .....I hate losing to anyone in our division or anyone period, but I REALLY, REALLY HATE losing to the Jets!!!! ...maybe it's because I live in N.Y...:)
 
Do I hate losing within the division? Yes. Do I like turning that into an opportunity to rip our 2 best players during that time? Nope.

JT didn't whine. Zach had concussion issues not just a 'headache.' Good players don't lead you to bad records nor do bad players lead you to good records. Our record is the result of those two players being an oasis in a desert of miserable talent brought about by incompetent management. That first post is dangerous, flawed reasoning and personal agendas including an irrational bitterness towards Zach in particular.
 
WV, I know how you feel. Personally I blame poor leadership being taught from the front office down to the guys on the field. Hopefully that is somethng the tuna is going to fix.

To further depress you about the stats you just posted, some of those few divisional wins we only got because it was meaningless game for the other team and they basically gave us the wins.

Our team needs to learn how to win. I think it has been so long they have frogotten how to.
 
3 maybe 4 years the phins may get a wildcard shot.

Gotta remember the phins are rebuilding starting THIS year. Tuna is picking the guys he thinks can win games.

The only real knock against the phins becoming competitive withing the division is that the Bills and Jets have a 2 year headstart on the rebuilding process.

The Phins are pretty much putting an expansion team together right now. They don't really have anything to build from, it's all from scratch. Saban and Cameron really screwed the phins. But not to worry, Tuna is the right guy for the job in Miami, you're just going to have to be patient.
 
I'm not so much tired of losing to the division as I am being considered a joke to the rest of the NFL and it's fans. For once I'd like our team to be feared like the other juggernauts in the NFL. That's what I'm tired of the most. Hopefully we get it turned around.

I'm tired of all the what if's and thinking about everything we've done wrong. I'm focused on tomorrow more than anything!
 
Back
Top Bottom