Cheap WR?

[Feverdream]

Of the WR's Miami has a shot at in the draft, I think Ladd McConkey is the clear best option and the one most likely to be able to learn the offense and play early.

I doubt they go that route with the OL talent available, but he's going to get open, be where he should when he should, and maximize yards after the catch. Glove fit for Tua, too.

Another smallish receiver?

Do you not want any size on the team? Do you not think it matters?

 

[Feverdream]

Injuries are a pretty standard course for NFL RBs. Hes no more likely to get against the Giants than he is LSU. Pretty good reason not to waste a much needed asset on adding yet another one when you already have a strong stable.

Come 2025 it might be a different story but you'll hard pressed to find anyone that thinks trading down for 21 to add another back is prudent.

First you say, "he isn't a delicate little flower", THEN you say "injuries are a pretty standard course"... right after saying he isn't delicate.

THEN you say that we have a "strong stable"...

Heh!

Umm... have you ever taken a course in logic?

 

[The Ghost]

First you say, "he isn't a delicate little flower", THEN you say "injuries are a pretty standard course"... right after saying he isn't delicate.

THEN you say that we have a "strong stable"...

Heh!

Umm... have you ever taken a course in logic?

The logic is basic, don't attempt to add even more depth to a position you likely have the most depth at already on your roster.

 

[j-off-her-doll]

Another smallish receiver?

Do you not want any size on the team? Do you not think it matters?

Yeah, it's not the ideal package. But, he's just significantly better than the "better fits" for Miami. I don't see the guys who fit better on paper playing early for Miami - don't see the nuance and understanding in their games. Miami's offense isn't easy to pick up, and most rookies would be relegated to specific plays/packages and wouldn't see the field enough to make you feel good about drafting them early. McConkey is precise, and he'd add an element of skill and awareness to the WR room.

I still think Miami has to get more physical on offense, but they can accomplish that with TE, RB, and OL, too.

Again, I think it's OL in Round 1, but if McDaniel doubles down on the idea that they don't need to spend premium resources on OL, I'd go with McConkey over guys like Coleman, Mitchell, or even Thomas Jr. McConkey wins everywhere and has excellent balance in space and through contact. Vs man or zone, he's going to get open, and he makes a lot of big plays. And, unlike those guys, he'd see a ton of snaps as a rookie.

 

[Feverdream]

Yeah, it's not the ideal package. But, he's just significantly better than the "better fits" for Miami. I don't see the guys who fit better on paper playing early for Miami - don't see the nuance and understanding in their games. Miami's offense isn't easy to pick up, and most rookies would be relegated to specific plays/packages and wouldn't see the field enough to make you feel good about drafting them early. McConkey is precise, and he'd add an element of skill and awareness to the WR room.

I still think Miami has to get more physical on offense, but they can accomplish that with TE, RB, and OL, too.

Again, I think it's OL in Round 1, but if McDaniel doubles down on the idea that they don't need to spend premium resources on OL, I'd go with McConkey over guys like Coleman, Mitchell, or even Thomas Jr. McConkey wins everywhere and has excellent balance in space and through contact. Vs man or zone, he's going to get open, and he makes a lot of big plays. And, unlike those guys, he'd see a ton of snaps as a rookie.

I think this is one area where you and I are just in a major disagreement.
I see McConkey as Berrios part 2, and a guy who just wouldn't see snaps playing behind two other small WRs.
Is McConkey a good prospect?
Sure, just not for us... not as long as we have Waddle and Hill. He has too similar of a skill set.

 

[E30M3]

No one for Bourne eh?

Bourne unfortunately tore his ACL in Week 8 after serving as the clear No. 1 option in the Patriots’ passing attack for the first half of the season. He has inside-outside ability and is a willing run blocker.

Bourne makes up for his lack of elite athleticism with suddenness to his game, including crisp breaks out of routes and late hands to avoid as many contested targets by catching defensive backs off guard. Bourne can make a catchable but inaccurate throw look better with good ball-tracking ability, and he runs hard after the catch.

Last contract @ NE

Contract:	3 yr(s) / $15,000,000
Signing Bonus	$4,250,000
Average Salary	$5,000,000
Total Guarantees	$7,250,000
Guaranteed at Signing	$5,250,000

ear	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	Tgt	Rec	Yds	Y/R	TD	1D	Succ%	Lng	R/G	Y/G	Ctch%	Y/Tgt	Att	Yds	TD	1D	Succ%	Lng	Y/A	Y/G	A/G	Touch	Y/Tch	YScm	RRTD	Fmb	AV
2017	22	SFO	WR	10	11	0	34	16	257	16.1	0	12	41.2	54	1.5	23.4	47.1%	7.6			0							16	16.1	257	0	0	2
2018	23	SFO	WR	84	16	8	66	42	487	11.6	4	30	54.5	33	2.6	30.4	63.6%	7.4			0							42	11.6	487	4	1	4
2019	24	SFO	WR	84	16	0	44	30	358	11.9	5	23	59.1	30	1.9	22.4	68.2%	8.1			0							30	11.9	358	5	0	4
2020	25	SFO	WR	84	15	5	74	49	667	13.6	2	35	58.1	49	3.3	44.5	66.2%	9.0			0							49	13.6	667	2	0	5
2021	26	NWE	WR	84	17	5	70	55	800	14.5	5	27	65.7	75	3.2	47.1	78.6%	11.4	12	125	0	7	83.3	18	10.4	7.4	0.7	67	13.8	925	5	1	9
2022	27	NWE	WR	84	16	2	48	35	434	12.4	1	22	54.2	41	2.2	27.1	72.9%	9.0	6	39	0	2	33.3	29	6.5	2.4	0.4	41	11.5	473	1	2	4
2023	28	NWE	WR	84	8	5	55	37	406	11.0	4	15	49.1	36	4.6	50.8	67.3%	7.4	1	4	0	1	100.0	4	4.0	0.5	0.1	38	10.8	410	4	1	3

Also was with McDaniel in San Fran from draft till 2020 so there's a connection there as well.

 

[Feverdream]

No one for Bourne eh?



Last contract @ NE

Contract:	3 yr(s) / $15,000,000
Signing Bonus	$4,250,000
Average Salary	$5,000,000
Total Guarantees	$7,250,000
Guaranteed at Signing	$5,250,000

ear	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	Tgt	Rec	Yds	Y/R	TD	1D	Succ%	Lng	R/G	Y/G	Ctch%	Y/Tgt	Att	Yds	TD	1D	Succ%	Lng	Y/A	Y/G	A/G	Touch	Y/Tch	YScm	RRTD	Fmb	AV
2017	22	SFO	WR	10	11	0	34	16	257	16.1	0	12	41.2	54	1.5	23.4	47.1%	7.6			0							16	16.1	257	0	0	2
2018	23	SFO	WR	84	16	8	66	42	487	11.6	4	30	54.5	33	2.6	30.4	63.6%	7.4			0							42	11.6	487	4	1	4
2019	24	SFO	WR	84	16	0	44	30	358	11.9	5	23	59.1	30	1.9	22.4	68.2%	8.1			0							30	11.9	358	5	0	4
2020	25	SFO	WR	84	15	5	74	49	667	13.6	2	35	58.1	49	3.3	44.5	66.2%	9.0			0							49	13.6	667	2	0	5
2021	26	NWE	WR	84	17	5	70	55	800	14.5	5	27	65.7	75	3.2	47.1	78.6%	11.4	12	125	0	7	83.3	18	10.4	7.4	0.7	67	13.8	925	5	1	9
2022	27	NWE	WR	84	16	2	48	35	434	12.4	1	22	54.2	41	2.2	27.1	72.9%	9.0	6	39	0	2	33.3	29	6.5	2.4	0.4	41	11.5	473	1	2	4
2023	28	NWE	WR	84	8	5	55	37	406	11.0	4	15	49.1	36	4.6	50.8	67.3%	7.4	1	4	0	1	100.0	4	4.0	0.5	0.1	38	10.8	410	4	1	3

Also was with McDaniel in San Fran from draft till 2020 so there's a connection there as well.

He's okay... I'm not sure that he's what I'm looking for... he's more of a complimentary WR... not really tall or particularly strong. I think we already have one like him in Ezukanma.
Bourne is a vet though... I guess if he came really cheap.

 

[Hoot]

Marquez Valdes-Scantling is being released by the Chiefs for salary cap purposes.

As a 6'4" WR, he could fill the bill as an immediate play, reasonably cheap X type WR. He runs a sub 4.4 40 and could run both Y and X routes.

He's been making about 9m per year, but at 29 and going to his third team, he could find himself in the one year at a time contract category... maybe for 5-6m?

No... I'm not completely sold on this particular guy, but he is the type of WR who we could add to be our 3rd option.

Chiefs games are local for me. Buddy is a Chiefs fan so we watched quite a few together (ugh). I will say....MVS was frustrating to watch. Huge drops in back breaking moments. I would not be thrilled with the pick up. Maybe change of scenery would help him but I think he would struggle to make the team. Crazy as that sounds.

 

[ANUFan]

I go with a no. While he has the size at 6'4 he plays small every time I see him play. He seems to hate physical play and like to just go deep a lot. Which leads to him have an absolutely low catch rate of 50.3 for his career, despite playing with two all pro QBs.

We got deep speed routes covered in Hill and Waddle. We need a more physical chain mover type at X or a legit TE. Need that to compliment Waddle/Hill. We probably can't afford it but Michael Thomas would be a guy like that.

Exactly! He’s a bigger finesse guy.

We need a dawg that can easily beat 1 on 1 coverage when defense rotate towards Waddle/Hill

 

[Feverdream]

Chiefs games are local for me. Buddy is a Chiefs fan so we watched quite a few together (ugh). I will say....MVS was frustrating to watch. Huge drops in back breaking moments. I would not be thrilled with the pick up. Maybe change of scenery would help him but I think he would struggle to make the team. Crazy as that sounds.

I don't disagree... I just mentioned him as an example of the type of WR we could find as a cheap third. He is far from my first choice.

 

[miamiron]

Another smallish receiver?

Do you not want any size on the team? Do you not think it matters?

our offence

 

[39wildman]

I think our third wr problem is tua. He got spread ball out

 

[Feverdream]

our offenceView attachment 161997

Heh!

A couple of years ago, there was a huge ongoing debate about receivers that created separation... a large number of the brothers went on and on about how the Dolphins lacked guys who could do this... and argued that Tua REALLY needed guys who could separate and he would 'throw them open'.

This went on for months... we had some SERIOUS fights over whether guys like Waddle would be #1 WRs... others preferred guys like Megatron or Moss... large powerful receivers who might not get as open, but were better bets to dominate.

Since that time, we've moved from a team that lacked separation guys to a team that only has these smallish receivers...

I've always preferred the dominate X receivers, but said you needed both. ...and I think our struggles in tight games vs. stronger teams has suggested that we do, in fact, need both kinds of receivers.

 

[Jamesw]

Heh!

A couple of years ago, there was a huge ongoing debate about receivers that created separation... a large number of the brothers went on and on about how the Dolphins lacked guys who could do this... and argued that Tua REALLY needed guys who could separate and he would 'throw them open'.

This went on for months... we had some SERIOUS fights over whether guys like Waddle would be #1 WRs... others preferred guys like Megatron or Moss... large powerful receivers who might not get as open, but were better bets to dominate.

Since that time, we've moved from a team that lacked separation guys to a team that only has these smallish receivers...

I've always preferred the dominate X receivers, but said you needed both. ...and I think our struggles in tight games vs. stronger teams has suggested that we do, in fact, need both kinds of receivers.

Would you trade Hill for Chase? It won’t happen, but in theory.

 

[Feverdream]

Would you trade Hill for Chase? It won’t happen, but in theory.

In a heartbeat... but only because of his age.

In a right now situation, Hill is better.

Funny that you mention Chase. While all that was going on, the board was almost universally in favour of drafting... the 'Slim Reaper'... some openly scoffed at Chase, and Waddle was... by far... the third choice.

That year, I said, "avoid all three and draft Amon Ra St. Brown in the third; he'll give you whatever Waddle or Smith will give you... at a much cheaper price.

I got that one right.