Can any of you explain why you hate on Coyle so much?

[Sons Of Shula]

I do mostly agree with this argument..i was just pointing out that our D was touted as being flexible and yada yada when we really werent...
i think it alllll boils down to our incompetent owner..starts at the top and goes down...this is gonna be a longggggg offseason

Our small "off & soft" CB's truly limit what we are able to do scheme wise, as well as not having a big bodied DT that can mimic a NT or at least one that can manage 2 gaps. These two things play a very large part in out ability change up and disguise looks. The only shroud that our defense was able to cling to was on long yardage and pre-determined passing situations were we would line Jordan inside at DT in a 4-2 for a pre-snap look and drop him out to play a 3-3. Which in the long run wasn't truly effective because of the lack of pass rush it produced. Besides that we would play some 5-2 in some situations outside the red zone but it seemed Coyle needed to be prodded to do so and wasn't very effective in hiding PSR's from opposing QB's.

 

[tazthenomad]

My issue though is the biggest issue on the team, the dc or the head coach.
I dont think anyone can make an argument that the DC is the biggest issue.
Defense was solid for 2.5 years of his regime with less than steller talent at LB.
Not a Coyle fan but if you going to ride out Philbin not sure why you dont ride out Coyle.
Honestly I think if you are made a head coach and you have to fire both of your coordinator choices, you probably didnt do a good job choosing in the first place and shouldnt have that job

The OP asked about Coyle and you turn this into a Philbin issue. Yes, we get that you hate him but you are getting as bad a junc derailing threads into the same agenda. Yes, Philbin needs a lot of improvement. Having said that how can you not hold Coyle responsible for the defense when you are aware that he is the one that actually runs the defense? Some have implied that Philbin messes with the play mix on offense in terms of pass/run but I have never heard anyone say Philbin is tampering with the defensive strategy. Yes, we have had injuries. Yes, he didn't have enough talent at LB. The same can be said on the offensive side of the ball were the injuries and lack of depth on the OL significantly impacted the offense but I don't hear anyone yet clamoring for Lazor's job.

 

[finfan54]

he stunts too much. When teams are running down your gullet on your smaller quicker DT's. You do not stunt them taking themselves out of the run play.

He is indecisive with players such as Jordan or he doesnt use them correctly and if he does, it appears to be too little too late.

 

[hoops]

Smaller corners is usually where you find the more fluid hips and the less wasted motion transitioning etc...it's not the corners it's the scheme that wants those type of corners...not necessarily small but the more fluid hips and the cleaner transition guys that can put their foot in the ground and come forward

You want bigger corners play a different scheme otherwise those guys would get torched

 

[dlockz]

The OP asked about Coyle and you turn this into a Philbin issue. Yes, we get that you hate him but you are getting as bad a junc derailing threads into the same agenda. Yes, Philbin needs a lot of improvement. Having said that how can you not hold Coyle responsible for the defense when you are aware that he is the one that actually runs the defense? Some have implied that Philbin messes with the play mix on offense in terms of pass/run but I have never heard anyone say Philbin is tampering with the defensive strategy. Yes, we have had injuries. Yes, he didn't have enough talent at LB. The same can be said on the offensive side of the ball were the injuries and lack of depth on the OL significantly impacted the offense but I don't hear anyone yet clamoring for Lazor's job.

My point is over all Coyle has done a better job with the defense than Philbin has done with the team and if you need to fire the coordinators he handpicked then maybe you are fiuring the wrong person. My other point ost of the hate of Coyle is change for the sake of change since the owner was too stupid to fire Philbin. Overall Coyle has been the most consistent part of the Philbin regime.
Its that simple

 

[Atila]

Overall Coyle has been the most consistent part of the Philbin regime.
Its that simple

This x100.

I will be the first person to say he's not perfect, he has his flaws, and our defense never played PERFECT through a whole season (but what D does?). But I just don't understand how people can call for his head knowing what we had on defense - we started guys like Trusnik, Wheeler, Wilson, Lowell Rose, RJ Stafford - these guys were consistently starting somewhere on our team the entire season.

I see people saying he didn't get enough pressure with just 4 guys, I see people saying he was too conservative and then I see people saying he blitzed LB's too much - everyone is all over the place, it shows me most people don't know WTF they are talking about. Our scheme is not perfect, nor is our coach, but if you think he is the problem then you're shortsighted and lack a good understanding of the game. That simple.

 

[tazthenomad]

My point is over all Coyle has done a better job with the defense than Philbin has done with the team and if you need to fire the coordinators he handpicked then maybe you are fiuring the wrong person. My other point ost of the hate of Coyle is change for the sake of change since the owner was too stupid to fire Philbin. Overall Coyle has been the most consistent part of the Philbin regime.
Its that simple

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree about Coyle being "consistent". In my mind he was as "consistent" as Sherman but he had a lot more talent to work with overall. (And I was no Sherman fan!) I don't think anyone wants to change Coyle "for the sake of change" but maybe I'm wrong.

I would not lose any sleep over Philbin being replaced if it was by someone better (and I think that it is actually possible to get worse) but I'm done with Coyle. IMO Coyle is independent enough of Philbin that you can argue about his performance without bringing Philbin into the conversation no matter how he got there. IMO, discussion about firing Philbin based on coordinator selection is a different topic than Coyle's performance in this situation.

 

[dlockz]

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree about Coyle being "consistent". In my mind he was as "consistent" as Sherman but he had a lot more talent to work with overall. (And I was no Sherman fan!) I don't think anyone wants to change Coyle "for the sake of change" but maybe I'm wrong.

I would not lose any sleep over Philbin being replaced if it was by someone better (and I think that it is actually possible to get worse) but I'm done with Coyle. IMO Coyle is independent enough of Philbin that you can argue about his performance without bringing Philbin into the conversation no matter how he got there. IMO, discussion about firing Philbin based on coordinator selection is a different topic than Coyle's performance in this situation.

Sherman's offense was ranked 27th in yards and points in 2012, In 2013 26th and 27th.

Coyle's defense

2012 7th in scoring 21st in yards
2013 8th in scoring 21st in yards
2014 20th in scoring 8th in yards

Not even similar results.. My argument is if your coach has chosen two coordinators that are supposed to get fired then no way the coach should survive.Choosing a staff is one of the most important jobs as a head coach and obviously if his two coordinators were not good choices then he didnt do a good job. The only reason we are keeping Philbin is because we have an incompetent owner that is stuck in the same cycle. We are basically following the same path as we did with Sparano out side of the winning season. We ended up getting rid of both the offensive and defensive coordinators and kept Sparano only to have to fire him the next year. We also did the same lame extension .